Why I'm Voting "NO" on Prop 37

[rossmen]

believing that deception and dishonesty are never good is a trait of perfectionism, especially when the definition of this is less than full and complete information sharing. thanks for the info on trans-fat. you are right, i did not know all that you shared. i would still argue that this is a success for the example i shared, girl scout cookies. still not good for you, but perhaps slightly less deadly?

Hello Waccos,

This has certainly been an interesting discussion

[William Cote]

Aloha Laurel,

Passing a law in CA is NEVER perfect what with the climate we live in today... There will always be a "loophole" found whichwill not support every detail necessary to make it completely effective..... BUT it IS a START and that is why I am voting "YES" on Prop 37!!

Sincerely,

William Cote

[handy]

It seems to me that a poorly written, half-assed compromise is worse in the long run than no law at all. And the argument of perfectionism doesn't hold water. Without trying to be "perfect", we should still make some concerted effort to at least "get it right". Prop 37 fails miserably on most counts. I'll vote No.

[datars]

Whole Foods Hidden Camera GMO Sting - Organic Spies - CENSORED by YouTube

This video around 17 mins...is an undercover sting in wholefood stores...it test the knowledge of staff in regards to GMO content within the store...it was banned/removed from youtube on the 2nd oct 2012... it is mp4 format...it is important because of prop 37 in california...wholefoods has not contributed to the campaign to push prop 37...WHY? this is a little insight...enjoy

https://tv.naturalnews.com/v.asp?v=4...5A116C0A3469E3

[datars]

Whole Foods confirms it knowingly sells products containing Monsanto's genetically modified corn: Don't ask, don't tell!

https://www.naturalnews.com/037413_W...santo_GMO.html

[SusanShelley]

I am voting Yes on Prop 37.

It is unfortunate that you cannot see the big picture and now important it is to everyone's health that Prop 37 passes. This bill is the start of what will hopefully be a market in America which is actually open and free and in which all products that contain GMOs are labeled. To explain the very complex ins and outs of the proposition to most people who have no idea what an GMO even is nor have even heard of Monsanto would be overwhelming to say the least. I have been volunteering and talking to many people on the streets of LA and about 70% of people I talk to have never heard of either.

I find it really quite alarming, disturbing and sad that you have been so misinformed and you are spewing hatred towards this proposition. I hope you reconsider your opinions and think about the immense ramifications of your actions.

[alanora]

I am voting yes on the proposition, however I have sick feeling it is way too little way too late. Like shutting the barn door after the horse is out. Between the round-up resistant stuff that lacks nutrition and the stuff that manufactures pesticides that may then cause your gut to manufacture pesticides and the introduced genes that cause the body not to recognize or treat as toxins the modified food...all of which I imagine has cross pollinated every real food out there by now, it seems too late. Never mind the less than well animals consuming GMO feed who are then consumed by humans...........and the fact that no one can with certainty delineate unaffected foods......sorry to be pessimistic..we are sunk. IMHO. So this is how we use our own technology to do ourselves in.....

I am voting Yes on Prop 37.

It is unfortunate that you cannot see the big picture and now important it is to everyone's health that Prop 37 passes. This bill is the start of what will hopefully be a market in America which is actually open and free and in which all products that contain GMOs are labeled. To explain the very complex ins and outs of the proposition to most people who have no idea what an GMO even is nor have even heard of Monsanto would be overwhelming to say the least. I have been volunteering and talking to many people on the streets of LA and about 70% of people I talk to have never heard of either.

I find it really quite alarming, disturbing and sad that you have been so misinformed and you are spewing hatred towards this proposition. I hope you reconsider your opinions and think about the immense ramifications of your actions.

[datars]

GMO Ticking Time Bomb

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAL_AMdMXqY Part-1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx4Dud0othY Part-2
The first in an upcoming series of mini-documentary videos about GMOs, this Gary Null production delves into the reality of GMO health risks. Gary Null calls it a "GMO ticking time bomb."
This video reveals some of the health problems caused by GMOs, including infertility, accelerated aging, organ damage, immune malfunction and more.
Uploaded by NaturalNews.com with permission from Gary Null.
Senior Executive Producer, Writer, Director: Gary Null
Executive Producer / Co-Director: Richard Polonetsky
Producers: Paola Bossola, Richard Gale
Editors: Patrick Thompson, Richie Williamson
Camera Operators: L.A. Jones, Tarun Mathur, Greg Russ, Valerie Van Cleve, Richie Williamson
Special Thanks to: Dr. Joel Bakan, Dr. Shiv Chopra, GMO Free Zone, Institute for Responsible Technology, International Center for Technology Assessment, Lens Eye (India), Dr. Don Lotter, Mercola.com, Natural Solutions Foundation, Navdanya (India). Dr. Arpad Pusztai, T. Colin Campbell Foundation
Support YES on California Proposition 37 for Labeling GMOs
www.CARightToKnow.org
www.LabelGMOs.org
Learn More About the Science and Risks of GMO
www.ResponsibleTechnology.org
How to Avoid GMO Foods and Products
www.NonGMOShoppingGuide.com

[Berta]

Thank you so much for posting these videos. I've watched them, posted them on my Facebook and Twitter
pages and emailed the links to everyone I know. We must continue to get the word out about the dangers of GMO's in our foods......

