Boycott CVS and shop where?

[Sara S]

When CVS first took over from Long's, I went in to get one item because I didn't want to go all the way to Walmart for just the one thing. The CVS price was more than twice the Walmart price, so I never went back. If you're suckered in by their loss-leaders, you'll end up paying way too much for anything else.

When I learned of the suit (thanks to WACCO), I stopped patronizing CVS, and don't anticipate returning.

[Rustie]

Really, so you shop at Walmart instead of CVS? And that somehow is suppose to be better or make sense? While we're on the subject of consistency, political correctness and corporate monster take-over, not to mention the tainting of our quaint little town, I wonder as I read the rant about CVS how many of you find yourselves grabbing that quick cup of Starbucks Latte. I know, it's hard to refuse when they are so conveniently located just about EVERYWHERE. I particularly appreciate how Sebastopol has at least 3 Starbucks, somehow that never seemed to be a problem for this community............just wondering what the criteria is?

When CVS first took over from Long's, I went in to get one item because I didn't want to go all the way to Walmart for just the one thing. The CVS price was more than twice the Walmart price, so I never went back. If you're suckered in by their loss-leaders, you'll end up paying way too much for anything else.

[Sara S]

Well, read my post again, why don't you, and maybe you'll get why it seems better to me: to save money, at first; then, when CVS tried to elbow its way into a bad traffic spot here, I just wouldn't ever patronize their stores. I make up my own mind about what I do, rather than follow any knee-jerk political-correctness theory.

I never go to Starbuck's either........

Really, so you shop at Walmart instead of CVS? And that somehow is suppose to be better or make sense? While we're on the subject of consistency, political correctness and corporate monster take-over, not to mention the tainting of our quaint little town, I wonder as I read the rant about CVS how many of you find yourselves grabbing that quick cup of Starbucks Latte. I know, it's hard to refuse when they are so conveniently located just about EVERYWHERE. I particularly appreciate how Sebastopol has at least 3 Starbucks, somehow that never seemed to be a problem for this community............just wondering what the criteria is?

[Nancy M Prebilich]

So.... you're all about "Cheap," first and foremost, and somehow driving to Rohnert Park (presumably in your electric fuel efficient car) makes chasing "cheap" ok. And you DON'T go to Starbucks, so you're therefore a more credible consumer... of "cheap." I think the point was, Sebastopol is chalk full of "conscientious" HYPOCRITES! You'll demand "fair trade" when it comes to your corporate coffee/tea/chai/whatever, but claim righteousness in driving to Walmart in Rohnert Park in protest against CVS's corporate bullying/expensive prices. That what I hear.

I too do not wish to see CVS/Chase move into that location. I just wish that the conversation was more intelligent, less hypocritical, and hell of a lot less self-righteous.... excuse me, "concientious!"

If traffic is such an issue, why is there not a stronger campaign to turn Main St. And Pet. Ave back into 2 way streets? Not that this would solve the CVS issue, but if controlling traffic congestion is such an issue, then why isn't this energy being put into solving the traffic issues? Dispite who ends up on that property?

[Barry]

While your point is worthy, Nancy, (though I think misplaced regarding Sara), your venom is not welcome.

There's lots going on the CVS issue. It's a big chain right at the center of Sebastopol, whereas they are welcome to keep their current location (possibly even adding a drive-through there). And it's a particularly "evil" chain at that. There's been a long standing prohibition against drive-through restaurants, but when extended to drug-stores, CVS chose to sue Sebastopol.

It's also a particularly bad corner in general because of the traffic and the 1-way street. Can you imagine people making a left turn into CVS from 12?? What's more, the drugstore is a high volume/ low value transaction use. The car dealership was a perfect low volume/high value use.

There's a place for chains (both in location and their low-cost offerings), and I think most of us (including me) frequent chains from time to time. However the location both in terms of traffic and invading the heart of downtown Sebastopol, combined with their corporate culture makes it a particularly inappropriate use of that site.

So.... you're all about "Cheap," first and foremost, and somehow driving to Rohnert Park (presumably in your electric fuel efficient car) makes chasing "cheap" ok. And you DON'T go to Starbucks, so you're therefore a more credible consumer... of "cheap." I think the point was, Sebastopol is chalk full of "conscientious" HYPOCRITES! You'll demand "fair trade" when it comes to your corporate coffee/tea/chai/whatever, but claim righteousness in driving to Walmart in Rohnert Park in protest against CVS's corporate bullying/expensive prices. That what I hear.

