sebastopol police. friend or foe?

[Connubial Warthog]

I am sympathetic, as I was hassled when I was a teen in NJ. I grew up in a small town with no understanding of what long hair was about; they assumed being hippies, we must be up to no good. Also, I have witnessed Sebastopol police harassing teens on several occasions. The last time it was in front of the 7/11 in at Pleasant Hill and Bodega. For no reason I could see, they started questioning these kids on a Saturday afternoon. They ID'd them and gave them the 3rd degree when all they seemed to be doing was eating ice cream bars and hanging out. I had time to observe their interactions and the police were not kind or patient with these kids. If that's at all representative of how cops treat teens in town, no wonder they have lost respect and trust for these officers.

Sebastopol police are known for being some of the worst in the County. A lot of people on here saying they aren't bad aren't driving through Town past 10pm at night. Tonight....

[photolite]

It's dangerous to assume. The operative phrases, as I see them, in this post are, "I am sympathetic, as I was hassled when I was a teen in NJ." and "For no reason I could see".

I am sympathetic, as I was hassled when I was a teen in NJ. I grew up in a small town with no understanding of what long hair was about; they assumed being hippies, we must be up to no good. Also, I have witnessed Sebastopol police harassing teens on several occasions. The last time it was in front of the 7/11 in at Pleasant Hill and Bodega. For no reason I could see, they started questioning these kids on a Saturday afternoon. They ID'd them and gave them the 3rd degree when all they seemed to be doing was eating ice cream bars and hanging out. I had time to observe their interactions and the police were not kind or patient with these kids. If that's at all representative of how cops treat teens in town, no wonder they have lost respect and trust for these officers.

[Connubial Warthog]

I watched the whole thing go down in this case. These kids literally did nothing to provoke this officer to grill them- they were not acting suspiciously or being boisterous. I watched him approach and ask for their IDs, asking what they were doing there and where they were going. The cop may have been looking for ice cream wielding suspects, so you're right in that respect: I don't know all the circumstances leading up to speaking with these kids. They looked quite dangerous as they were armed with ice cream bars. One had a rather lethal looking slurpy. I was being sympathetic with the kid in that post because I believe he Is in fact being stopped because of being guilty of being young. If you don't think that ever happens, you sir are being naive.

It's dangerous to assume. The operative phrases, as I see them, in this post are, "I am sympathetic, as I was hassled when I was a teen in NJ." and "For no reason I could see".

[Mary C]

As another former Child Protective Services social worker who dealt extensively with the Sebastopol Police Dept, I second Bruce's sentiments very strongly. That's not to take away from others who have had vastly different experiences, but just to serve as a counter-point and provide a different view.

Another point of view, for what it is worth: At the risk of being attacked by those with differing ideas; I worked as a social worker for 20 years for Child Protective Services, and have spoken with Jeff Weaver and other members of his force on many occasions, officially and unofficially. I got calls at 3 AM to meet them at a home where a father and mother were fighting while under the influence of drugs and alcohol and their many children were scared to death, especially when one of the parents had a weapon. The police department officers have to walk into these situations cold and sort things out, keeping the children, the parents, the neighbors and themselves safe. In fact, one of those officers used to be a foster parent as well. I also had a son who as a teen went to school at Analy and did those things teens do.

In the past I have had my own issues with law enforcement and learned a lot by face to face contact and seeking to open my understanding. For all those with negative opinions about the Sebastopol Police Department, I encourage you to talk to them, the officers and Chief Weaver. The Sebastopol Police Department are an observant vigilant force, and many citizens of Sebastopol feel safer as a result. As Mary observed, there are good and bad in all places. In the meantime, you are welcome to your opinion of the police department but until you have talked to them or worked with them, your opinion is based on your feelings and thereby personal, and possibly ill formed and incomplete. And that is just my opinion...
Bruce Schmidt

[Tom95472]

I too have appreciated opportunity to talk to Chief Weaver (at club meetings and CERT classes-meetings) and several of his officers and find them all very service oriented professionals.
(Yes, I have been briefly stopped (for driving too slow) while driving to PO as a break from late work. Really not a problem to me.)
I feel that it takes great skill and training to approach an unknown suspicious person at Oh-Dark-Thirty in such a way that nobody gets hurt.
I like the idea of vigilance and Police watching over town. Sebastopol PD is, by far, the best to make use of seasoned volunteers (many with decades of police work as sworn officers) to maintain a full force despite budget limitations.

[spam1]

What they are doing is pure harassment. All of what I've said it completely true, I'm not trying to make them look worse in anyway, I feel the truth needs to be told and I told it exactly how it happened.

The more laws, the less justice. We have reached a point where there are so many local, state and federal laws and, worst yet, regulations, that they make it likely we all, in our daily lives, commit numerous felonies and misdemeanors, often without intent or even without knowing. That is the danger of asking any government to manage every aspect of everyone's daily life.

So the cops know that they can find -something- to charge you with every time you pass through town. By the way, that's exactly the way things were in Feudal England and America before our revolution, and why so much of the constitution is intended to limit the role of government.

Remember that next time you choose to vote for a candidate that tells you how he's going to get even more laws passed to protect you.

References: https://www.threefeloniesaday.com/Yo...6/Default.aspx
https://www.homelandstupidity.us/200...-surveillance/

[Valley Oak]

Another point of view, for what it is worth: At the risk of being attacked by those with differing ideas; I worked as a social worker for 20 years for Child Protective Services, and have spoken with Jeff Weaver and other members of his force on many occasions, officially and unofficially. I got calls at 3 AM to meet them at a home where...