GMO Ticking Time Bomb

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAL_AMdMXqY Part-1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx4Dud0othY Part-2
The first in an upcoming series of mini-documentary videos about GMOs, this Gary Null production delves into the reality of GMO health risks. Gary Null calls it a "GMO ticking time bomb."
This video reveals some of the health problems caused by GMOs, including infertility, accelerated aging, organ damage, immune malfunction and more.
Uploaded by NaturalNews.com with permission from Gary Null.
Senior Executive Producer, Writer, Director: Gary Null
Executive Producer / Co-Director: Richard Polonetsky
Producers: Paola Bossola, Richard Gale
Editors: Patrick Thompson, Richie Williamson
Camera Operators: L.A. Jones, Tarun Mathur, Greg Russ, Valerie Van Cleve, Richie Williamson
Special Thanks to: Dr. Joel Bakan, Dr. Shiv Chopra, GMO Free Zone, Institute for Responsible Technology, International Center for Technology Assessment, Lens Eye (India), Dr. Don Lotter, Mercola.com, Natural Solutions Foundation, Navdanya (India). Dr. Arpad Pusztai, T. Colin Campbell Foundation
Support YES on California Proposition 37 for Labeling GMOs
www.CARightToKnow.org
www.LabelGMOs.org
Learn More About the Science and Risks of GMO
www.ResponsibleTechnology.org
How to Avoid GMO Foods and Products
www.NonGMOShoppingGuide.com

[datars]

Good to hear Berta; I burn DVD's all the time and hand them out, just too the get the word out about all subject, that the mainstream media refuses to get out.

-Chuck

[bushin]

I am also voting yes, but I still have concern that we are even allowing GMO to happen. Is it that hard to fight Monsanto? It seems like the measure to read, "Genetically Engineered Foods, legal or not legal".

I am voting Yes on Prop 37.

It is unfortunate that you cannot see the big picture and now important it is to everyone's health that Prop 37 passes. This bill is the start of what will hopefully be a market in America which is actually open and free and in which all products that contain GMOs are labeled. To explain the very complex ins and outs of the proposition to most people who have no idea what an GMO even is nor have even heard of Monsanto would be overwhelming to say the least. I have been volunteering and talking to many people on the streets of LA and about 70% of people I talk to have never heard of either.

I find it really quite alarming, disturbing and sad that you have been so misinformed and you are spewing hatred towards this proposition. I hope you reconsider your opinions and think about the immense ramifications of your actions.

[traindays]

Whole Foods confirms it knowingly sells products containing Monsanto's genetically modified corn: Don't ask, don't tell!

https://www.naturalnews.com/037413_W...santo_GMO.html

What is sad is how far apart most citizens are from how our food is manufactured, and especially, how it is processed, and what it is processed with. I am no scientist, nor a nutritionist. Because of a disease, I have chosen to study diet and nutrition from books written by doctors with degrees in neurology, biochemestry, and nutrition. There is so much evidence that what we eat plays a primary role in the enormous chronic health diseases that only citizens in the United States suffer from - primarily - because we rely on processed foods.

Because we have to take classes, versus getting a degree...to really see and understand what has happened to our food supply in the past several decades...it is a challenge to get education as a lay person. I am absolutely convinced...as I know many others in our health conscious area...that only by mandating "transparancy" more and more in food packaging, will the average person start learning exactly what it is they are putting in their body, and start being able to make wiser choices.

We absolutely HAVE to start requiring the food we buy be labeled...and I hope this is only a first step. I also hope that someday we will have legislation similarly for what is in the household products we buy...from shampoo to mascara to laundry detergent - because they all have major impacts on our health and on the natural environment - I think we all kind of got at this point that the American lifestyle has had huge negative consequences.

Please vote YES on proposition 37 so everyone can take their own personal steps towards getting healthy. Knowledge is power.

[pnicholson]

what is sad is that the life forms on this planet are being poisoned and all we can come up with are demands that some of the poison be criminally-minimally labelled. could this fall under the heading: "normalizing the unthinkable"? we are being poisoned!!

to me this is what is terribly sad - not how far apart we are from food manufacture, but how far apart we are from our minds.

p

at the center of your being you have the answer; you know who you are and you know what you want. – Lao Tsu

What is sad is how far apart most citizens are from how our food is manufactured, and especially, how it is processed, and what it is processed with. I am no scientist, nor a nutritionist. Because of a disease, I have chosen to study diet and nutrition from books written by doctors with degrees in neurology, biochemestry, and nutrition. There is so much evidence that what we eat plays a primary role in the enormous chronic health diseases that only citizens in the United States suffer from - primarily - because we rely on processed foods.

Because we have to take classes, versus getting a degree...to really see and understand what has happened to our food supply in the past several decades...it is a challenge to get education as a lay person. I am absolutely convinced...as I know many others in our health conscious area...that only by mandating "transparancy" more and more in food packaging, will the average person start learning exactly what it is they are putting in their body, and start being able to make wiser choices.

We absolutely HAVE to start requiring the food we buy be labeled...and I hope this is only a first step. I also hope that someday we will have legislation similarly for what is in the household products we buy...from shampoo to mascara to laundry detergent - because they all have major impacts on our health and on the natural environment - I think we all kind of got at this point that the American lifestyle has had huge negative consequences.

Please vote YES on proposition 37 so everyone can take their own personal steps towards getting healthy. Knowledge is power.

[handy]

what is sad is that the life forms on this planet are being poisoned and all we can come up with are demands that some of the poison be criminally-minimally labelled. could this fall under the heading: "normalizing the unthinkable"? we are being poisoned!!

Yes. Thank you. While I agree with Ross that "the perfect is the enemy of the good enough", this prop doesn't come close to good enough. It may be minimal now, but in the future, it will be touted as a HUGE compromise and concession, and will be pointed to and used to avoid going any further. Normalizing the unthinkable is an apt description of the political process in general. And the majoritymob falls for it like clockwork. Truly wondrous and amazing...

to me this is what is terribly sad - not how far apart we are from food manufacture, but how far apart we are from our minds.

