Verdict: Carrillo Not Guilty

[Victoria Street]

Verdict: Carrillo not guilty (w/video)

https://www.pressdemocrat.com/articl...cles/140429569

I'm totally in shock...

[Ted Pole]

Proof that the system works!

[Victoria Street]

Proof that the system works!

Proof that we have a system - sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't...

[Barry]

At first I was shocked, too, but I hate to say it, but I can see it being the correct answer to the legal question.

I believe Efren was telling the truth when he said he was going over to Jane Doe's for "a drink and sex with the woman", he wasn't going over there for peeking (nor to sexually assault her). Whether he actually peeked or not, is both hard to say/prove and besides the point.

Unfortunately there is not a legal statute against being an egotistical alcoholic with really really poor judgement and taste (his girlfriend had just dropped him off before going over to Jane Doe's! ). It's beyond a shadow of doubt that he's guilty of that, and I'm sure that he has already experienced much punishment for that.

There are at least two further bits of business for him to do to begin to put this unsavory mess behind him, apologize to the victim, and her friends and family (perhaps using restorative justice), and to step down as Supervisor.

Edit:

Apparently he is not planning on stepping down. See this video after his acquittal:

There is a protest being organized for
Wednesday, April 30, 5-7pm in Courthouse Square
to demand his resignation.

[dzerach]

... business for him to do to begin to put this unsavory mess behind him (...) to step down as Supervisor.

Ha. As if.

What's especially sad to me is that many voters would allow a legal court decision to decide for them as well.

[jbox]

Ha. As if.

What's especially sad to me is that many voters would allow a legal court decision to decide for them as well.

Well, I'm sorry you and so many other so called "progressives" had their mind made up about this whole affair in advance and without the benefit of the facts. That is the kind of behavior I expect of small minded, perhaps bigoted, people.

The system did work, a jury composed of 10 women and 2 men unanimously found him NOT GUILTY. Efren did blow it here, there is no doubt, and Efren knows better than anyone what a hard lesson this has been. He was humble, painfully open about his state of being and his state of mind, acknowledged his mistake, and asked for forgiveness. That is the least we can give him.

He was guilty of being a young man with a big ego and a drinking problem, something that afflicts lots and lots of young men. That doesn't make him a rapist or a criminal. He deserves due process and he had his day in court. As I had suspected (but didn't know for sure) this was much ado about not very much. Now, can we just get over it and move on?

[Victoria Street]

Well, I'm sorry you and so many other so called "progressives" had their mind made up about this whole affair in advance and without the benefit of the facts. That is the kind of behavior I expect of small minded, perhaps bigoted, people. ...

"Progressives", "small minded" and "bigoted"? Really jbox?

Elected officials with big egos and (perhaps) a drinking problem should not be putting their hands through the bedroom window screens of their female neighbors.

I'm sorry you don't understand this.

[Imagery]

Efren may as well have told the jurors that he believes in Sharia law, does NOT respect women, and will do whatever he wants because he is ABOVE the law.
Someone needs to knock his ego back down to reality.

[oliviathunderkitty]

For what it is worth, here is my take. I keep going back to what he did. If I had been the woman, in bed, likely sleeping, when a hand tore my screen and reached in--or even just reached in--I would have been beyond terrified. That is the exact moment we all dread, especially if we live alone. It is the equivalent of the "man at the door with the knife," that Joan Didion writes about so eloquently in The White Album.

Being attracted to someone, being a tad tipsy (he was not drunk), being arrogant and feeling entitled, none of this excuses causing that moment of terror in another person. Same with the way he entered her garage and came to the back door, where he found her, just out of the shower, vulnerable. Very scary.

This is not typical, normal, standard behavior. It is invasive. I don't need to know the name of the man who did it or what was behind it. It is that moment, those two moments, that I find truly terrifying. I am not rushing to judgement, I'm not calling for anyone's head to roll, I am, simply, putting myself in the position of the victim. Can she move on? I hope she can but I also know how much trouble I would have falling asleep at night.

I hope he gets help and I hope he pays close attention to the wisdom within the Press Democrat's editorial.

[wisewomn]

I totally agree, Oliviathunderkitty and Imagery. There has been entirely too much discussion about Efren and very little about the impact his noctournal visit had on his neighbor. His apologists seem to think that "boys will be boys" and that women should just suck it up, which is what usually happens when a man violates a woman's personal boundaries. It took me years to feel comfortable taking a shower after I saw "Psycho," and that was just a movie! I can only imagine what Jane Doe experienced that night and what her life is like now, but I seriously doubt she is "over it and moving on" and she may never be.

