5G in Sebastopol & Graton

[Anandaji]

Does anyone have info on when 5G is going to arrive to Sebastopol or Graton, and where exactly those network signal boxes will be placed? Are there any groups or individuals working to slow, stagger or halt plans for it to be implemented in these communities?
Kindly respond if you know. This is a highly destructive microwave technology that will impact health & well being a great deal.
Thank you.

[ChefJayTay]

... This is a highly destructive microwave technology that will impact health & well being a great deal.

If you're paranoid and afraid of the new technology, feel free to move to Green Bank, WV - aka. The National Radio Quiet Zone. Otherwise, you're just going to have to deal with it.

5G WILL be installed on a nearly block by block level.
The idea of banning it on correlation studies (ohh... you've found the non-existing causation study?) is quite pathetic.

[Anandaji]

Chef JayTay,
Since your reply states that I can move to WV, am paranoid, can 'deal with it', pointing to what American Cancer Society & other sources state, it appears to me to be quite inflammatory mixed with statements you strongly believe in. You have your informed take on 5G technology so I respect that part of your response.
My informed questions stand as that, and invites replies specific to them.
Thank you for attempting to assist.

[caromia333]

Here is the United Nations WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION leading MD / scientific scholar on the health impacts of wifi and cell phone technologies. 50 seconds from his talk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgGJeOVEdQs

Dr. Anthony Miller, senior advisor to the WHO IARC reviewed the best availible scientific evidence and now concludes that cell phone and wireless radiation is a carcinogen. This excerpt is from a July 31, 2017 lecture he gave in a scientific symposium sponsored by Environmental Health Trust. Get powerpoint slides and learn more at https://ehtrust.org/scientific-update...

There is little doubt its carcinogenic. I personally get migraines when exposed for lengths of time - we use fiber optics in our remote mountain home. It's a HUGE PROBLEM and I would certainly like to support a group working to stop this ... there is a talk show on KPFA who monthly discusses this subject with scientists and world experts. They have a library you can access for free - yourownhealthandfitness.org

[SonomaPatientsCoop]

^^^ "Here is the United Nations WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION leading MD / scientific scholar on the health impacts of wifi and cell phone technologies."

Looking to him, I would hardly make this claim. He was largely a scientific editor- over 25 years ago, who specialized in breast and cervical cancers.

To be clear- the WHO and some of the other EU agencies- list pretty much everything as "probable carcinogens". And it has nothing to do with real world conditions. It's kinda like water- you drink too much too fast it WILL kill you.

In my almost 50 years I have seen no evidence in the studies of increased cancers from wifi/cellular. Nor any real scientific evidence in the thousands of studies indicating that under normal circumstances, it is a real risk. (and yes... one can argue cancer rates have increased in recent decades, but better medical care and awareness at least accounts for this).

Yes- it's a risk factor. As is the sun. The cars we drive. the plastics we use everyday because they make our lives easier. The chemicals in our building materials, paints, carpets., furniture. many designed to protect us from fire, molds, or other issues while presenting a risk of their own.

Yes- maybe we are adding one more very minor risk to the world. And we can debate forever if the benefits outweigh the risks. I would argue society AND science have spoken- that yes the benefits far outweigh the risk.

[sharingwisdom]

Veteran MD Drops Bombshell About 5G Technology Dangers At 5G Hearing -Dr. Sharon Goldberg, an internal medicine physician & professor gives her testimony regarding 5g technology dangers specifically involving electromagnetic radiation. She says: "Wireless radiation has biological effects. Period." (diabetes, kidney disease +) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Qt5B39LB7c

26,000 Scientists Oppose 5G Roll Out https://principia-scientific.org/petition-26000-scientists-oppose-5g-roll-out

Scientists and Doctors Demand Moratorium on 5G https://www.saferemr.com/2017/09/5G-moratorium12.html

Firefighters in California have reported severe neurological damage, headaches, insomnia, memory problems and confusion after 5G towers were installed outside their stations & have now filed to be exempt from the California law that would enforce the installment of 5G towers near their places of work https://forbiddenknowledgetv.net/first-5g-rollout-in-ca-causing-brain-damage-to-firefighters/