Yes.

"The major problems in the world are the result of the difference between how nature works and the way people think." - Gregory Bateson

"The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." - H. L. Mencken

[pnicholson]

thanks, handy. i agree with ross also - to a point - that the perfect is the enemy of the good. when it is time to act we must act, not wait for a perfect plan. but there is also the ruse of corporate/govt causing distractions and faux solutions, which are neither perfect nor good but work to keep us from addressing the important truths. we are spinning our wheels when we fail to see clearly what is before us. a great deal of time, energy, and money are being expended on something that should not exist.

by design.

i am not joking when i state that the un is backing both sides of this conflict. monsanto is un and carighttoknow, oca, fooddemocracynow!, institute for responsible technology - the 'leaders' of this movement to label, are un. this is not a grass roots movement. we are being invited to waste our time on labeling genocide by these controlled opposition orgs. it takes little effort to do some research on this. do we not wonder why these orgs are not initiating a movement to bangmos?

i think it is wise to not only shop locally, but to flow power locally. grass roots. not un-spawned multi-national, tax-free-foundation-funded, fronts for genocide.

when the lies are exposed, the truth is laid bare, and our choices are made, we cannot be stopped. everything is consciousness and there are seven billion of us. a resounding no to tyranny.

to freedom and prosperity.

cheers,
p

Yes. Thank you. While I agree with Ross that "the perfect is the enemy of the good enough", this prop doesn't come close to good enough. It may be minimal now, but in the future, it will be touted as a HUGE compromise and concession, and will be pointed to and used to avoid going any further. Normalizing the unthinkable is an apt description of the political process in general. And the majoritymob falls for it like clockwork. Truly wondrous and amazing...



Yes.

"The major problems in the world are the result of the difference between how nature works and the way people think." - Gregory Bateson

"The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." - H. L. Mencken

[rossmen]

gmo tech is revolutionary powerful. we dance with the devil (metaphorically), on this one. will it help our food relationship with the earth? all i know is that every bit of truth and transparency will help in the long run. 37 will probably win, and many fought and lost long and hard to get it on the ballot. if you vote against it, you are a bigger fool than i, and i am a fool, born 4/1/59. i am willing to make mistakes, and fall on my face for all to laugh. for 37 the way of wisdom is yes. if you choose to vote no you are more than a fool.

Yes. Thank you. While I agree with Ross that "the perfect is the enemy of the good enough", this prop doesn't come close to good enough. It may be minimal now, but in the future, it will be touted as a HUGE compromise and concession, and will be pointed to and used to avoid going any further. Normalizing the unthinkable is an apt description of the political process in general. And the majoritymob falls for it like clockwork. Truly wondrous and amazing...



Yes.

"The major problems in the world are the result of the difference between how nature works and the way people think." - Gregory Bateson

"The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." - H. L. Mencken

[datars]

Whole Foods Claim, "Nothing Artificial Ever" Proven False in Special Report
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cp0fWiyX7Xw

Alex Jones YouTube Channel
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheAlexJonesChannel

Take a look at this mural, painted on the side of one of Whole Foods' Austin locations: It brags, 'Nothing Artificial Ever,' but the admitted GMO ingredients sold on store shelves could never be considered to be anything but man-made freaks of nature.
With GMO foods more prevalent and more unpopular than ever, even "organic"-oriented grocery chains have been scrambling to spin the sad truth that genetically-modified ingredients have saturated the market and infiltrated virtually all food brands.
Such is the case with Whole Foods, leader in the organic products market, who've made billions advertising their stores as all 'natural,' wholesome and containing 'nothing artificial ever,' all while admittedly selling GMOs inside the store.

Post
https://www.infowars.com/whole-foods...tising-scandal

[gardenqueen]

Lauren, I am extremely insulted by you calling the Prop 37 proponents deceptive and dishonest. Are you serious? Deceptive for working tirelessly so that ALL of us can make a more informed decision while grocery shopping? Hmmm? Perhaps you have gotten us confused w/ the No on 37 campaign. Did you not hear that they have had their first t.v. ad taken down for mis-representation? Yep, it's true. Here is the link. Now who is deceptive again?https://www.latimes.com/business/money/la-fi-mo-anti-proposition-37-ad-pulled-20121004,0,1204815.story
The exemptions of Prop 37 have never been a secret. We have known about them since far before the initiative language was even complete. Where have you been? Obviously not working tirelessly volunteering like I have been. The text of the initiative has been available online since last Nov. (2011) It was on labelgmos.org and now is on carighttoknow.org. You could of easily found it by doing a simple google search. What did you expect? For someone to call you up and personally spoon feed you the exemptions? I thought your were an expert in research. You could have fooled me! For those interested they can find it under Get the Facts. Find tab at right of screen that says 'read the initiative'. https://www.carighttoknow.org/read_the_initiative
In addition to the above, apparently you are not aware of California Constitution Article 2, section 8 (d): An initiative measure embracing more than one subject may not be submitted to the ele
ctors or have any effect.
That is why meat & others are exempted. Link here. https://www.ballotpedia.org/wiki/ind...tion#Section_8 No need to explain more. Again, you could of easily done some research and found that out yourself but instead find this great need to spread lies and mis information on this site. Shame on you.