Those who are calling for compassion and forgiveness for Carrillo need to consider that his victim is more in need of compassion than he is. We can forgive him but that still leaves him accountable, and unfortunately, our "justice" system has failed both his victim and us women--and Efren for that matter.

Efren Carrillo is an adult male, not some kid in his teens or early twenties. His arrogance and irresponsibility go beyond "mere" alcoholism. They are character traits that will take many years and lots of therapy to change, if ever. By getting a "free pass" this time (and the last time in San Diego), he is getting the message that he can get away with it and that it wasn't that big a deal. (Same thing with O.J. Simpson, et al.) He is now free to continue colllecting his huge salary while performing his "service" to the public.

He may come from a "good, good family," but that doesn't make him a good, good man. It just means he may know better but he has chosen not to do it.

This is just one more instance of money and power triumphing over common decency, the corrupt state of our so-called representatives, and the ongoing prevalence of sexism in our society. I would have thought Sonoma County could do better than this.

[Geoff Johnson]

Well, I'm sorry you and so many other so called "progressives" had their mind made up about this whole affair in advance and without the benefit of the facts. That is the kind of behavior I expect of small minded, perhaps bigoted, people. ...

The system did work, a jury composed of 10 women and 2 men unanimously found him NOT GUILTY. ...

He deserves due process and he had his day in court. As I had suspected (but didn't know for sure) this was much ado about not very much. Now, can we just get over it and move on?

Forgive, forget, and "move on"? I think not.

All Carrillo's day in court told us, is that he was found not guilty of the least of possible charges: attempted peeking.

That doesn't mean he was blameless all along, but simply that the prosecution didn't come to court with an appropriate charge that they could prove.

The SRPD was little help. Faced at about 4am with a man in his boxers and socks, who had been an alcoholic since high school (some 15 years), and who had just closed a bar, they judged he was sober.
But they arrested him on suspicion of felony charges that the prosecution would determine couldn't be proven.

So what happens now? Carrillo's political career should be finished. If he doesn't resign, he will almost certainly be replaced at the next election. Meanwhile, he will face constant reminders of the event, and his testimony at the trial.

However, he should still be welcome in the business community. He may even be given a cushy appointed position, in return for his past service to various private interests.

Dishonored as he is, I hope he will soon disappear from public life, and just fade away.

[wisewomn]

Abraham Lincoln said that if you want to know a man's true character, give him some power, ignore what he says, and watch what he does. Mr. Carrillo has shown us all his true character. Please join me and many other Sonoma County residents in demanding his resignation.

If you can't make it to the demonstration tomorrow (Wednesday) at Court House Square from 5-7 PM, then please phone or email all the individual Supes (including Carrillo) demanding Carrillo's resignation. Go to https://supervisors.sonoma-county.org/. And please pass this on to your friends. Thanks.

[sandoak]

I have just emailed all five Supervisors supporting Efren Carrillo in continuing his work as Supervisor.

Abraham Lincoln said that if you want to know a man's true character, give him some power, ignore what he says, and watch what he does. Mr. Carrillo has shown us all his true character. Please join me and many other Sonoma County residents in demanding his resignation.

If you can't make it to the demonstration tomorrow (Wednesday) at Court House Square from 5-7 PM, then please phone or email all the individual Supes (including Carrillo) demanding Carrillo's resignation. Go to https://supervisors.sonoma-county.org/. And please pass this on to your friends. Thanks.

[Shandi]

The system always works, just not always the way we'd like it to.

Proof that we have a system - sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't...

[Shandi]

Not much shocks me these days, and I've had to "get over" a lot of injustice done to me, in my life time. If we hang on to traumas of any kind, it gives power to the perpetrator or event. If you allow your life to be controlled by abusive parents, you give them power over you, even after they're out of your life. Jane Doe has the ability to decide how much power she will continue to give to Carillo. We all have the power to choose a different way of feeling, after seeing a terrifying film that we've actually chosen to view, or choosing to watch the terrifying news so we "know what's happening in the world", or being attacked physically/emotionally. Yes, it's natural to be in shock from any number of things. But it's really in our best interests to "get beyond it", or to choose to continue the trauma for years. Sometimes a financial lawsuit can help us get over it. Maybe Jane Doe can initiate such a lawsuit? Or maybe Carillo will cough up some "restorative justice" in the form of cash? What other compensation could he offer? What does Jane Doe want? What would be helpful to her at this point?

Now, there's a way to "show up" besides with our words. And maybe even a way to get over the shock and disappoinment. How many of you plan to PROTEST tonight? How many will take action? This is something that can actually make a difference, and give a feeling of power where many may feel powerless at the decision handed down by the jury.