International Appeal Scientists call for Protection from Non-ionizing Electromagnetic Field Exposure
https://www.emfscientist.org/index.p...ientist-appeal

[podfish]

Veteran MD Drops Bombshell (ed: !!!!!!) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Qt5B39LB7c

also - https://principia-scientific.org/
https://www.saferemr.com
https://forbiddenknowledgetv.net
https://www.emfscientist.org/index.p...ientist-appeal

it's all red-pill stuff there. Have fun with those sites, but unless (ok, I know you all do) you think any "mainstream" source of info is tainted and trying to fool us for nefarious reasons, they don't make a convincing case that there's any compelling reason to fear the 5G menace. If those sites are so worried about threats to our health, why do some of them also find global warning a hoax? They have a high standard for evidence indicating climate change, and an incredibly low one for evidence regarding EMF dangers. I don't see a lot of sign of intellectual consistency there.... maybe they have hidden motives and are in some kind of conspiracy together!

[M/M]

Anandaji, this doesn't answer the questions you initially posted either...

it's all red-pill stuff there. ...... you think any "mainstream" source of info is tainted and trying to fool us for nefarious reasons...

Medicine and people generally understand science and the body as matter: pretty much made of parts that function mechanically and chemically. Our technologies, on the other hand, are operating within and also well beyond Newtonian science... e.g. with light, electromagnetic energies, quantum physics and more... which are well beyond the understanding of most people on the planet... Added to that, there are many very wealthy people who are advancing goals that may or may not be in the best interest of the planet or the majority of life on it... using these same technologies...

It is easy to have an opinion and conflate that with a fact. It is easy to have favored opinions and begin right way to name call, when someone doesn't agree, in order to defend one's position. Neither encourage nor foster genuine communication, nor do they help us get to facts, knowledge, optimal decisions and a sense of community. It doesn't help that science & tech are not always in agreement as to what is real or factual... as they have operating theories and often conflict with one another, even as they make great advances.

In terms of 5G... 24/7 microwave energy will hit all objects and lifeforms - whether they are operating an electronic device or not. There are reports based on studies that show there are, in fact, negative impacts from this. These studies are suppressed or lumped in such a way (the message being 'look no further'). Financially strapped cities, towns may sell out to offers too lucrative to ignore.

Oregon has proposed a law doesn't leave politicians at the mercy of pressures to decide re: things they may have no understanding of: https://www.emfacts.com/2019/03/oreg...ss-technology/

as a bit of a curve ball, since it doesn't deal with anywhere near the same frequencies as 5G (6G and beyond), this article does show that pulsed energy waves of light and sound - can strongly influence matter - though study is not a complete answer to plaques that involve memory; and the caveat: "So far early testing for safety has shown the process seems to have no clear side effects" is hardly reassuring: Scientists 'clear' Alzheimer's plaque from mice using only light and sound - https://www.sciencealert.com/astonis...and-sound-show

[podfish]

... Medicine and people generally understand science and the body as matter: pretty much made of parts that function mechanically and chemically. Our technologies, on the other hand, are operating within and also well beyond Newtonian science... It is easy to have an opinion and conflate that with a fact.....
There are reports based on studies that show there are, in fact, negative impacts from this. These studies are suppressed or lumped in such a way (the message being 'look no further').

most of your post sticks to facts, though I'm not sure why you found 17th century science a reasonable baseline for technology. I also don't see anyone conflating opinion with fact. But to your main point: sure, there are studies showing negative impacts. That's a data point (a fact). The leap to an assertion (not a fact) that "these studies are suppressed..." is exactly my problem with how the sites cited (sorry, verbal pun) by SharingWisdom operate. Trading citations is silly web practice, but still, I far prefer sites that don't wear their agenda on their sleeve like those do. You won't find me claiming worries about 5G are nonsense, but they aren't well grounded. For example, global warming threats are well enough documented to take precautions, even if they're expensive. Evidence supporting threats from 5G, and the threat level that's claimed, isn't enough to justify the level of fear.