I seriously ask you, what is the alternative? No labeling? Would it be better if the label was just blank or said ' none of your business' ? That seems to be your feeling...that labels are deceptive. You really need to re think that a bit more.
Just know that you are fighting the wrong people. You are fighting mothers, fathers, grandparents, small business owners and small farmers that are working very hard for our Right to Know. What part of that don't you get? So, what you are saying is that you side w/ Monsanto & crew...(yep)...because you find this great need to nit-pick Prop 37's exemptions. You go ahead and make your choice but know that you must live with who you are at the end of the day. And that is not looking so pretty.


After looking at your site, my guess is that you probably advocate eating organic foods to your clients. Is that the case? Because if so, you should be actively working to get rid of that label, too, because it's "deceiving." Why? Because after 2019, USDA certified organics will potentially contain more allowable GMOs than this law will. Up to 5% can be GMO and still be called USDA Certified organic. That would mean every organic farmer is a liar if they don't advertise that? I've never seen one do so, never seen one label or alert anywhere. I guess you should be going after them, too, and trying to get rid of that whole labeling system to not be a hypocrite.
Pnichloson- Carighttoknow is not a UN NGO. It's a California Recipient Committee and will dissolve after the election. Please. Not everyone wants to kill you.
Lauren- Because I get the big picture of this being one small beginning step in a Herculean, long term effort, your words here and your egoic need to "right" on what is a non issue are really abhorrent to me. If it wasn't so sad, I'd consider it humorous how you live in such a small world and don't get the big picture. Seriously...the campaign folks are trying to lie to you? Seriously? They think people are stupid? Really? Do you know anything about politics? Do you have any idea of how to reach folks in the Valley who all they do is watch TV all day and eat GMOs they have never dreamed existed?
I see tons of references here to Genetic Roulette. Do you honestly think that Jeffrey Smith and all those folks in that movie would sign off on and work so hard on this campaign if it wasn't an extremely good idea, even if you don't understand it in this moment? Your need to push against this topic is a wonder for me.
Go ahead, make a stink. Be "right." Know that you are being more of a spokesperson for Monsanto than anyone they pay.
How does that feel?

[traindays]

thanks, handy. i agree with ross also - to a point - that the perfect is the enemy of the good. when it is time to act we must act, not wait for a perfect plan. but there is also the ruse of corporate/govt causing distractions and faux solutions, which are neither perfect nor good but work to keep us from addressing the important truths. we are spinning our wheels when we fail to see clearly what is before us. a great deal of time, energy, and money are being expended on something that should not exist.

by design.

i am not joking when i state that the un is backing both sides of this conflict. monsanto is un and carighttoknow, oca, fooddemocracynow!, institute for responsible technology - the 'leaders' of this movement to label, are un. this is not a grass roots movement. we are being invited to waste our time on labeling genocide by these controlled opposition orgs. it takes little effort to do some research on this. do we not wonder why these orgs are not initiating a movement to bangmos?

i think it is wise to not only shop locally, but to flow power locally. grass roots. not un-spawned multi-national, tax-free-foundation-funded, fronts for genocide.

when the lies are exposed, the truth is laid bare, and our choices are made, we cannot be stopped. everything is consciousness and there are seven billion of us. a resounding no to tyranny.

to freedom and prosperity.

cheers,
p

OK, I admit I am not educated about this. I read the blip re the flyer that got passed around to residences regarding Prop 37. So the issue I am seeing here...is those who vote no are saying that HOW the gmo's get labeled is inaccurate or misleading information? I really do not understand.

If we vote no...does that mean a better vote will come along that gives full disclosure? Can, will...that be done?

I'm just trying to have an open mind and get more information.

I assumed...that with the labeling re prop 37...that that was a precedent to enable future, increased disclosure/labeling of crap in our foods. Is this a erroneous assumption. (yes, I understand the first three letters in the word)

[traindays]

Whole Foods Claim, "Nothing Artificial Ever" Proven False in Special Report
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cp0fWiyX7Xw

Alex Jones YouTube Channel
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheAlexJonesChannel

Take a look at this mural, painted on the side of one of Whole Foods' Austin locations: It brags, 'Nothing Artificial Ever,' but the admitted GMO ingredients sold on store shelves could never be considered to be anything but man-made freaks of nature.
With GMO foods more prevalent and more unpopular than ever, even "organic"-oriented grocery chains have been scrambling to spin the sad truth that genetically-modified ingredients have saturated the market and infiltrated virtually all food brands.
Such is the case with Whole Foods, leader in the organic products market, who've made billions advertising their stores as all 'natural,' wholesome and containing 'nothing artificial ever,' all while admittedly selling GMOs inside the store.

Post
https://www.infowars.com/whole-foods...tising-scandal

With all due respect...and I do occasionally shop at Whole Foods so I am not dising them (sp?)...but surely by now we know that WF is not the queen of whole foods. Go into any supermarket, practically, and look at the ingredients and do some research. After being on my 'special diet' there is not much I can get anywhere...outside of raw, organic fruits and veggies, nuts and seeds, animal products grass fed - not fed hormones, etc., same with eggs and dairy I ferment to make edible for myself.

My opinion, is somehow we, as individual citizens, have to educate ourselves about what is in food. Stores are not going to do it for us...and I don't think we can rely on them to educate us. Thats why I am into increased discloser by the actual companies selling the food...I think they need to be accountable for what they are selling...