I too do not wish to see CVS/Chase move into that location. I just wish that the conversation was more intelligent, less hypocritical, and hell of a lot less self-righteous.... excuse me, "concientious!"

If traffic is such an issue, why is there not a stronger campaign to turn Main St. And Pet. Ave back into 2 way streets? Not that this would solve the CVS issue, but if controlling traffic congestion is such an issue, then why isn't this energy being put into solving the traffic issues? Dispite who ends up on that property?

[Nancy M Prebilich]

Oh Barry, you and your "venom." While I simply repeat someone's point back to them, and in doing so, point out the absurd and hypocritical, you resort to your character assasignation tactics. Why do you care anyway, you don't even live in Sebastopol.

[Judah L]

Oh Barry, you and your "venom." While I simply repeat someone's point back to them, and in doing so, point out the absurd and hypocritical, you resort to your character assasignation tactics. Why do you care anyway, you don't even live in Sebastopol.

I believe Barry was referring to this quote in particular:
"So.... you're all about "Cheap," first and foremost, and somehow driving to Rohnert Park (presumably in your electric fuel efficient car) makes chasing "cheap" ok. And you DON'T go to Starbucks, so you're therefore a more credible consumer... of "cheap." I think the point was, Sebastopol is chalk full of "conscientious" HYPOCRITES! You'll demand "fair trade" when it comes to your corporate coffee/tea/chai/whatever, but claim righteousness in driving to Walmart in Rohnert Park in protest against CVS's corporate bullying/expensive prices. That what I hear.

I too do not wish to see CVS/Chase move into that location. I just wish that the conversation was more intelligent, less hypocritical, and hell of a lot less self-righteous.... excuse me, "concientious!"

... And we're accusing people of "character assasignation tactics"?
*assassination, btw

My question is, and maybe this is just because I don't live in Sebastopol... Why in the world would anybody be against drive-through pharmacies? That saves people time. My impression of the city-wide ban on drive-through food was that it was a way to ban unhealthy fast food places, not to simply ban people from making purchases of, in this case often life and death necessities, without getting out of their car on the way home or whatever...

By the way, like i said i don't live in Sebastopol, and you're right i really don't care, besides pointing out the hypocrisy of the word "hypocrite" getting thrown around like that.

Either way, thanks for the morning entertainment. Peace and love and all that, right Sebastopol peeps?

[podfish]

My question is, and maybe this is just because I don't live in Sebastopol... Why in the world would anybody be against drive-through pharmacies? That saves people time. My impression of the city-wide ban on drive-through food was that it was a way to ban unhealthy fast food places,

obviously you don't live here, you clearly don't get how green we all really are!! and how little time means out here...


actually, no, it's a real issue, and not related to what you get while you're in your car. It's related to the fact that you are in your car. Cars themselves are an eco disaster, and an idling car is worse than one moving at freeway speeds - even though, moving at freeways speeds around here is more of a concept than an actuality these days. Idling in line, maybe backing up traffic, is something we want to discourage. Development that reinforces people's tendencies to use their cars is a 'bad thing'.

And beyond the eco side of the issue is the social one. Cars are bad for the livability of a downtown too. They may have become a necessary evil, but they're evil. Urban planning by definition is trying to shape behavior by creating an environment that encourages some activities and discourage others.

There's a pretty good consensus here in Wacco that a walkable city is something we should encourage, even over convenience. There are indeed arguments to be made for the benefits of drive-up but they're overwhelmed by the arguments against it. For example, there are other ways for people who find walking difficult to get medications than sitting in traffic. Maybe not as easy for them as driving up, but easy enough that we don't need to sacrifice our town's livability.

[tommy]

Drive thru's have been found to increase traffic in studies by architects, planners, universities, etc. People can sometimes be lazy, and would rather go to a drive thru restaurant or pharmacy, and sit in a line, and be served from their car, than go to a place where they have to park, get out of their car, go into the store, etc. Drive thrus become like a swarming device, creating more traffic, than a store without a drive thru.

It is important for this site, because this intersection is already heavily burdened with traffic, and it is not in the public interest, to create more traffic, with drive thru windows. Since it's a busy intersection, lines of cars waiting to use a drive thru can congest traffic, adding to delays, hot tempers, idling cars creating more smog, etc.

My question is, and maybe this is just because I don't live in Sebastopol... Why in the world would anybody be against drive-through pharmacies? That saves people time. My impression of the city-wide ban on drive-through food was that it was a way to ban unhealthy fast food places, not to simply ban people from making purchases of, in this case often life and death necessities, without getting out of their car on the way home or whatever...