[Runningbare]

most of your post sticks to facts, though I'm not sure why you found 17th century science a reasonable baseline for technology. I also don't see anyone conflating opinion with fact. But to your main point: sure, there are studies showing negative impacts. That's a data point (a fact). The leap to an assertion (not a fact) that "these studies are suppressed..." is exactly my problem with how the sites cited (sorry, verbal pun) by SharingWisdom operate. Trading citations is silly web practice, but still, I far prefer sites that don't wear their agenda on their sleeve like those do. You won't find me claiming worries about 5G are nonsense, but they aren't well grounded. For example, global warming threats are well enough documented to take precautions, even if they're expensive. Evidence supporting threats from 5G, and the threat level that's claimed, isn't enough to justify the level of fear.

This morning as I was driving up the entrance to the Healdsburg Transfer Station, I was suddenly mortified by the roadside sight of a very tall and imposing telecommunications tower pretending to be a conifer tree-- as if Godzilla had donned a figleaf. With its beefy metal "trunk", the disguise was pathetic, the effect unsettling.

There are many documentaries out there about the harmful effects of 5G / electromagnetic radiation, but none I believe as effective and comprehensively researched as this one. This will wake you up and energize you — no matter who you are if you have a Soul!

Have we had enough? A question you might choose to answer sincerely upon watching this investigative journalism. There is simply no area of existence this bio-weaponry — masquerading as telecommunications technology will not touch and no aspect of your life that will not be touched by it.

Evidence supporting threats from 5G, and the threat level that's substantiated, more than justifies the level of alarm. For anyone paying attention to telecommunications industry's endrun around the Tenth Amendment, the collusion between it and regulatory agencies becomes extremely hard to ignore. This collection of data sourced from a wide range of qualified environmental, medical and health professionals, is a wake-up call for level heads thwarted by incredulity. The Bio-Initiative Report alone constitutes an unassailable indictment of where 5G proposes to take us.

The intended ubiquity of this qualitatively unprecedented scope of electromagnetic-biological warfare is staggering, to put it mildly. This is much more than a rabbit hole; this heralds a change of species. Educate yourself and don’t think you don’t have the power to change this trajectory - because collectively WE DO — SO BE IT!

[barfly]

I really dislike those fake tree antenna towers. They look horrible and are dishonest. Antennas should look like antennas.

Why do you suppose “5G APOCALYPSE - THE EXTINCTION EVENT” is produced in a completely sensationalized style, such as you’d see on late night TV about bigfoot? Nothing about it resembles a legitimate documentary.

[podfish]

....Why do you suppose “5G APOCALYPSE - THE EXTINCTION EVENT” is produced in a completely sensationalized style, such as you’d see on late night TV about bigfoot? Nothing about it resembles a legitimate documentary.

because it's not a piece of journalism. It's a bigfoot movie. I'm sure there's a legitimate documentary to be made about the risks of 5G but it'd be too equivocal to be a crowd pleaser. Everyone hates it when people say "well on the one hand.." ... "but on the other hand...". They want someone to take a firm stand!!

[Barry]

What if it was shown to kill 37,000 people every year and seriously injure many more , like motor vehicles do??

[ChefJayTay]

We don't even know what all 5G will do/does. I'm looking forward to better internet, competition to cable/fiber internet providers, and much more. However, it's obviously also got national security components with the way the US and Canada are treating Huawei. I once read an article in popular science about how the disturbances in microwave signals can detect stealth planes.....Who knows what all they do.

[barfly]

The Huawei issue has nothing specific to do with 5G. They’re embedding spy hardware in communications equipment. You could do the same with older technology except that it’s already been deployed. If you have the ability to monitor wired telephone calls, that also relates to national security.

With a little creativity and a lack of technical knowledge, you can create fabulous conspiracy theories. That reminds me, I’ve been meaning to re-read Asimov’s Foundation series.

5G leverages the advantages of moving up to millimeter wave frequencies. In particular lots of available spectrum and the antennas are scaled down in size because the wavelength is so short.

We don't even know what all 5G will do/does. I'm looking forward to better internet, competition to cable/fiber internet providers, and much more. However, it's obviously also got national security components with the way the US and Canada are treating Huawei....

[spam1]

We don't even know what all 5G will do/does.