(Thank God for the organic labeling, free-trade, whether eggs are free range, fed stimulants or hormones, places that have a classification system for how their animals have been treated, how they have been fed...etc)

[datars]

Monsanto found guilty of chemical poisoning in landmark case
Here
https://www.naturalnews.com/037465_M...ourt_case.html

Volunteer for Yes on Prop 37
https://www.carighttoknow.org/volunteer

[Rosa R]

Laurel, I read your opinion piece on Prop 37 as well as your subsequent responses to people who challenged you. While it is apparent your heart is in the right place, I was disappointed to see you using your position as an NTP to add weight to your unfounded accusations about the nature of Prop 37 and its proponents. It is always disappointing to me when I encounter otherwise intelligent and articulate people within the natural health community who can't see the forest for the trees. The big picture has obviously been lost, and you are using your articulate intelligence to try to sway others towards your hairsplitting, negative point of view.

You may not think you are giving your vote away to Monsanto et al, but that is what a No vote from you and every voter swayed by your attacks on Prop 37 means. Have you examined the funding for and against Prop 37? Last time I looked, the Biotech/ Industrial Food crowd had raised $34 million to try to deny Californians the right to know whether they are eating GMOs. The Yes on 37 crowd has raised $4 million.

This is not some corporate front making a sham of labeling. Prop 37 is a true grassroots effort. Volunteers gathered 250,000 of the nearly one million signatures submitted to get the initiative on the ballot. OCA, IRT and the Right to Know committee are not and have never been corporate-sponsored. Look at the funding, look at the endorsers. https://www.carighttoknow.org/endorsements Do you really think that Jeffrey Smith, the Farm to Consumer Legal Defense Fund, Robyn O'Brien and all the rest of our food heroes are either too stupid to know they are being deceived or are in on this alleged deceit themselves? Do you really think that the volunteers who have committed thousands of hours to this campaign are likewise stupid or deceptive? I'm here to tell you, you don't hold the patent on intelligence and discernment. We knew about the exemptions, and many of us, myself included, did tell people about them.

You claim repeatedly that the Yes on 37 crowd is deceptive because the exemptions were not laid out for you to examine before you donated. In fact, the initiative has been available in full online for nearly a year now. At any time since November 2011, it could be read on labelgmos.org, and now it is on the carighttoknow website https://www.carighttoknow.org/read_the_initiative

Yes, there are exemptions. As GardenQueen stated, California Constitution Article 2, section 8 (d) explicitly says: An initiative measure embracing more than one subject may not be submitted to the electors or have any effect. In plain English this means that for an initiative to be legal, it can only be about one issue. That is why the focus is on food sold in grocery stores, the foods people most often eat. Alcohol is not considered to be in the same legal category as food, nor are vitamins. That is why they are exempt. Meat and from animals fed or injected with GMOs is considered a second-generation product as they are not themselves directly genetically engineered. The same goes for milk. That is why they are exempt. However, if GMO salmon (or any other animal) is for sale, it would be labeled as such.

Now Laurel, I have to quote you here "I understand where the Prop 37 writers were coming from on this issue, but personally I would have handled it a LOT differently if it was up to me. By far, my biggest beef with Prop 37 is the way the campaign was conducted."Where have you been? We could have used your considerable energy and commitment to spread the word. You could have shared the exemptions with everyone you spoke with. Remember, most on the ground communication has been by volunteers. You could have been part of the process, part of the solution, instead of pointing fingers and throwing stones and trying to tear down all that we have poured our hearts and souls into.


It seems to me that with your angry diatribe you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak. Prop 37 doesn't ban GMOs and there are loopholes that you actually had to look up yourself, so you choose to vote NO? What is the alternative? Do you really think that not having GMOs labeled will make people more invested in self-education to avoid GMOs? Without labels, most people don't even know that GMOs exist. I spent time canvassing in a WinCo parking lot, talking to people with carts full of GMOs. Most of them had never heard of a GMO, and once they understood that they were lab-made they wanted labels.

I find it interesting that you advocate voting against Prop 37 and instead tell people that avoiding GMOs is a matter of PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. Can you really stand by that statement when you think of the millions of people who have never heard of GMOs? In contrast, I believe the responsibility for identifying GMO products rests with the corporations that produce them, the farmers who grow them, and the companies that manufacture food with them, NOT with the people who unwittingly eat them. That said, I am a label reader and I always tell people to read the fine print. But of course, most people don't.

You claim that it is easy for the informed consumer to avoid GMOs, but that entails eating a whole foods diet devoid of processed foods, or eating 100% organic. As a fellow traditional nutritionist ala Weston A Price, I agree that would be ideal for people's health. However, as a realist I understand that we have to meet people where they are for information to be accessible to them. For the millions of people shopping at WinCo and Safeway, eating this way is at present an unachievable goal. A big part of my personal motivation for being a volunteer with Label GMOs is to democratize access to non-GMO foods, to make them accessible to those who simply can't buy organic foods and who don't know what the 8 commercial GM crops are. Is 5% GMO better than 100% GMO? In my book, yes.

Is it perfect? No. Is it everything I would like to see? Not by a long shot. Is it a good first step? Absolutely. Will it need strengthening in the future? Yes! We are so far behind the rest of the world on this issue, and the Agrichemical companies are so entrenched here, that compromises had to be made in order for this to stand up in court. Eighteen state-level legislative attempts have been made to label GMOs, and they all failed. To date, this is our best chance to pass a GMO labeling law in the US. In a perfect world, Prop 37 would label GMOs everywhere they show up, from animal feed to restaurants. However, writing such a broad initiative would doom it to failure, and allow the silent corruption of the food supply to continue beneath the level of most people's awareness. This is not about the ideal, it is about the real.

I encourage all who are reading this to VOTE YES ON 37 and then continue to educate others about GMOs. This is just the first step.