At first I was shocked, too, but I hate to say it, but I can see it being the correct answer to the legal question.

I believe Efren was telling the truth when he said he was going over to Jane Doe's for "a drink and sex with the woman", he wasn't going over there for peeking (nor to sexually assault her). Whether he actually peeked or not, is both hard to say/prove and besides the point.

Unfortunately there is not a legal statute against being an egotistical alcoholic with really really poor judgement and taste (his girlfriend had just dropped him off before going over to Jane Doe's! ). It's beyond a shadow of doubt that he's guilty of that, and I'm sure that he has already experienced much punishment for that.

There are at least two further bits of business for him to do to begin to put this unsavory mess behind him, apologize to the victim, and her friends and family (perhaps using restorative justice), and to step down as Supervisor.

Edit:

Apparently he is not planning on stepping down. See this video after his acquittal:

There is a protest being organized for
Wednesday, April 30, 5-7pm in Courthouse Square
to demand his resignation.

[Victoria Street]

The system always works, just not always the way we'd like it to.

I respectfully disagree, Shandi. I don't believe that the system always works. But it's a good system, and, over time, it evolves. I do agree that it doesn't always work the way we'd like it to. Hey! We're individuals! Debate is a good thing - even necessary! Laws and "The System" can only do so much as the moral fabric of society is constantly being tugged at and twisted.

[Geoff Johnson]

I respectfully disagree, Shandi. I don't believe that the system always works. But it's a good system, and, over time, it evolves. I do agree that it doesn't always work the way we'd like it to. Hey! We're individuals! Debate is a good thing - even necessary! Laws and "The System" can only do so much as the moral fabric of society is constantly being tugged at and twisted.

Many laymen don't understand that "The System" operates according to a very detailed set of rules and procedures. What they think is "Common Sense" doesn't apply.

Old pros like Andrian know how the system works -- and at times, how to game it. In this case, it was easy:

"Andrian took the jury's decision as validation of his decision to go to trial.

Instead of being persuaded by salacious details, jurors followed the law, apparently agreeing with the defense that there was no evidence showing Carrillo looked into the apartment, Andrian said.

'It tells me my arguments resonated,' Andrian said. 'You can't be convicted on your own statement. They were lacking independent evidence.' " [my emphasis]

https://www.pressdemocrat.com/articl...0429469#page=0

[KWilson]

And now for a little humor on the subject. Have you heard that John Beck from the PD wrote a song about the case called A Couple of Pliny's (The Ballad of Efren Carrillo)? You can hear it online here:

https://soundcloud.com/user466593039/a-couple-of-plinys-the-ballad-of-efren-carrillo

And the lyrics:

G C
I gotta couple of Plinys
G C
and you on my mind
G C
I'm here in my undies
D G
let's have a good time

so come to you window
I can't see through your blinds
I mighta put my hand through your screen
but is it a crime?

I saw you down at Space 25
I didn't want the night to end
You looked like you wanted some
and so did your friends

So put away your butcher knives
You can see I'm not armed
just a couple of Plinys
I mean you no harm

Remember me I'm your neighbor
I brought you that wine
oh wait are those sirens?
I'm gonna do time

But thanks to that jury
I'm gonna get another chance
Looking back in restrospect
I shoulda worn pants

Effren Carrillo
District 5 Sonoma County Supervisor
campaign headquarters down at the Russian River Brewing Company Santa Rosa

[Nevermind]

Thank you so much for posting! This is just great

And now for a little humor on the subject. Have you heard that John Beck from the PD wrote a song about the case called A Couple of Pliny's (The Ballad of Efren Carrillo)? You can hear it online here:

https://soundcloud.com/user466593039/a-couple-of-plinys-the-ballad-of-efren-carrillo

And the lyrics:

I gotta couple of Plinys
and you on my mind
I'm here in my undies
let's have a good time
...

[oliviathunderkitty]

This post--I've deleted most of it, for brevity's sake--assumes that getting over traumatic events is an act of volition. I do not believe this is true and it is certainly not always true. Why do so many people struggle with PTSD? Why do certain criminals--pedophiles, for example, and domestic abusers--continue to act out? It is quite often because they have not gotten over early traumas.

We have more power over our behavior than we do our feelings and it is often possible to choose the right behavior despite how we feel. I'm not so sure that applies in this instance, as 1)I don't know Jane Doe and 2)it is still quite recent. But if Jane Doe is struggling emotionally, it is not because she has given power to Carrillo. That's simply more blaming of the victim.

We must all come to terms with our own traumas. If they were severe, if we find we can't resolve or reduce their emotional impact, then many of us have options: To seek an effective type of therapy, for example.