The single highest cost for cell phone companies is the cost of electricity to run the air-conditioner to cool the transmitters. Want to make a $100billion? Find a way to reduce the transmitter power and still maintain the link.

Enter 5G. 5G does three big things:

it spreads the energy over wider bands (so that if there is interference or the signal is blocked in one part, it switches to another), with higher speed so the "burst" of RF is shorter, and it uses electronically steerable antennas (ESA) to steer the signal to the user.

It has 2 ranges, FR1 (being deployed), which is in similar bands to cell and wifi today, and FR2, which is mm-wave bands and not expected to be widely deployed to handheld devices. The FR1 systems have antennas that can maintain the signal connection with about 250 times less power (the transmit antenna is 65 times more efficient, and the handset is about 4 times).

Finally, since the signal is steered (they call it beamforming), the end user, who desires to make the connection is the one who is primarily exposed, rather than everyone in the current system of broadcasting the cell signal (well, not exactly broadcasting since the current systems uses a wide beam that covers 60 degree arc; the 5G signal will have about 1 degree of arc.), but exposed still at lower power.

So: if you are concerned about RF energy causing health effects, and you think lower power, shorter duration, and directed at only the user are all good things, you should support 5G.

[Antonio]

FYI- Once upon a time, China(PRC) was poor and they discovered that they could look for disturbances in reflected TV signals, which were already in place and ubiquitous, and they could use these TV signals to detect aircraft rather than spending Billions of Yuan to develop and test specialized countermeasures like the West had done. Who knows what all TV signals do?

...I once read an article in popular science about how the disturbances in microwave signals can detect stealth planes.....Who knows what all they do.

[podfish]

FYI- Once upon a time, China(PRC) was poor and they discovered that they could look for disturbances in reflected TV signals, which were already in place and ubiquitous, and they could use these TV signals to detect aircraft rather than spending Billions of Yuan to develop and test specialized countermeasures like the West had done. Who knows what all TV signals do?

well, MIT knows what WiFi can do ("MIT Device Uses Wi-Fi to ‘See’ Through Walls and Track Your Movements")-- there's a lot of radiant energy in the world. You can worry about it if you like (even a technophile like Heinlein did.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waldo_(short_story) ) but you're probably worrying about the wrong thing. There's no way most people who worry about it understand what part of the technology is threatening and what parts are benign. The radiant energy in the ultraviolet coming from the sun is probably the worst you'll ever encounter. A tremendous number of people get cancer from it, way more than do from phones. See Spam1's post for a hint about why 5G pales in comparison.

[M/M]

This morning as I was driving up the entrance to the Healdsburg Transfer Station, I was suddenly mortified by the roadside sight of a very tall and imposing telecommunications tower pretending to be a conifer tree-- as if Godzilla had donned a figleaf. With its beefy metal "trunk", the disguise was pathetic, the effect ominous.

There are many documentaries out there about the harmful effects of 5G / electromagnetic radiation, but none I believe as effective and comprehensively researched as this one. This will wake you up and energize you — no matter who you are if you have a Soul!

Have we had enough? A question you might choose to answer sincerely upon watching this investigative journalism. There is simply no area of existence this bio-weaponry — masquerading as telecommunications technology will not touch and no aspect of your life that will not be touched by it.

Evidence supporting threats from 5G, and the threat level that's substantiated, more than justifies the level of alarm. ...

I love your response... and have watched about 1/2-hour of the film.. I will watch the rest...

Many of the replies in this thread are interesting... on many levels. I have no understanding about the technology.. way beyond my scope. What is not beyond my scope is the fact that many medical people who are knowledgeable... whether in this film or elsewhere.... and see the effects of many generations of tech, including 5G where it is being tested prior to rollout.. are ignored. Doctors speak to politicians and / or industry spokesmen... who respond as if doctors are speaking in tongues... Pols/industry people say studies are needed... which studies never happen.

A neurosurgeon wonders about "WHY EYE AND BRAIN DISEASES ARE EXPLODING".... Many more people are dying of heart attacks before the age of 40... which may be related to wireless tech affecting calcium channels in heart.... et cetera...