Some examples of next steps: Are you a parent? Work to get GMOs out of your children's school cafeteria. Do you eat out a lot? Ask restaurant owners to source non-GMO products. Are you a teacher? Show your students Genetic Roulette. Pass out non-GMO shopping guides. Teach people to read labels. Are you a farmer? Commit to growing non-GMO crops, talk to your neighboring farmers, form a no GMO coalition, educate your customers.

Laurel, for you I have a special challenge: Instead of using your intellect to try to tear down and discredit Prop 37, get involved. Once it passes, work to strengthen it. Perhaps you could start a campaign to ban the planting of GMOs in your county. Contact the organizers of the successful ban on GMO planting in Mendocino County. Network. Write your own county measure. Awareness about GMOs is higher now than it has ever been, due in large part to Prop 37 campaigners. Ride the wave and join the fight. If this just isn't your cup of tea, please, stop complaining about how the work of others doesn't match up to how you imagine you would do it.

Very Sincerely,
Rosa Rashall, Certified Nutrition Educator

[datars]

GMO Film Series Presents Scientist Under Attack

Wednesday, October 10 6:30 PM
$5.00 USD
Humanist Hall in Oakland

Potluck begins at 6:30pm and the film begins at 7:30pm.

Árpád Pusztai and Ignacio Chapela have two things in common. They are distinguished scientists and their careers are in ruins. Both scientists choose to look at the phenomenon of genetic engineering. Both made important discoveries. Both of them are suffereing the fate of those who criticise the powerful vested interests that now dominate big business and scientifuic research. Statements made by scientist themselves prove that 95% of the research in the area of genetic engineering is paid by the industry. Only 5% of the research is independent. The big danger for engineering is paid by the industry. Only 5% of the research is independent. The big danger for freedom of scince and our democracy is evident.
Can the public/we all still trust in our scientists?

Humanist Hall
390 27th St
Oakland, CA 94612
(Between Telegraph and Broadway)

Host: Carter Allen
Email: [email protected]

[traindays]

Well, I asked what I thought were good questions in a previous post, however there are no answers...yet.

I get there are loopholes in the prop 37. While that is unfortunate, I do not see the disclosures that WILL get labeled, if prop 37 passes, as a failure. I see them as a start. It is too bad it takes such huge effort to even get this much labeled...but that is a fact...that is our legal process...and that is the best we have to work with now. And a big thank you to those posters who put so much effort, time and energy into making disclosure possible - I really appreciate your work greatly.

I look at it like this. Our legal process is slow. I have seen that firsthand, and it is a fact of our times. We cannot change that...at least not anytime soon. And, I get the piece where the whole ballot would not succeed if there was insistance on meat being included...some legal situations...you have to stick to one issue (I also don't get why meat has to be separated out, but its some legal thing)

I do not see in our future a better start for disclosure of gmo's in our food. If anyone can convince me that a better measure can feasibly get passed in the next two years, then I might change my mind.

Obviously there are people willing to take the time, money and energy to campaign for these things. I am going to vote yes, and appreciate that there will be people in the future who will take the next step to get even fuller disclosure on our ballot. It is a gift.

[pnicholson]

traindays - your question was answered. it appears that you did not like the answer.

here it is. the opposition to labeling and the creator of life-insulting substances is monsanto et al. monsanto is the un. those who are leading the labeling initiative are carighttoknow, fooddemocracynow!, oca and institute for responsible technology. all of which are un. the un was founded, at first as the league of nations, for one purpose - to institute one world dictatorship which reasonably requires a forced huge reduction in population and easy control over all humans who survive. genetically-modified humans.

these movements, such as label gmos, are not grass roots. that is very important. it is not so much that i don't believe gmo foods should be labeled as it is i do not accept that gmos should exist. we are being led here - just as with the occupy movement, which was funded by the ever-egregious george soros(un). the energy by which we are being led is anti-life, anti-freedom, anti- ability to think and act coherently. and that is the un and all of its tens of thousands of ngos.

the program under which this all takes place is called Agenda 21. under agenda 21 there will be no organic foods, no matter what the ngos state to the contrary, no vitamins. it will all be gmo. except for the elite. there will be no private property. so when you hear about 'saving our agricultural land' from ngos, you will know that it actually means un land grabs that will grow, if anything, nothing but gmos. there will be no private ownership under agenda 21. please understand that. not land, or home, or children, or private vehicles. the un owns all the water on the planet, including rainwater. surely you are familiar with that, as least peripherally.

if it is un, it is bad. if i were going to attempt to take control over an entire planet i would control through whatever means i could, food, water, land, money. imf, who, world bank, codex alimentarius, opec, chambers of commerce, sierra club, nrdc, etc are un ngos. does that give you pause yet?

if you don't believe it, so be it. it will not take 100% awareness. just over half. the person who said here that oca or whatever was not foundation-funded was straight-out lying. that a gigantic, multi-national, all-powerful, foreign organization controls our water, vitamins, food, and is superceding our constitution in favor of the un charter, and literally all aspects of life on this planet, exists at all should be enough to set sane and intelligent humans into action to stop it. but not so.

it is not our legal process, traindays, it is our indoctrination that is doing us in. i would stand behind a grass roots movement that is aimed at stopping or labeling gmos. but i will not stand with the united nations. my honor is more important than my immediate life.

"Single acts of tyranny may be ascribed to the accidental opinion of a day. But a series of oppressions, begun at a distinguished period, and pursued unalterably through every change of ministers, too plainly proves a deliberate systematic plan of reducing us to slavery." Thomas Jefferson

Well, I asked what I thought were good questions in a previous post, however there are no answers...yet.