[Judah L]

Drive thru's have been found to increase traffic in studies by architects, planners, universities, etc. People can sometimes be lazy, and would rather go to a drive thru restaurant or pharmacy, and sit in a line, and be served from their car, than go to a place where they have to park, get out of their car, go into the store, etc. Drive thrus become like a swarming device, creating more traffic, than a store without a drive thru.

It is important for this site, because this intersection is already heavily burdened with traffic, and it is not in the public interest, to create more traffic, with drive thru windows. Since it's a busy intersection, lines of cars waiting to use a drive thru can congest traffic, adding to delays, hot tempers, idling cars creating more smog, etc.

Tommy,

Thanks for the breakdown.

I still think it's infringing on people's freedoms to not allow them to purchase things from their car... But I guess you're still allowing online purchases for now so kudos to you all, how progressive.

[Judah L]

Also, anybody notice how SEBASTOPOL SENIOR CENTER expressed gratitude? There's a group who wants to purchase meds from their car on freezing rainy winter afternoons.

It's not JUST YOUR city you guys, you have to share it. Find a way to get what you want without taking away what others want, we learned that in preschool.

[podfish]

Also, anybody notice how SEBASTOPOL SENIOR CENTER expressed gratitude? There's a group who wants to purchase meds from their car on freezing rainy winter afternoons.

It's not JUST YOUR city you guys, you have to share it. Find a way to get what you want without taking away what others want, we learned that in preschool.

"what others want" is a factor, but some of us have already graduated preschool and moved on to tackling problems that can't be solved with preschool logic.
For example, seniors could park, call in on those spiffy new cell-phone thingies, and have a clerk take their medicine out to them. We don't still have gas jockeys like Oregon does, just because some people have limitations that make pumping their own gas hard. I haven't tried it myself (yet) but pumps all have a notice that says help is available on request. Something creative like that might be needed rather than giving in to the status quo. We're not talking about taking away a god-given right, or doing something arbitrary - this issue is multifaceted and of enough importance to deserve some effort. As Dean Wormer pointed out, there are ways to live that we should be willing to change.

[tommy]

Judah,

While I'm all for personal freedom, I live in a more and more crowded planet, where the expression of my freedom can limit the freedom of others. Smoking bans inside and outside cafes and restaurants indicate that it's not in the interest of the great majority, for a few smokers to pollute the air, that the majority of nonsmokers have to breath. Therefore smokers lose their freedom to smoke in public places - they have to go into their house, their car, someplace where the public does not gather.

This pretty trivial example can be broadened to include "clean air days" such as today, where people are asked not to burn wood, which creates soot in the air, that others have to breath, in drought and "no air cleansing rain days" like we've been having.

It ultimately leads to issues of global warming. Just because I live in the US, drive around alot, idle my car in pharmacy and fast food drive ins, may power my house from coal burning power plants... all of which lead to the warming of the atmosphere, the rise of the oceans, typhoons and hurricanes, loss of live and housing in poorer countries of the south. If I imagine living in the Philippines, of Bangladesh, or the Maldives, I'm less likely to contribute to global warming, less insistent on maintaining my personal freedom at the cost of lives of others, because I know the consequences. I'm less selfish, less insistent on me me me, more compassionate.

Tommy,

Thanks for the breakdown.

I still think it's infringing on people's freedoms to not allow them to purchase things from their car... But I guess you're still allowing online purchases for now so kudos to you all, how progressive.

[Nancy M Prebilich]

Judah, I think you are confused by what is a self-evident inalienable right/"freedom" and what is merely convenience and a preference. To have your preference or idea of convenience catered to is very different from infringing upon your "rights" and "freedom."

[photolite]

What no one here seems willing to address is the fact that the drive thru ban was initiated after CVS jumped through a million hoops to satisfy the town and were given an A-OK only to have the rules changed after committing to the site. I believe the new city council committed a major miscalculation by pissing off a big dog with a fierce bite. The 300k will be a drop in the bucket by the time this is resolved and I suspect they'll get their way and we'll be fleeced by the lawyers. And it really is our own short sighted fault. Too bad for our schools, libraries, social welfare programs, etc. when the $$$ just ain't there because we were too busy tilting at windmills.
We'll see.

Judah, I think you are confused by what is a self-evident inalienable right/"freedom" and what is merely conscientious and a preference. To have your preference or idea of convenience catered to is very different from infringing upon your "rights" and "freedom."