The medical epidemiology alone, as reported in various hearings or published in journals or blogs - some recorded in the above film, could be a source of good information about 5G yet is ignored... I find that telling and frightening. Obfuscation hardly points to caring about welfare of life nor truly enlightens our ignorance...

[wisewomn]

Surely, M/M, you can't be suggesting that politicians and big business would place a higher value on money than on people's lives?! :-)

I love your response... and have watched about 1/2-hour of the film.. I will watch the rest...

[Jude Iam]

Bring your questions. Connect to organize. Jude

Science Buzz Cafe # 459
at the 'Abbey' HopMonk
230 Petaluma Ave. Sebastopol, CA
Host, Daniel Osmer ([email protected])
WEDNESDAY NIGHT
April 3rd, 2019 • 7pm • $5
Come Early for Food & Drink

Medicine, ElectroSmog & More:
How Can We Know What Is True?
Richard Diehl, PhD, M.Ed, L.Ac.

Expect a whirlwind conversation that begins with a brief epistemological view of language, perception and beliefs, the trances we live in, and why we sometimes get into stuck states, not allowing new input to influence us.

Richard will move into modern medicine and its focus, as well as its limits. Bugs (infections) & toxins will be discussed. The biggest focus in this talk will be a discussion of the risks of ElectroMagnetic Radiation and how the 3 might interact. Richard will be showing scientific research to back up this perspective

He will conclude with what simple and sometimes inexpensive steps that can be taken to reduce ElectroMagnetic risks “just in case”.

Richard recently moved to the mainland after 31 years in Hawaii, where I maintained a private practice as an Acupuncturist, Traditional Naturopath, ElectroMagnetic Remediater, and more. He has been a student, and colleague of Dietrich Klinghardt MD Ph.D. for 20 years and received much of his training in Alternative Medicine, EMF Remediation, Healthy Homes and more, from him. (Dietrich is one of the early spokesmen regarding chronic Lyme disease, the dangers of EMF, and much more. Richard has also also lectured in 9 countries on 5 continents, mostly on NLP (NeuroLinguistic Programming) and is certified as a Master Trainer in this discipline.

BRINGING SCIENCE & CURIOSITY BACK INTO CULTURE ...
www.sciencebuzzcafe.org
(707) 292-5281
[email protected]

This morning as I was driving up the entrance to the Healdsburg Transfer Station, I was suddenly mortified by the roadside sight of a very tall and imposing telecommunications tower pretending to be a conifer tree-- as if Godzilla had donned a figleaf. With its beefy metal "trunk", the disguise was pathetic, the effect unsettling.

There are many documentaries out there about the harmful effects of 5G / electromagnetic radiation, but none I believe as effective and comprehensively researched as this one. This will wake you up and energize you — no matter who you are if you have a Soul!

Have we had enough? A question you might choose to answer sincerely upon watching this investigative journalism. There is simply no area of existence this bio-weaponry — masquerading as telecommunications technology will not touch and no aspect of your life that will not be touched by it.

Evidence supporting threats from 5G, and the threat level that's substantiated, more than justifies the level of alarm. For anyone paying attention to telecommunications industry's endrun around the Tenth Amendment, the collusion between it and regulatory agencies becomes extremely hard to ignore. This collection of data sourced from a wide range of qualified environmental, medical and health professionals, is a wake-up call for level heads thwarted by incredulity. The Bio-Initiative Report alone constitutes an unassailable indictment of where 5G proposes to take us.

The intended ubiquity of this qualitatively unprecedented scope of electromagnetic-biological warfare is staggering, to put it mildly. This is much more than a rabbit hole; this heralds a change of species. Educate yourself and don’t think you don’t have the power to change this trajectory - because collectively WE DO — SO BE IT!

[M/M]

Surely, M/M, you can't be suggesting that politicians and big business would place a higher value on money than on people's lives?! :-)

Language can be so tricky... can polarize both witting and unwittingly...

I'm now 55 minutes into the 5G movie.. and am learning that there are many politicians, ex-military, business people, and others, who have been helping to get the word out and inform as well...

I learned from State of Michigan House committee hearings on this issue how: "public lost rights regarding wireless." For me, this is another reason to question, if not outright distrust, what some say.

