Tell me men...What is the truth?

[ThePhiant]

aahhhh
you are back to smoke and mirrors
and here I thought you scientist only believed in HARD evidence

Vouch for me? Vouch for me, you ask? Well, none, of course. If had ever found one to vouch for me, I wouldn't have needed the many others who wouldn't vouch for me. I think this is self-evident. I'm surprised that you needed to ask.

[decterlove]

It's possible, but even he doesn't like women that silly. Hard to swallow when they're always joking around so much. I honestly think she totally transcended time and space by her total commitment to Transcendental Chuckling. It's a scary path though...I don't think I'm capable of that level of commitment to always be searching for new material. Not to mention the need to shop for stylish clothing in smaller and ever smaller sizes. My suspicion is that she was probably totally stark naked when she finally left the physical plane.

Now I'm looking for a woman who's never, ever, even once giggled in her whole life. Know any hot babes that can keep a totally straight face through an onslaught of new Polish jokes?

did your snake get to her??? (no pun intended LOL)

[mykil]

Now I'm looking for a woman who's never, ever, even once giggled in her whole life. Know any hot babes that can keep a totally straight face through an onslaught of new Polish jokes?

Oh my, this is almost too good to pass up, but I won't!!! LOL!!! There definitely was a good joke in three somewhere!

Oh yeah; the lovely Lorrie is in Oklahoma for another week so she should be amazed by all the replies in her box on her return!!

[ThePhiant]

it is my understanding that Willie HumpHump has soooooooooooooooo many women knocking on his door that I am sure he can share one with you.
she might have bugs all over her though...............

Now I'm looking for a woman who's never, ever, even once giggled in her whole life. Know any hot babes that can keep a totally straight face through an onslaught of new Polish jokes?

[ThePhiant]

Mykil
this is not the censored section,
please behave

she should be amazed by all the replies in her box

[decterlove]

I think Willie's on to something to tell ya the truth. I'm going to try and move over to his neighborhood and get some of the action. Maybe hang out by the mailbox. Damn the bugs, Robin....full speed ahead!

it is my understanding that Willie HumpHump has soooooooooooooooo many women knocking on his door that I am sure he can share one with you.
she might have bugs all over her though...............

[Willie Lumplump]

aahhhh
you are back to smoke and mirrors
and here I thought you scientist only believed in HARD evidence

I had more than enough hard evidence to go 'round until recent years, when advancing age compelled me to accept a certain softness. I mourn the loss, but each age has its own losses and compensations.

[mykil]

Willie, if you are worried about the effects of Viagra, don't be!!!! the worst that can hapen, is it will kill you!!!

[Willie Lumplump]

Willie, if you are worried about the effects of Viagra, don't be!!!! the worst that can hapen, is it will kill you!!!

I face death unafraid.

[fluteman]

Thank you for this post, Clancy. I've been forced to ignore most of what's been discussed here (especially the recent drivel), but this certainly hit home for me.

I once told one of my martial arts teachers some years back that due to my highly misunderstood views on romance, relationships and life in general that I must have been born in the wrong century. For whatever reason, most of my beliefs were seemingly old-fashioned and outdated, leaving me as an obscure and undesirable enigma to the opposite sex. His reply, however, was that I was "perhaps born too early", rather than "too late"...

It gives me hope, sometimes.

Not only satire, but violence, isolation and a whole host of other undesirable traits that will never be changed until women start rewarding men for being cooperative rather than competitive.

When a man who makes 30k a year teaching first grade is more attractive to most women than a lawyer who makes 300k a year arguing for a living, we'll see some major changes in the male behaviors we all know need changing.

[Willie Lumplump]

Thank you for this post, Clancy. I've been forced to ignore most of what's been discussed here (especially the recent drivel), but this certainly hit home for me.

I once told one of my martial arts teachers some years back that due to my highly misunderstood views on romance, relationships and life in general that I must have been born in the wrong century. For whatever reason, most of my beliefs were seemingly old-fashioned and outdated, leaving me as an obscure and undesirable enigma to the opposite sex. His reply, however, was that I was "perhaps born too early", rather than "too late"...

It gives me hope, sometimes.