[Judah L]

Judah,

While I'm all for personal freedom, I live in a more and more crowded planet, where the expression of my freedom can limit the freedom of others. Smoking bans inside and outside cafes and restaurants indicate that it's not in the interest of the great majority, for a few smokers to pollute the air, that the majority of nonsmokers have to breath. Therefore smokers lose their freedom to smoke in public places - they have to go into their house, their car, someplace where the public does not gather.

This pretty trivial example can be broadened to include "clean air days" such as today, where people are asked not to burn wood, which creates soot in the air, that others have to breath, in drought and "no air cleansing rain days" like we've been having.

It ultimately leads to issues of global warming. Just because I live in the US, drive around alot, idle my car in pharmacy and fast food drive ins, may power my house from coal burning power plants... all of which lead to the warming of the atmosphere, the rise of the oceans, typhoons and hurricanes, loss of live and housing in poorer countries of the south. If I imagine living in the Philippines, of Bangladesh, or the Maldives, I'm less likely to contribute to global warming, less insistent on maintaining my personal freedom at the cost of lives of others, because I know the consequences. I'm less selfish, less insistent on me me me, more compassionate.

Lol you literally just said, "I'm going to ban people from doing something that I don't like and I'm going to feel more compassionate, less selfish, less insistent on me me me." Hahaha do you people read your posts before making them public or are you just too eager to be "punchy"?

​Ps
My fire on today's "no burn day" for you city folk, feels GREAT

[Judah L]

What no one here seems willing to address is the fact that the drive thru ban was initiated after CVS jumped through a million hoops to satisfy the town and were given an A-OK only to have the rules changed after committing to the site...

Pointing out that this is stupid, pointless and a waste of time... That's not what I expressed? Who cares? The funny thing is, if people don't use the fuckin drive-through then the company will close it to make room for more people to park and shop inside. Your dollar makes these decisions, not your online panty-bunching. Don't shop there. They'll relocate. You're obviously all freaked out because you're afraid that the majority isn't with you, and you're banking (probably safely in this case) that these chain consumers won't be the ones showing up to vote on matters that affect them. Not an uncommon tactic in politics. If your town is so progressive and green then a cvs won't stay afloat anyway. Otherwise you're not the majority and you're all just trying to impose your ideals onto others.
Good hippies.

[Nancy M Prebilich]

What no one here seems willing to address is the fact that the drive thru ban was initiated after CVS jumped through a million hoops to satisfy the town and were given an A-OK only to have the rules changed after committing to the site. I believe the new city council committed a major miscalculation by pissing off a big dog with a fierce bite. The 300k will be a drop in the bucket by the time this is resolved and I suspect they'll get their way and we'll be fleeced by the lawyers. And it really is our own short sighted fault. Too bad for our schools, libraries, social welfare programs, etc. when the $$$ just ain't there because we were too busy tilting at windmills.
We'll see.

I totally agree with you Photolite! I think the city has seriously screwed themselves by trying to do too little too late. Like I've said, I don't want to see CVS/Chase go into that location (or any big box chain in any downtown core location), but there are rules and procedures and CVS/Chase followed them to get what they wanted, the city manipulated them, the rules and procedures that is, to get what they wanted-after the fact. I think both Patrick Slayter and Kathleen Shafer got a bum wrap because I know they both felt the same way.

I blame our City Attorney for poor council, which I believe was just job security for him; give the "crazies" what they want, get the city in deep, so he has to be the one to get us out, all the while double dipping as City Attorney and City Manager.

I DON'T believe drive-thru's are "necessary," I also think Seb. lost a HUGE opportunity when we lost Amy's Kitchen moving into the Pasta Bela location because of the same ordinance and short sightedness. The citizens of this town need to stop demanding their "wants" and start thinking about how to get their wants through strategic, ECONOMICALLY SUSTAINABLE means. For all the talk of "sustainability" around here- this ain't it because not only are we going to loose, but we'll be in the poor house when we're done AND no decent business will want to deal with Sebastopol.

There's too much "progressive" reaction in Seb., not actual progressive forethought. We should have taken the hit with CVS/Chase, learned our lesson, and implemented policy for the FUTURE. But because we have very few intelligent debates in this town, we're left with the inmates running the asylum.