I get there are loopholes in the prop 37. While that is unfortunate, I do not see the disclosures that WILL get labeled, if prop 37 passes, as a failure. I see them as a start. It is too bad it takes such huge effort to even get this much labeled...but that is a fact...that is our legal process...and that is the best we have to work with now. And a big thank you to those posters who put so much effort, time and energy into making disclosure possible - I really appreciate your work greatly.

I look at it like this. Our legal process is slow. I have seen that firsthand, and it is a fact of our times. We cannot change that...at least not anytime soon. And, I get the piece where the whole ballot would not succeed if there was insistance on meat being included...some legal situations...you have to stick to one issue (I also don't get why meat has to be separated out, but its some legal thing)

I do not see in our future a better start for disclosure of gmo's in our food. If anyone can convince me that a better measure can feasibly get passed in the next two years, then I might change my mind.

Obviously there are people willing to take the time, money and energy to campaign for these things. I am going to vote yes, and appreciate that there will be people in the future who will take the next step to get even fuller disclosure on our ballot. It is a gift.

[traindays]

traindays - your question was answered. it appears that you did not like the answer.

here it is. the opposition to labeling and the creator of life-insulting substances is monsanto et al. monsanto is the un. those who are leading the labeling initiative are carighttoknow, fooddemocracynow!, oca and institute for responsible technology. all of which are un. the un was founded, at first as the league of nations, for one purpose - to institute one world dictatorship which reasonably requires a forced huge reduction in population and easy control over all humans who survive. genetically-modified humans.

these movements, such as label gmos, are not grass roots. that is very important. it is not so much that i don't believe gmo foods should be labeled as it is i do not accept that gmos should exist. we are being led here - just as with the occupy movement, which was funded by the ever-egregious george soros(un). the energy by which we are being led is anti-life, anti-freedom, anti- ability to think and act coherently. and that is the un and all of its tens of thousands of ngos.

the program under which this all takes place is called Agenda 21. under agenda 21 there will be no organic foods, no matter what the ngos state to the contrary, no vitamins. it will all be gmo. except for the elite. there will be no private property. so when you hear about 'saving our agricultural land' from ngos, you will know that it actually means un land grabs that will grow, if anything, nothing but gmos. there will be no private ownership under agenda 21. please understand that. not land, or home, or children, or private vehicles. the un owns all the water on the planet, including rainwater. surely you are familiar with that, as least peripherally.

if it is un, it is bad. if i were going to attempt to take control over an entire planet i would control through whatever means i could, food, water, land, money. imf, who, world bank, codex alimentarius, opec, chambers of commerce, sierra club, nrdc, etc are un ngos. does that give you pause yet?

if you don't believe it, so be it. it will not take 100% awareness. just over half. the person who said here that oca or whatever was not foundation-funded was straight-out lying. that a gigantic, multi-national, all-powerful, foreign organization controls our water, vitamins, food, and is superceding our constitution in favor of the un charter, and literally all aspects of life on this planet, exists at all should be enough to set sane and intelligent humans into action to stop it. but not so.

it is not our legal process, traindays, it is our indoctrination that is doing us in. i would stand behind a grass roots movement that is aimed at stopping or labeling gmos. but i will not stand with the united nations. my honor is more important than my immediate life.

"Single acts of tyranny may be ascribed to the accidental opinion of a day. But a series of oppressions, begun at a distinguished period, and pursued unalterably through every change of ministers, too plainly proves a deliberate systematic plan of reducing us to slavery." Thomas Jefferson

OK, thanks for specifically responding to me! I see your point of view. Its an immense point of view...might take me a few days to form an intelligent response.

I guess my thinking, right now is...OK...this is what we are working with. What is a better solution? Because I am simply not seeing one, within the framework our country works in right now. I feel a bit more optimistic, knowing the system we are working with here...in that a start to disclosure will help pave the way for further disclosure. Its a fight. Perhaps it comes from thinking we will not be rid of these oppressive elements...(I really like the T. Jefferson quote), we have to work with them. What are other options?

[pnicholson]

you are welcome, traindays. i am honored to have the opportunity to respond to you.

it may seem like an immense point of view, but it is a simple, direct point of view. it is what is. once you reach that understanding a release of sorts happens. perhaps you have experienced that. you know where you stand and you know what you want, but you also know what you don't want. we are living in a culture of double-speak and propaganda. state-sponsored propaganda. it is easy to get turned around and around.

disclosure does beget disclosure. i agree with you there. i am disclosing. i hope you will do the same.

'we have to work with them'. no. we don't. i don't work with them. them is about one million humans. we are six billion humans. they are painfully aware of that.

please know that the tyrannists on this plane have gathered under the aegis of the united nations. the un was founded and is funded by those who would take away not only freedom, but life and mind. the un has created an uber enormous web of entanglements of controlled opposition that are called ngos. no matter how altruistic these ngos wax, they are in existence only to serve one world government.

where do you want to go? what kind of life appeals to you? wherever that is, simply do not flow power to that which is anathema to your fondest dreams.

before you sign a petition, check to see who originated it. in the agenda 21 vision quest hoaxes, just the fact that you are attending is considered full agreement to the agenda. be circumspect. we cannot evolve if we are not free. evolution cannot be mandated or controlled.

we are truly at a crossroads. control over all aspects of life from what you eat, to where you live or, indeed, if you live, to what you think, versus freedom to experience life and attain happiness as a sovereign human being is what is at stake here. global governance demands the complete control and dependence of every life form on government. and it is not representative government. it is to be unelected boards. no recourse.

do not flow power to the un. buy locally or buy organic. do not vote if all the candidates are criminals(as is the case right now). do not pay taxes. through taxes we are funding our own demise and that of millions in third world countries. get rid of your tv. do not use pharmaceuticals. use natural medicines. drive only when you have to. take your children out of the indoctrinating public school system. take your money out of the big banks - put it in a credit union. use cash. grow whatever food you can. do not fund the corporations. think locally, act locally. there are many ways to defeat the tyranny. share your knowledge - knowledge is power. it truly is. we are not doomed. not at all. live consciously.

there is always a solution. and that solution is us.

with much love,
p

OK, thanks for specifically responding to me! I see your point of view. Its an immense point of view...might take me a few days to form an intelligent response.