Ah, at last a contribution of substance! Light-hearted banter can be such a tedious affair, and, even worse, modern.

If I may suggest, Oh Player of Flutes, there are certain ways of relating that have currency in any age. Empathy doesn't come and go out of style. Neither does compassion. Neither does a sincere interest in other people, nor a willingness to share from one's heart, nor a sense of when the time is right for light banter versus serious discussion. A man who cultivates these qualities in himself will never lack for female companionship and will always eventually find love. Also, if I may be so bold as to volunteer an opinion, a martial arts instructor is not necessarily the first person from whom to seek insight into matters of the heart. In fact, I find that the greatest experts on this subject usually are women, women who themselves display the high qualities to which a man aspires. But maybe that's just me.

[Mallory]

In general, this collection of posts are rather horrifying. There seem to be a few of you here who might want to find out why you hate women so much...or should the word be "contempt?"

:::waves to Braggi who ISN'T included above::::fempirate:

[mykil]

Wow First LULU tells me I hate my mother cause I can’t settle down, and now this! I didn't realize wanting to spank a variety of woman made me a woman hater. And wanting to date till I found the right one meant that I was a woman hater also. Who would have thunk it??? I guess I will be that FREE therapy after all LULU please email me and we can begin our sessions again!!!!

I did go out with a man haters a few nights ago, it was all bad. She was really cute, I asked her out, and she said no, she had a boyfriend. I went on with my business, she walked over with a piece of paper and pencil, asked for my number and called me that very evening. WE went out the next day. I asked about her boytoy and got a “he had sex with another woman, I am not sure what I am going to do” ruse. OK! WE went to eat wound up at the beach and I continued to play with her we had allot of fun till we were done. THEN she became an evil man hater, I decided she was before we even went out but thought I would give her a chance to open herself up to me. She decided it was my entire fault that we went that far and how could I possibly take advantage of her and the situation. And that she was going back to her boytoy. All of this was in less than about ten minutes. Which is what I pretty much expected, it was a grudge f… LMAO so I let her have her way with me and I suffered the consequences! NO wonder why I am a woman hater!!! LULU can you fix me?????

In general, this collection of posts are rather horrifying. There seem to be a few of you here who might want to find out why you hate women so much...or should the word be "contempt?"

:::waves to Braggi who ISN'T included above::::fempirate:

[ThePhiant]

I thought you were going to leave our little affair private.
Mykil do you have to process EVERYTHING in public?

Wow First LULU tells me I hate my mother cause I can’t settle down, and now this! ...

[Willie Lumplump]

In general, this collection of posts are rather horrifying. There seem to be a few of you here who might want to find out why you hate women so much...or should the word be "contempt?"

"In general" and "a few of you" strike me as very safe comments because nobody can be sure exactly what or whom you're talking about. If you want to denounce what you see as woman hating, I hope that you'll find the courage to stand up and speak out.

[Willie Lumplump]

I did go out with a man haters a few nights ago, it was all bad. She was really cute, I asked her out, and she said no, she had a boyfriend. I went on with my business, she walked over with a piece of paper and pencil, asked for my number and called me that very evening. WE went out the next day. I asked about her boytoy and got a “he had sex with another woman, I am not sure what I am going to do” ruse. OK! WE went to eat wound up at the beach and I continued to play with her we had allot of fun till we were done. THEN she became an evil man hater, I decided she was before we even went out but thought I would give her a chance to open herself up to me. She decided it was my entire fault that we went that far and how could I possibly take advantage of her and the situation. And that she was going back to her boytoy. All of this was in less than about ten minutes. Which is what I pretty much expected, it was a grudge f… LMAO so I let her have her way with me and I suffered the consequences! NO wonder why I am a woman hater!!! LULU can you fix me?????

Congratulations, Mykill, you've had a textbook encounter with a rapo artist. Rapo is a game (a technical term used in transactional analysis) described by Eric Berne in his book "Games People Play." You might want to read that to protect yourself in the future. What you experienced was rapo "light," but there are heavier versions that are much more dangerous.

[ThePhiant]

LULU can you fix me?????

YES, of course I can
but why would you want to?