But now all those who rallied for the memorandum.... open up YOUR pocketbooks! You wanted this because you thought it the healthiest, greenest, most contientious way to live... YOU pay for it!! We'll all be eternally grateful. But that won't happen. Just like the protesting, boycotting, demonstrating in front of the current CVS and Chase aren't happening. If you want to stop them this late in the game you need national attention. You need to promote your Citta Slow city (get THAT International community backing you) and show the world how CVS/Chase is going to ruin that mission because although they followed all the procedures, they don't "CARE." It's about imaging and branding. Stop them by using THEIR OWN GAME! They played ours and won- they GOT APPROVED! Now their just going to take us to the cleaners too.

I want to know what's going on between the city and Frizelle-Enos now. GET IN FRONT OF THAT ONE SEBASTOPOL!! Help FE rebuild without a lot of crap, otherwise we'll "loose" that whole street. Pay attention, cut your losses, and use what you still have to change what you don't like.

[Barry]

I have granted Judah L's request to be removed from this board. In fairness to him, he requested to leave a few days ago, before his latest tirade, however I've been mostly off-line while taking care of my mom. BTW, he listed his real name as "FuckSebastopol Ha" so apparently he had an axe to grind.

For those of you who were offended by his comments, please accept my apologies. I have removed his recent more objectionable posts.

It's a pity he couldn't be a bit more respectful and thoughtful while presenting his viewpoint, because I think it could have made for a worthy and interesting discussion.

[Rustie]

You granted Judah's request to be removed - in fairness to him he requested days ago. What am I missing, is he obliged to respond if he was not removed when requested? What fairness is necessary, I'm surprised you didn't bitch slap him. I guess you removed his last post to Nancy - Wow - do we have a button to remove this guy from society? Seriously Barry, I have seen you call out folks for far less than this psycho - what's up?

I have granted Judah L's request to be removed from this board. In fairness to him, he requested to leave a few days ago, before his latest tirade, however I've been mostly off-line while taking care of my mom. BTW, he listed his real name as "FuckSebastopol Ha" so apparently he had an axe to grind.

For those of you who were offended by his comments, please accept my apologies. I have removed his recent more objectionable posts.

It's a pity he couldn't be a bit more respectful and thoughtful while presenting his viewpoint, because I think it could have made for a worthy and interesting discussion.

[Peacetown Jonathan]

Judith and Photolite, we are each entitled to our own opinions but not our own facts. Out community would be better served if folks were more cautious before repeating the lie that CVS played by the rules and therefore "deserves" to put their drive through window at the most congested traffic crossroads of our city.

Like a number of concerned citizens, I attended the hearings over the CVS approval process. As an investigative legal and financial journalist, I also have a pretty developed sense of the legal analysis over this issue, and have been writing about it here on Wacco and in other local media.

For readers interested in the facts, here are two in depth Wacco posts about the troubling role of the City's Planning Director in railroading the process through its rules (overturning the legally empowered and deliberative Planning Commission, which found that CVS DID NOT revise its design adequately, despite clear instructions that a drive through window was incompatible with our pedestrian friendly General Plan
https://www.waccobb.net/forums/showt...444#post174444

And the likely rigging of the traffic report:, which found, despite all evidence to the contrary, that 1,800 additional car trips a day to the busiest intersection in West County would not add more than FIVE SECONDS to traffic
https://www.waccobb.net/forums/showt...907#post155907

I would also like to dispense with the well-marketed falsehood, promoted by CVS lobbyists and their supporters, with help from the popularly un-elected "under the radar" CVS cheerleader and fact distorter Kathleen Shaffer, that this CVS deal was needed, or would even be beneficial, to the local economy.

I wrote earlier in the week about this. To readers of this here at Wacco, I would like to point out that in the nearly two years since I have been reporting on this, nobody has ever presented evidence contradictory to the main conclusions that I draw.

Instead of slinging mud at our courageous Council Members now willing to stand for the cities who elected
them, (instead of boosters of the Pelini family, eager to sell this property to the highest bidder, despite the costs, in traffic and the diminishment of our ecology and pedestrian downtown), instead of repeating the discredited rhetoric of current Council Member Slayter and former Council Members Shaffer and Wilson that CVS "played by the rules so their hands were tied" I invite anyone to present FACTS that counter those conclusions that have been exposed here on Wacco, namely:

1) That the CVS project will not provide a net benefit to Sebastopol's economy

2) That the traffic report presents a suspicious and entirely inaccurate conclusion that there will be less than a five second impact on traffic heading East on Bodega Avenue

3) That Planning Director Kenyon Webster provided misleading data to support a negative traffic declaration and avoid an Environmental Impact Statement

4) That Planning Director Kenyon Webster exceeded his professional role as an advisor to our elected representatives, by expressing his opinion that The city's concerns for CVS' design had been met as a finding, as opposed to an opinion.