I guess my thinking, right now is...OK...this is what we are working with. What is a better solution? Because I am simply not seeing one, within the framework our country works in right now. I feel a bit more optimistic, knowing the system we are working with here...in that a start to disclosure will help pave the way for further disclosure. Its a fight. Perhaps it comes from thinking we will not be rid of these oppressive elements...(I really like the T. Jefferson quote), we have to work with them. What are other options?

["Mad" Miles]

`
Finally! The Truth Revealed!!!

Agenda 21 is gonna kill us all!!!

Only half kidding. For those not hip to the "discussion" are you in for a treat! A treat that is, if you're an intellectual masochist.

Worth knowing about.

The Conspirosphere is vast, powerful and mulitvariegated. It's almost a full time job just to keep up with developments!

Make sure to start with Post #1, or you'll miss the exciting narrative contained there/herein...

https://www.waccobb.net/forums/showt...418#post152418


`

[datars]

Agenda 21 Is very real and it need to be stop.

Behind the Green Mask - Rosa Koire (Agenda 21)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDtCb45Lqt0

SOUNDS LIKE SCIENCE FICTION...OR SOME CONSPIRACY THEORY...BUT IT ISN'T.
Have you wondered where these terms 'sustainability' and 'smart growth' and 'high density urban mixed use development' came from?
Doesn't it seem like about 10 years ago you'd never heard of them and now everything seems to include these concepts? Is that just a coincidence? That every town and county and state and nation in the world would be changing their land use/planning codes and government policies to align themselves with...what?
Click here for more:

https://www.democratsagainstunagenda21.com/index.html

Who are we?
We are engaged in educating ourselves, our peers, and our country about UN Agenda 21, ICLEI, Sustainable Development, Smart Growth, Form-Based Zoning, Green Energy Mandates, Carbon Offsets, Cap and Trade, Redevelopment and other programs that restrict our land rights and civil rights.
This vitally important information transcends party lines and illuminates much of what we have witnessed over the past two decades.
This is not a left or right issue. It's an American issue.

The information on these sites will help you to identify what is happening in your town and to stop it.
https://www.PostSustainabilityInstitute.org
https://www.DemocratsAgainstUNAgenda21.com
https://www.SantaRosaNeighborhoodCoalition.com

Need a DVD, submit a request at:
https://teapartymedia.net/listen_liv...k_request_.htm

We the People Radio interview:
https://teapartymedia.net/20111218

Book Behind The Green Mask here
https://www.infowarsshop.com/Behind-...-21_p_585.html

[Rosa R]

Yes Agenda 21 is real. I am a fan of Rosa Koire's, and have noticed the insidious jargon and policies that are indicators of Agenda 21 being implemented in my home county as well as nationally. I do not intend to vote for either of the corporate puppets being held up for us to choose from. Long before I ever knew about Agenda 21 I attended a meeting where the Delphi technique was used. I was the only one in the room who walked out at the end of the day angry, knowing we had been scammed. When I encountered Rosa's work years later, I finally knew exactly HOW we had been scammed.

That said, Label GMOs, IRT and OCA are most emphatically NOT an Agenda 21 scam. Are you kidding PNicholson? Your lack of critical thinking and your broad sweeping statements lumping everyone who is trying to make a difference in with the UN NGO's working to bring on the New World Order is simplistic, inaccurate and defeatist. Beware of believing everything that goes through your head!

Agenda 21 is all about "smart development" and getting people into the cities and out of the country. It is about putting corporate overlords in charge of everything needed for survival. It is about getting small farmers off the farm, and forbidding front yard veggie gardens. It is about letting Monsanto pollute all the seed so we don't have a choice. It is about poisoning the air and water so we need expensive interventions to conceive, to be healthy, to grow our own healthy food.

HOW COULD A LABELING LAW THAT PUTS KNOWLEDGE IN THE HANDS OF THE PEOPLE BE A UN AGENDA 21 SCHEME? If people avoid GMOs because of the label, this will benefit their health. If they are healthier, they are less vulnerable to Agenda 21 strategies. If people's avoidance of GMOs shifts the market away from GMOs in any measurable way, it will represent a stumbling block in the Agenda 21 program. A massively shrinking market share for GM products has been the result of labeling everywhere it has been implemented. Why would it be any different here in CA?

I have no objection to going down the rabbit hole and looking with open eyes at what is actually happening. However, you seem to have mixed up a potent brew of a little information plus a load of assumptions that has you dizzy with your own sense of "superior knowledge". Have you bothered to actually confirm any of your accusations about Label GMOs and the other food safety groups you demonize as being UN funded, or do you just "know" them to be true? I challenge you to back up your claims with actual data.

Traindays, to answer your question: Prop 37 is the only chance we are likely to have to get GMOs labeled in California. If it succeeds here, other states will follow. The naysayers on this thread are not offering another initiative to label GMOs, they are simply stating that Prop 37 isn't good enough. As I said before, this is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. If we want transparency in labeling, this is where it starts. Vote YES ON 37!