[Mallory]

"In general" and "a few of you" strike me as very safe comments because nobody can be sure exactly what or whom you're talking about. If you want to denounce what you see as woman hating, I hope that you'll find the courage to stand up and speak out.

What does writing indicate about the writer?

Here are a "few" of the things I noted while reading this thread:

Which of these do YOU consider female positive?

1. A man will ask a woman out for many reasons, usually for sex [at least legit but still objectifying]

2. I have also known unattractive women that had throngs of men constantly around them. It was because they were red hot mamas, and they knew it at their core. They oozed sensuality, and the universe responded accordingly. [more objectifying]

3. I don't have a thing for "skinny" gals, her size doesn't matter much to me and I like woman of many sizes, though I doubt I would ask out a gal who was very over weight [contradictory]

4. I was seated next to this uglier than hell, fat-assed "woman" she was so calm she wouldn't move an inch, it was all stuffed in her chair she was very much into sharing, not only did she share her hairy armpit with me, she constantly tried to offer me some of her blubber while moving her arms she didn't let those little farts get to her either, just everybody around her was gasping for air. [quite mean descriptives - hateful]

5. That is not what attracted me to her, I think it was more of that blonde/blue thing she had going on. The wit was 24/7 though and this did make it entertaining, yet she just wasn’t the greatest in bed, and I do love my bed! Believe me I will ask you out, just be prepared to be exceptional in the bedroom or I will move on… [more objectification]

6. ...I think that men's preoccupation with competition, status, and prestige predisposes them to satire... Not only satire, but violence, isolation and a whole host of other undesirable traits that will never be changed until women start rewarding men for being cooperative rather than competitive. [suggests women are responsible for how men think about and act toward them]

7. When a man who makes 30k a year teaching first grade is more attractive to most women than a lawyer who makes 300k a year arguing for a living, we'll see some major changes in the male behaviors we all know need changing. [suggests women are responsible for how men think about and act toward them]

8. I did go out with a man haters a few nights ago, it was all bad. She was really cute, I asked her out, and she said no, she had a boyfriend. I went on with my business, she walked over with a piece of paper and pencil, asked for my number and called me that very evening. WE went out the next day. I asked about her boytoy and got a “he had sex with another woman, I am not sure what I am going to do” ruse. OK! WE went to eat wound up at the beach and I continued to play with her we had allot of fun till we were done. THEN she became an evil man hater, I decided she was before we even went out but thought I would give her a chance to open herself up to me. She decided it was my entire fault that we went that far and how could I possibly take advantage of her and the situation. And that she was going back to her boytoy. All of this was in less than about ten minutes. Which is what I pretty much expected, it was a grudge f… [contemptuous and objectifying]

Keep in mind: These are the stories and comments you are choosing to share with the women and other men reading this thread. Of all of the things you 'could' have posted to indicate what aspects of a woman are attractive to you - why did you select these specific stories to post? This thread was started by a woman so consider what it suggests when this becomes your first and intentional response to a woman asking about attraction.

Mallory

[scorpiomoon]

Can women respond to this question as well? What attracts me to women is intelligence and balance. What attracts me to men is purely chemical. It's a coded message on a DNA strand, and is obvious to me almost instantly if I am paying attention. So if the chemistry is there I don't care about much else at first anyway!!

[Native Fine Eyes]

Exactly what attracts a man to a woman and makes him
want to ask her out?

Is it true the men are not really attracted to skinny women?

Have some fun guys, but be honest.

I haven't asked a woman "out" for a very long time. I ask her "in". There is no static formula , rno recipe or shopping list, no instruction manual or hard and fast guidline but this.....are we enjoying eachother. That is why i have sat for days at a time watching for someone interesting, in crowded places, walked thousands of miles seeking Her. There is a little bit of He that she dreams of in me. i see that when we are talking for the two or three minutes before she has to make that appointment or lunch or festival or ...whatever it is that's more important than this moment, the only one we might ever share. I lived here for eons before going out (and in0 to explore some other real estate. Coming back to what's left of my family and seeing what has happened to this area, I am more than a little disappointed. We used to go a little slower than in the bay area here, now SF is good for a rest. We used to have some reverence and respect for open space, growing food, dancing too rambunctiously, and being regionally identitied. Now people everywhere let their incoomes and jobs dictate who they are dangerously close to the lowest common denominator. As the property values have soared, so has paranioa, police atrocities, drug use and ultimate sin...waste. Folks who have homes hide inside them rather than enjoy the company of others a little further down the food chain for now. I say hello in the street and there's a 50/50 chance of being acknowledged or ignored.