This post would be an excellent place to transparently and publicly present facts contrary to these assertions.

Until somebody does, readers here can assume that these statements are factually uncontested, and that all the CVS boosters have to persuade is the same maligning of our responsive and responsible Council members Gurney, Keyes, Jacob and Eder, as well as our fine City Manager Larry McLaughlin, using the same deceptive rhetoric that brought us here in the first place.

On the subject of economic impact: (see this)

[podfish]

You granted Judah's request to be removed - "in fairness to him he requested days ago." What am I missing

I was confused by that too. Not that I was so offended - I have a high tolerance for rants by people I don't know - but Barry, do you mean that in effect he'd said "stop me before I kill again" and since you didn't, bad on you??

[Dixon]

Thanks for the update, Barry.

...he listed his real name as "FuckSebastopol Ha" ...

A good hint that he'd turn out to be a troll.
I'm confused about something. I thought that people weren't allowed to join under an obviously fake name (a policy I heartily endorse). Was he just a guest? If so, where was his "real name" listed?

[Barry]

I was confused by that too. Not that I was so offended - I have a high tolerance for rants by people I don't know - but Barry, do you mean that in effect he'd said "stop me before I kill again" and since you didn't, bad on you??

Correct! I know, a bit overly generous...

I'm confused about something. I thought that people weren't allowed to join under an obviously fake name (a policy I heartily endorse). Was he just a guest? If so, where was his "real name" listed?

Once he started posting more "aggressively" I checked out his profile and saw his name. This is the sort of thing I usually follow up on, but I was busy taking care of my mom who is recovering from re-breaking her hip in Orange County. Thus my remiss above for not removing him earlier.

[Glia]

The carhop approach makes a lot of sense. It solves the problem (people with mobility issues getting their prescription medication), does not create more pollution than any other trip to the drug store, and also creates paid work for the person doing the carhopping.

Another possible solution to the problem is requiring CVS to deliver prescriptions to people who cannot make it over to the drugstore or are willing to pay for the convenience. The city could even go so far as to require the use of an all-electric vehicle charged by solar cells to make these deliveries.

Focus on the ends rather than the means!

... For example, seniors could park, call in on those spiffy new cell-phone thingies, and have a clerk take their medicine out to them.

[Nancy M Prebilich]

This is not you being overly generous or remiss because you're busy taking care of your mother.... this is just YOU, a totally bias and inconsistent, bad moderator. For all the crap you've given me, this guy made me look like a frick'n saint. You do yourself even further injustice using your mother as your excuse. I do wish your mother well and hope for a speedy recovery.

Correct! I know, a bit overly generous...

Once he started posting more "aggressively" I checked out his profile and saw his name. This is the sort of thing I usually follow up on, but I was busy taking care of my mom who is recovering from re-breaking her hip in Orange County. Thus my remiss above for not removing him earlier.

[Barry]

This is not you being overly generous or remiss because you're busy taking care of your mother.... this is just YOU, a totally bias and inconsistent, bad moderator. For all the crap you've given me, this guy made me look like a frick'n saint. You do yourself even further injustice using your mother as your excuse. I do wish your mother well and hope for a speedy recovery.

And a Merry Christmas to you, too, Nancy.
I hope you notice that you are still here and he is not, despite many requests to the contrary.
And just for a further bit of "injustice" I'll share that it's my birthday in 44 minutes

[Nancy M Prebilich]

I love how you JUST proved my point. (BTW, I can easily counter your "many requests to the contrary" with MANY private messages of support. Am I suppose to be intimidated into submission by such statements?!)

...and although I didn't wish you a Merry Christmas to begin with, I will extend one now to you, in all sincerity... because I can. Happy Holidays Barry, to you and yours!

And a Merry Christmas to you, too, Nancy.
I hope you notice that you are still here and he is not, despite many requests to the contrary.
And just for a further bit of "injustice" I'll share that it's my birthday in 44 minutes

[podfish]

anyone who is trying to make this BB all full of sweetness and light fails to fully appreciate our Wacco community, I think... good job, Barry! happy birthday and merry christmas.

[eeeeeeow]

So angry.

This is not you being overly generous or remiss because you're busy taking care of your mother.... this is just YOU, a totally bias and inconsistent, bad moderator. For all the crap you've given me, this guy made me look like a frick'n saint. You do yourself even further injustice using your mother as your excuse. I do wish your mother well and hope for a speedy recovery.