A Concern (NSA Spying)

[american dream]

We are all very concerned with Mister Carillo's breeches, er, breaches, but the true elephant in the room, the big villain to me, is the NSA, which seems to be Hell-bent on establishing a Big Brother-type empire of fear and hyper-control. Do we even dare discuss it on this forum? Whaddya think, Barry?

[arthunter]

Even your reluctance to discuss this points to my concern for this country ... why not discuss it? ... supposedly all branches of government are here to serve the American people ... if that is no longer the case then we have a big problem and a response is necessary ...

We are all very concerned with Mister Carillo's breeches, er, breaches, but the true elephant in the room, the big villain to me, is the NSA, which seems to be Hell-bent on establishing a Big Brother-type empire of fear and hyper-control. Do we even dare discuss it on this forum? Whaddya think, Barry?

[arthunter]

Right after I wrote this, I came across this on FaceBook ... don't know if the link will work since it's on FB so I'll paste it in ...

The Rutherford Institute


James Madison, who was one of the primary drafters of our Constitution, once warned that we should take alarm at the first experiment with our liberties. He also warned that “the essence of Government is power; and power, lodged as it must be in human hands, will ever be liable to abuse.” To our detriment, we have failed to heed Madison’s warning. As a result, we now find ourselves operating in a strange paradigm where the government not only views the citizenry as suspects but treats them as suspects, as well. Thus, the news that the NSA is routinely operating outside of the law and overstepping its legal authority by carrying out surveillance on American citizens is not really much of a surprise. This is what happens when you give the government broad powers and allow government agencies to routinely sidestep the Constitution.

Indeed, as I document in my book, "A Government of Wolves: The Emerging American Police State," these newly revealed privacy violations by the NSA are just the tip of the iceberg. Consider that the government’s Utah Data Center, the central hub of the National Security Agency’s vast spying infrastructure, will be a clearinghouse and a depository for every imaginable kind of information—whether innocent or not, private or public—including communications, transactions and the like. Anything and everything you’ve ever said or done, from the trivial to the damning—phone calls, Facebook posts, Twitter tweets, Google searches, emails, bookstore and grocery purchases, bank statements, commuter toll records, etc.—will be tracked, collected, catalogued and analyzed by the UDC’s supercomputers and teams of government agents. In this way, by sifting through the detritus of your once-private life, the government will come to its own conclusions about who you are, where you fit in, and how best to deal with you should the need arise. As the central depository for all of the information gathered by the NSA’s vast spy centers, the UDC’s supercomputers will be capable of downloading data amounting to the entire contents of the Library of Congress every six hours.

In this way, we are all becoming data collected in government files. Whether or not the surveillance is undertaken for "innocent" reasons, surveillance of all citizens, even the innocent sort, gradually poisons the soul of a nation. Surveillance limits personal options—denies freedom of choice—and increases the powers of those who are in a position to enjoy the fruits of this activity.

If this is the new “normal” in the United States, it is not friendly to freedom. Frankly, we are long past the point where we should be merely alarmed. These are no longer experiments on our freedoms. These are acts of aggression.--John W. Whitehead, president of The Rutherford Institute and author of "A Government of Wolves: The Emerging American Police State"

Even your reluctance to discuss this points to my concern for this country ... why not discuss it? ... supposedly all branches of government are here to serve the American people ... if that is no longer the case then we have a big problem and a response is necessary ...

[american dream]

Even your reluctance to discuss this points to my concern for this country ... why not discuss it? ... supposedly all branches of government are here to serve the American people ... if that is no longer the case then we have a big problem and a response is necessary ...

I agree; it is. Much of what's good has come from willingness to speak truth to power. You may already know that Norman Soloman presented a petition of over 100,000 names in Oslo, suggesting that Bradley Manning get the Nobel Peace Prize.

[Dixon]

Daniel Ellsberg leaked secret papers (the "Pentagon Papers") with the help of major newspapers, avoided jail, and is widely regarded as a national hero. Bradley Manning and now Edward Snowden did something similar, and have been vilified in the press and criminalized by the government (and, in Manning's case, tortured). This in itself is a barometer of how far down Fascism Road the USA has traveled. Support Manning and Snowden and other whistleblowers!!!

[arthunter]

One or two brave whistle-blowers will be annihilated given the current political climate ... we need many people to come forward so that the burden of exposure is shared ... as Einstein said "The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything" ...

There are signs of this happening around the world ... In Brazil the Military Police sat down with protesters ... a wonderful moment that gave hope to the world ...

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/20/police-join-protesters-brazil_n_3474354.html

And there are members of our own military beginning to show signs of rebellion ...

https://www.educateinspirechange.org/2013/08/us-soldiers-expose-corrupt-government.html

The atrocities of the world depend on many people following orders .... following orders to spy, harass, torture, and kill other human beings ... we desperately need more heroes to step forward to say "enough" ...

In the meantime there's this ...

https://act.credoaction.com/sign/repeal_patriot_act/?sp_ref=8046466.4.418.f.1716.3&referring_akid=.6731716.Y6q0nm&source=fb_share_sp

I don't know if petitions are an effective tool, but here's another one ...

https://petitions.moveon.org/sign/fi...fb&r_by=405769

Daniel Ellsberg leaked secret papers (the "Pentagon Papers") with the help of major newspapers, avoided jail, and is widely regarded as a national hero. Bradley Manning and now Edward Snowden did something similar, and have been vilified in the press and criminalized by the government (and, in Manning's case, tortured). This in itself is a barometer of how far down Fascism Road the USA has traveled. Support Manning and Snowden and other whistleblowers!!!

[arthunter]

This just in ... it's as bad as we thought ... regarding the NSA spying, there is no oversight, no protection from abuse, anyone can be spied upon and targeted for any reason and there are no safeguards in place ... for those of you assisting the government with these programs, please do keep this in mind ... the potential for corruption is huge ... this is outrageous ...

https://www.thedailysheeple.com/nsa-...-fallen_082013

[Barry]

We are all very concerned with Mister Carillo's breeches, er, breaches, but the true elephant in the room, the big villain to me, is the NSA, which seems to be Hell-bent on establishing a Big Brother-type empire of fear and hyper-control. Do we even dare discuss it on this forum? Whaddya think, Barry?

I don't see any problem about discussing this here. It's not as if we are learning how to make a bomb or nerve gas, or poisoning the water supply, or assassinating the president, or anything (Hi NSA guys! Made you look! )
I'm not entirely against the NSA spying. I'm glad the current scope of it and the extent, or lack there of that the guidelines are being followed has come to light so some more safeguards can be put into place. I'm not that uncomfortable with it while Obama is in charge, but it could easily be abused by the next guy/gal.

Maintaining a peaceful society is not easy given the violent threats both internally and internationally. I'm rather amazed that there hasn't been more mayhem since 9/11.