What attracts me? Foreplay. That is the same as for She-Of-2-Hearts (A woman in Native Lore) ...communication, sharing of ideas and passions, dreams and goals and desires and beliefs. I am a thin man now after years spent as a pachederm. Skinny, not, somewhere between...living isn't a jeans commercial but if you are too ...anything it sygnifies a problem somewhere. Being very selective, I choose which problem are livable now. being helpful, I choose who it is I am able to help feel better about herself.And I am believing that when a man's response to this simple question immediately turns to sexual matters, he might not be paying attention.
That is sad and sinful (i.e. wasteful) for you are a gift, the only gift worth fighting for She-Of-2-Hearts. Yuor voice can be litened to as music or as noise. Yhis one chooses music. your thoughts can be viewed as inspiration or distraction. This one chooses inspiration. your entire self can be taken in as a fiesta or as the ball and chain. I choose Fiesta including the parade that precedes it, the fireworks and breakfast before cleaning up the next day. I thank all of you She's , for being born.
It might be a bit monotonous if we all were the same sized cookie, Cookie.

Steven*Native Fine Eyes*W.

[Willie Lumplump]

Which of these do YOU consider female positive?

1. A man will ask a woman out for many reasons, usually for sex [at least legit but still objectifying]

2. I have also known unattractive women that had throngs of men constantly around them. It was because they were red hot mamas, and they knew it at their core. They oozed sensuality, and the universe responded accordingly. [more objectifying]

3. I don't have a thing for "skinny" gals, her size doesn't matter much to me and I like woman of many sizes, though I doubt I would ask out a gal who was very over weight [contradictory]

4. I was seated next to this uglier than hell, fat-assed "woman" she was so calm she wouldn't move an inch, it was all stuffed in her chair she was very much into sharing, not only did she share her hairy armpit with me, she constantly tried to offer me some of her blubber while moving her arms she didn't let those little farts get to her either, just everybody around her was gasping for air. [quite mean descriptives - hateful]

5. That is not what attracted me to her, I think it was more of that blonde/blue thing she had going on. The wit was 24/7 though and this did make it entertaining, yet she just wasn’t the greatest in bed, and I do love my bed! Believe me I will ask you out, just be prepared to be exceptional in the bedroom or I will move on… [more objectification]

6. ...I think that men's preoccupation with competition, status, and prestige predisposes them to satire... Not only satire, but violence, isolation and a whole host of other undesirable traits that will never be changed until women start rewarding men for being cooperative rather than competitive. [suggests women are responsible for how men think about and act toward them]

7. When a man who makes 30k a year teaching first grade is more attractive to most women than a lawyer who makes 300k a year arguing for a living, we'll see some major changes in the male behaviors we all know need changing. [suggests women are responsible for how men think about and act toward them]

8. I did go out with a man haters a few nights ago, it was all bad. She was really cute, I asked her out, and she said no, she had a boyfriend. I went on with my business, she walked over with a piece of paper and pencil, asked for my number and called me that very evening. WE went out the next day. I asked about her boytoy and got a “he had sex with another woman, I am not sure what I am going to do” ruse. OK! WE went to eat wound up at the beach and I continued to play with her we had allot of fun till we were done. THEN she became an evil man hater, I decided she was before we even went out but thought I would give her a chance to open herself up to me. She decided it was my entire fault that we went that far and how could I possibly take advantage of her and the situation. And that she was going back to her boytoy. All of this was in less than about ten minutes. Which is what I pretty much expected, it was a grudge f… [contemptuous and objectifying]

Keep in mind: These are the stories and comments you are choosing to share with the women and other men reading this thread. Of all of the things you 'could' have posted to indicate what aspects of a woman are attractive to you - why did you select these specific stories to post? This thread was started by a woman so consider what it suggests when this becomes your first and intentional response to a woman asking about attraction.