Simply choosing "not to give power" to an incident or a person suggests suppression of an experience as an effective approach. It isn't. Sometimes a lot more than direct volition is needed.

. . . If we hang on to traumas of any kind, it gives power to the perpetrator or event. If you allow your life to be controlled by abusive parents, you give them power over you, even after they're out of your life. Jane Doe has the ability to decide how much power she will continue to give to Carillo. . . .

[danargraves]

Jbox; " much ado about not very much"? Move on? Really? That kind of thinking is exactly the problem. I suspect you are a male and who is not aware of subconscious disregard for women. This is the kind of social and religious programing that created this behavior and has brought so much irreverence in the first place. We can never move on until men AND women hold each other in sacred regard and respect.

That starts with waking up and speaking up every time it is in front of each of us and to teach our children and grandchildren such awareness. The trick is to not do it with self righteousness but with honest compassion for the person(s) being oblivious to their own behavior. Sometimes it does take going to court. Even though Efren got off again maybe he will start to evolve but as he refuses to step down, I suspect that he will continue on as usual.

[Victoria Street]

Listen: Santa Rosa police release 911 recordings in Efren Carrillo arrest

https://www.pressdemocrat.com/articl...cles/140429466

[Imagery]

I certainly hope this doesn't get swept under the rug like the last events...
I'm sure everyone will simply forget and in two years, he'll run unopposed until the last two weeks, then happily hold onto his position as supervisor. Anyone remember the Dutra asphalt plant, his vote, and mysterious appearance at a victory party after it passed? Anyone remember the quarry west of the 101, around Penngrove? Does anyone remember Preservation (of the 1%) "Destroy the Environment" Ranch? How about Paul "Ecoterrorist" Hobbs and his destroying whatever he wants wherever he wants without permits in search of more money?
All of these happened BEFORE he ran UNOPPOSED for re-election.

[oliviathunderkitty]

I believe his very first vote, first term, was in support of retail development in Knights Valley that was opposed by virtually all residents there.

All of these happened BEFORE he ran UNOPPOSED for re-election.

[Barry]

I'm sure everyone will simply forget and in two years, ...
...Does anyone remember Preservation (of the 1%) "Destroy the Environment" Ranch? ...

Apparently you forget. Although his silence regarding Preservation Ranch was highly suspicious, it turned out Efren was instrumental in brokering a deal to preserve it that was well received by environmentalists.

https://www.waccobb.net/forums/showt...638#post163638

[wisewomn]

There is a petition for Carrillo to resign currently circulating at change.org:

https://www.change.org/petitions/sup...ase-resign-now

Pass it on.

[jbox]

I certainly hope this doesn't get swept under the rug like the last events...
I'm sure everyone will simply forget and in two years, he'll run unopposed until the last two weeks, then happily hold onto his position as supervisor. Anyone remember the Dutra asphalt plant, his vote, and mysterious appearance at a victory party after it passed? Anyone remember the quarry west of the 101, around Penngrove? Does anyone remember Preservation (of the 1%) "Destroy the Environment" Ranch? How about Paul "Ecoterrorist" Hobbs and his destroying whatever he wants wherever he wants without permits in search of more money?
All of these happened BEFORE he ran UNOPPOSED for re-election.

Uh, check with Ernie Carpenter, I think he and another candidate ran a fairly spirited campaign against Efren, only to lose rather badly. I continue to think most of the so called progressives around here oppose Efren on political grounds and therefore call for his lynching over this personal fuck-up and have very short memories of what really happens.

Thanks to Barry for jogging Imagery's memory about Preservation Ranch. You really need to check yer facts, dude.

[Beverly Schenck]

Please, keep singing your awesome song, the jury couldn't get him out, maybe your song will. In fact let's all sing the song about this sicko. He should have worn pants, and a bag over his head. Sounds good to me.

And now for a little humor on the subject. Have you heard that John Beck from the PD wrote a song about the case called A Couple of Pliny's (The Ballad of Efren Carrillo)? You can hear it online here:

https://soundcloud.com/user466593039/a-couple-of-plinys-the-ballad-of-efren-carrillo

And the lyrics:

I gotta couple of Plinys
and you on my mind
I'm here in my undies
let's have a good time
...

[Geoff Johnson]

There is a petition for Carrillo to resign currently circulating at change.org:

https://www.change.org/petitions/sup...ase-resign-now

Pass it on.

Forwarded this to my group, The Real Santa Rosa.

[spam1]

There is a petition for Carrillo to resign currently circulating at change.org:

https://www.change.org/petitions/sup...ase-resign-now

Pass it on.

yes, indeed. It's the -least- you can do.

("calling out stupid useless online petitions, that's my jihad")