Bruce Schmidt

What astounds me is that many people use police conduct as an argument against gun control!
I don't get this argument at all and there are LOTS of people out there, and here in Wacco, who feel very strongly along these lines. It's a mystery to me. I find their attitude reprehensible. The police are our protectors. And yes, mistakes and abuses take place but these are things that can be addressed. To clarify, those unfortunate incidents and police misconduct do not justify vilifying the people who serve us and risk themselves in the process. What do those detractors do when they are in trouble? Call a criminal? I seriously doubt it.

Just look at this recent post on the Wacco forum:
https://www.waccobb.net/forums/showt...314#post163314

Here is just one of those types of posts here on Wacco:

Have you ever had a gun pointed directly at you by a police officer before Edward?

The sensationalism from that type of experience is much worst than that which you are attempting to provoke with your barrage of postings my friend. Trust me. But unfortunately, many people have had the privilege of not being oppressed, and therefore think that oppression doesn't actually exist.

I wish I had more heart to argue on these forums, because what is actually happening is another step in the pacification of a population through media (including social media) guided fear. Here is yet another example.

My response:

So if you had had an AK-47 at that moment you described, you could have defended yourself from this police officer you referred to by shooting him? Is that what you are saying?

Because the banning of Assault Rifles (ARs) is what is trying to be accomplished, not the banning of all guns, which you are at the very least implying. But a lot of folks, such as yourself, prefer to believe something else that is completely untrue: that the 'gummint' wants to take away ALL guns, which is an enormous and preposterous lie.

Try focusing on the fact, for just 60 seconds, that the legislation that has been debated recently because of the Sandy Hook massacre is about banning assault rifles, limiting magazine capacity, gun show loopholes, etc. Why do you insist that ALL guns are going to be taken away from you when this is clearly not true?

And please try answering the first question I have asked you. Would have you shot that police officer? Because it sounds like that is what you want to have a "right" to do. Do you even have a gun in the first place? I don't have a gun, never have, never will. No need.

On another note, I trust the police. Sure, there are plenty of examples of police abusing their authority but that doesn't mean that we all have to pack an AK-47 in every car and then murder the police officer who pulls us over, which is what most of the pro-gun rhetoric appears to be saying.

Issues regarding police conduct can be addressed by more comprehensive training of police cadets. A person who gets a Bachelor's degree in anything has to go through a lot of schooling. We should require the same training of our police officers.

If you want to make reference, for example, among others, that the police in Oakland caused brain damage to a combat veteran, that is a reasonable complaint. That can be dealt with through the passage of laws to control police conduct, not arming ourselves to the teeth and then, supposedly, going after those police and shooting them. This is a ludicrous fantasy that NEVER happens, despite the fact that the American public is already armed to the teeth with all kinds of weaponry. Yet, police abuses take place anyway. Your "strategy" of keeping the police under control through an armed citizenry does not work very well at all. If anything, it probably creates a lot more paranoia on the part of the police. Not a good thing.

So the reality is, we already have that society for which you are arguing for, an American public armed to the teeth so that the police won't do what they did to you. It doesn't work. We need laws, citizen participation, contacting your representative, going to city hall, writing the editor, proposing laws, federal grand juries, and many other activities that will correct police conduct so that these tragedies don't take place and to punish them when they do occur.

Furthermore, we should pay our police A LOT more money than what we are paying them now. They are prepared, everyday of their lives, to sacrifice themselves for you and me and a few bad apples do not justify your ridiculous and reprehensible attitude. Shame on you. You are an irresponsible and immature individual who is disconnected from reality and the truth, dependent on fantasies and stereotypes. You are not a part of the solution; you are a part of the problem, Johnny.

Edward

[rossmen]

personally i don't like to talk to weaver because in my experience he does not listen, especially to someone challenging the actions of the spd. he talks a lot, in a very defensive way, and you just have to listen, because he is the chief, and to interrupt or get emotional with a cop is stupid.

i would like to talk to him with a third party mediator but he has declined the invitation. he cites confidentiality.

there is a cost to society beyond the financial for police presence. like most things it is subject to the law of diminishing returns. does it really make sense for the spd to write more traffic citations than any other city in sonoma county including santa rosa? if you think so go live in a gated community.

despite my regular posts challenging weaver and his department, i also have a lot of regard for the spd. i just think they could do a lot better. unlike many police organizations they do have the time and resources. after years of experience volunteering as a teacher at the jail with the sheriffs department, i understand police culture and organization as very hierarchical, change would need to start with weaver. i wish he was more interested.

I too have appreciated opportunity to talk to Chief Weaver (at club meetings and CERT classes-meetings) and several of his officers and find them all very service oriented professionals.
(Yes, I have been briefly stopped (for driving too slow) while driving to PO as a break from late work. Really not a problem to me.)
I feel that it takes great skill and training to approach an unknown suspicious person at Oh-Dark-Thirty in such a way that nobody gets hurt.
I like the idea of vigilance and Police watching over town. Sebastopol PD is, by far, the best to make use of seasoned volunteers (many with decades of police work as sworn officers) to maintain a full force despite budget limitations.

[DVJ]

I'm so sorry to hear all this about recent encounters with the Sebastopol police. My memories are from ten years ago. Yes, they were strict with the speed limit (their job) but in other respects I always had gratitude for their attitude... stopped at a late night time with "Are you alright, Ma'am?" and "Just checking" ... no request for my license. Another time regarding a bit of a bump on another car, the policeman acted as if he were a mediator, calming the situation (no damage.) In short, they acted like small-town peacekeepers who knew the people driving around. Officers, what changed in your department?