The following are rough quotes: "Insurance won't cover medical issues related to wireless industry... and so industry needed laws to prevent lawsuits... Section 704 of the TCA (Telecommunications Act) was signed into law by Bill Clinton in 1996.. That section states: No health or environmental concern can interfere with the placement of telecom equipment."

"It gave the power to regulate health effects from wireless industry to the FCC.. which agency has nothing to do w/medical issues nor does it have even ONE biomedical person on their team."

"Another thing that 704 did was took the power from the state to regulate location of cell towers based on health. If they want to put a cell tower in front of your home you cannot go to city council and say you don't want it due to health concerns... You are not allowed to mention this in the city council because if you do and application is rejected, the city can be sued by the wireless industry... "

[oldbaldman]

Forget about 5G, wireless radiation, chemtrails, vaccines, and every other alarming health threat described by some perfectly reliable YouTube video. The very certain threat to your well being that no one talks about is breathing. Studies have shown that in all cases persons who breath will succumb to degenerative decline and eventually die. The evidence is everywhere but THEY don't talk about it because THEY don't want you to wake up to this startling reality; BREATHING KILLS.

After observing billions of cases it is clear that anyone who breaths long enough will experience a gradual loss of skin tone, hair will lighten, possibly turn grey or white or even fall out and not grow back. There will be a gradual loss of vigor, victims will be heard groaning slightly when bending down to pick something up, the libido will diminish, mobility will be compromised and eventually death is almost certain. Stop breathing now and save yourself from the ravages of this pervasive and insidious threat.

[luke32]

That's great, Baldy!

[podfish]

... The very certain threat to your well being that no one talks about is breathing. Studies have shown that in all cases persons who breath will succumb to degenerative decline and eventually die....

no, sometimes people who breathe die suddenly. It's kind of insidious. But stopping breathing is no guarantee of long life - one dose seems to be enough.

Also water is a poison. People who suffer from excessive thirst, maybe after exercise, have been known to drink enough to inadvertently kill themselves. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1770067/

[Jude Iam]

not holding my breath, but Brussels has decided against 5G, just sayin, Jude

Brussels Becomes First Major City to Halt 5G Due to Health Effects

[M/M]

... THEY don't want you to wake up to this startling reality; BREATHING KILLS. ....

John Muir said, "When we try to pick out anything by itself, we find it hitched to everything else in the Universe," what you write is a case in point So given that death is inevitable, we likely each have a conscious or unconscious philosophy or belief system or metaphysic that puts that in some kind of context.. whether we believe in a loving or punitive God/Goddess or an accidental universe or xyz...... we will choose or live values based on our belief system or systems. I guess given the option, I like to live so there is more joy, meaning, health and the least amount of needless suffering... and I love the idea of living democratically... where an informed people cocreate life together...

[M/M]

Brussels Becomes First Major City to Halt 5G Due to Health Effects

Interesting.. and clueless here, yet wonder if coincidence or connection... Brussels is headquarters of EU, European Central Bank is there, plus offices of NATO, UN, etc etc...

[M/M]

not holding my breath, but Brussels has decided against 5G, just sayin, Jude

Brussels Becomes First Major City to Halt 5G Due to Health Effects

Rome joins opposition... Brussels Belgium and Rome Municipality Oppose Wireless 5G Antennas
https://ehtrust.org/brussels-belgium...s-5g-antennas/

and maybe DC after hearings? Scientists Warn of Health Effects: Washington DC Council 5G Small Cell Roundtable https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljLynbr5iPc

Plus: 5G & Cell Tower Protests Worldwide https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLxeBuz0suM

[M/M]

You tube: 5G & Worldwide "Urban Deforestation" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSrN_xPhL7g

He mentioned that not all 5G will be sent via towers; some 5G cable is going underground???
(AT&T is digging a trench and putting in cable across from Sebastopol Charter at Mill Station and 116.
Wonder if that is 5G capable???)

The same day 5G launched in South Korea was the day they had massive fires....

Lot of emphasis on self-driving cars coming, thanks to 5G.. Lots more questions than answers...