Mallory

I understand your point, and I agree that we all will be better off when men learn to appreciate women's higher qualities. Nevertheless, I don't know what purpose it serves to be "appalled" when men display attitudes and behaviors that evolved over millions of years. The more enlightened of us strive to create positive cultural overlays for primitive instincts that are hard-wired into the male brain. We should also be aware that females have their own primitive instincts that need to be overcome. (For good evolutionary reasons, women generally are much more attracted to men who display material wealth, see your quote #7.) Your quote #4 seems irrelevant to me since it displays a pure meanness of spirit that is unrelated to the man/woman issue. Your quote #8 describes a woman who succeeds in engaging a man in the game of rapo (pronounced "ray-poe"), so your complaint that he was "contemptuous and objectifying" seems to miss the point entirely.

[mykil]

Mallory; obviously you are the sort of woman that uses information against a man whenever you tend to get into an argument. This is the sort of woman I try to avoid with all due respect. If we can't be open than what is the point? Openness is all I am about, honesty and surly even telling nothing but the truth! Your mid level physiology skills are important in everyday life
I am sure. Just not the kind I would pay money to listen to or even adhere to in the least bit. If I for one wanted To listen to a psychologist it would be my LULU!!! She is never wrong and alwayz has a really sarcastic way of bringing me around! LOL! AS far as being attracted to CUTE, I really don’t see the harm it this nor do I see me exposing myself here on wacco a big threat to my well being, this is what it is all about as I see it, one consciousness, one soul, oneness all the way! We are supposed to be evolving as a team, not one on one. So the only way to acquire this is to put it all out there and really tell each other what we really fell, soooo even if I disagree with what you have to say please continue and have a good time belittling us men! Or whomever you choose! Peace love and friggin granola darling!!! LMAO

What does writing indicate about the writer?

Here are a "few" of the things I noted while reading this thread:...

[Mallory]

The conversation you curiously find so appalling came out of the question 'Exactly what attracts a man to a woman and makes him want to ask her out?'

We are biological creatures, shaped by billions of years of evolution. I think you are confusing the way you wish the world were, with the way it actually is.

I've actually found these comments sad and symbolic of typical cultural violence toward women. We may be biological creatures but we are not 'solely' biological in our responses to any stimulation - humans do have higher brain function and it wasn't 'simply' biology that crafted the messages posted here, it was a union of these two aspects and more. Do I wish a message board titled 'conscious' relationships would display a bit more 'consciousness'? Yes.

Merriam Webster defines consciousness like this: perceiving, apprehending, or noticing with a degree of controlled thought or observation : sharing another's knowledge or awareness of an inward state or outward fact : personally felt : capable of or marked by thought, will, design, or perception

Try comparing the message texts to this concept - were they conscious answers? Again, extend this to include the knowledge that women would read the messages and that these particular messages were intentional and there are undertow messages here that go beyond unkind into power mechanics and behaviors.

Are 'notch-on-the-penis' motivations "conscious"?

Mallory :communication:

[Becky]

You guys crack me up with so many different opinions there are bound to be disagreements. I just love how you all look at others so differently.

It makes me sad that most women are much more attracted to tall successful men than poor short ones.

what about the tall unsuccessful and short successful ones?....don't want to leave anyone out.

[Mallory]

It makes me sad that most women are much more attracted to tall successful men than poor short ones.

Quote:

Mallory wrote:
I've actually found these comments sad and symbolic of typical cultural violence toward women...

Hi Clancy,

Recent studies are beginning to reflect changes in some long held ideas around attraction: https://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2...y.genderissues
https://www.syl.com/singles/datingstatistics.html
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/chris...n_b_59431.html

In addition:

According to a 2006 Harris Interactive study, 71 percent of high-earning or graduate-educated men said a woman’s career or educational success makes her more desirable as a wife, 68 percent report that smart women make better mothers, and 90 percent of high-achieving men say they want to marry—or are already married to—a woman who is as or more intelligent than they are.

Women with college degrees, professional jobs, and higher incomes reported a significantly higher rate of orgasms than other women. This confirms a 1999 report by the reputable Journal of the American Medical Association: Women without high-school diplomas were nearly twice as likely to experience low sexual desire when compared with college-graduate women.

https://www.umich.edu/%7Eurecord/0405/Dec13_04/10.shtml
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/81392.php

I am aware I am including articles from both perspectives. In my observation men and women are interacting, dating, and marrying regardless of finances or fidelity issues or height or weight.

https://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/21/w...9e70cdfec&ei=5

From a purely female perspective - it is easy enough to get a man's attention by waving sexuality at them - it is far harder to find men who can enjoy and engage in an interesting conversation. That 'cuteness' in my opinion is a very temporary biological umph - eventually they have to talk. ...not much to say to a vibrator.

Mallory

[ThePhiant]

From a purely female perspective - it is easy enough to get a man's attention by waving sexuality at them - it is far harder to find men who can enjoy and engage in an interesting conversation. That 'cuteness' in my opinion is a very temporary biological umph - eventually they have to talk. ...not much to say to a vibrator.

Mallory

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
YOU GO GIRL!!!
LET'S PUT DOWN THOSE SUCKERS IN PUBLIC!!!!!
MEN DON'T KNOW HOW TO DEFEND THEMSELVES AGAINST A CLASSY OR WAS IT SASSY GAL LIKE YOU
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
LMFAO

[ThePhiant]

From a purely female perspective - it is easy enough to get a man's attention by waving sexuality at them - it is far harder to find men who can enjoy and engage in an interesting conversation. That 'cuteness' in my opinion is a very temporary biological umph - eventually they have to talk. ...not much to say to a vibrator.

Mallory

on second thought, I am quite frankly getting tired of male bashing, whining women.
Mallory your male-phobic, stereotypical platitudes of a man leads me to believe that you never get out the door.
Are you describing your father, your brother or your uncle in your diatribe?

the only sensitivity women can come up with here on Wacco is to let everybody know that somebody else (usually The Phiant) has hurt their feelings by telling the truth they don't want to hear. boohooohooooooooo
the only person who REALLY is willing to be sensitive is Mykil, AND HE IS A MALE and willing to prove it!!!
he may be circumsized, but at least he has got the balls to make a fool out of himself, to show some humanity in exposing himself. he writes about things that happen to him, and how he wonders how it all fits in the big scheme of things. yeah He can't spell, doesn't quote scientist, but he does talk about REAL things, instead of platitudes.
we laugh at him, make fun of him
and STILL he gets up every day with a smile on his face
HOW IS THAT FOR A MEANINGFUL CONVERSATION!!!!
can you name one woman like that???

[Willie Lumplump]

It makes me sad that most women are much more attracted to tall successful men than poor short ones.

Another example of a way in which women need to overcome their biology-based inclinations and develop the kind of higher consciousness that Mallory is talking about.

[Willie Lumplump]

Again, extend this to include the knowledge that women would read the messages and that these particular messages were intentional and there are undertow messages here that go beyond unkind into power mechanics and behaviors.Mallory.

But that's exactly the point, isn't it? Why "power mechanics and behaviors"? Where do these ideas come from? Do men just make them up because they enjoy them? If they do, whey do they enjoy this particular kind of mechanics and behaviours rather than some other kind of mechanics and behaviors? You give the impression of an agonized woman shaking her fist at the heavens and complaining that life isn't fair or as good as is should be. Well, sure. But if you want to do something about the problem, isn't the first step to understand the nature of the problem? Don't you need to know and accept exactly what you're up against? You seem to rail against this basic factual understanding and want to jump directly to shaking your finger under our (men's) noses. I agree with your basic point, I just think that you're approaching it unrealistically.

[Willie Lumplump]

hmmmmn... a cursory glance at any personals listing service in the country suggests that finances, fidelity, height and weight are VERY important to many if not most people.

I've had contact with many, many women over a long period of (involuntary) bachelorhood . . . women in Texas, Maryland, Massachusetts, and California. I've met these women in a wide variety of ways--through friends, internet dating services, self-help groups, cold contacts in grocery stores and on the street, etc. And I can tell you that financial security and/or physical appearance (mainly height) were extremely important to a large majority. I've had the experience of seeing life from on top, where I am now, and from the bottom where I was for years at a time. It would take a lot to convince me that conclusions based on this large amount of accumulated experience are wrong.