Sebastopol police: lights and sirens

[pbrinton]

During the three weeks or so that I have been manning my photo show at the Risk Press Gallery (just up the hill from the Village Bakery) I would estimate that about every other day (and twice on at least one day) I have observed Sebastopol PD cars going full speed with lights and sirens up or down this busy street. In the majority of cases it has been one cruiser only, occasionally two or even three, and on very rare occasions with either an ambulance or fire engine in close attendance. This is also not a rare occurrence on my frequent walks around Sebastopol.

It is hard for me to imagine in a relatively orderly small town, what circumstances make this kind of behavior necessary. What kinds of emergencies are they responding to that justify the risks involved in driving 60 miles an hour or so through heavy traffic just to arrive a couple of minutes earlier?

I would be very curious to know what instructions are given to SPD officers about how fast they are to respond to what kinds of situations, and see a list of such emergencies for the last few weeks.

Patrick Brinton

[navgal]

It is most likely response to an ambulance assist call. They take them very seriously and if an old person falls they are often there before the ambulance to offer assistance. I did a ride along with them and found out what a night is like for them. I also have to write the Police Blotter. So rest assured. If you should have a health problem (or our mom or grandpa) they will get there asap.

[Tom95472]

Suggest you go see Chief Weaver and ask him. He doesn't bite.
Tom

[Barry]

I did. I'll post about that tomorrow.

Suggest you go see Chief Weaver and ask him. He doesn't bite.
Tom

[MichaelK]

The majority of police responses are for medical emergencies, there are about 500 per year in the City. Between police and fire, response times average between 2 to 3 minutes. Speaking from personal experience, this is a really good thing. Having the police arrive first allows them to assess the urgency of the issue and how other emergency personnel should respond.

Michael Kyes,
Mayor, City of Sebastopol

[Tom95472]

Yes, and they have medical training too & a shocker to start your heart up.

[rossmen]

i saw the end of one of these responses, in front of pacific market a few days ago. there was a fender bender between two drivers, both had stopped to discuss the accident. always remember that sebastopol is a training ground. weaver doubles the force by welcoming reserve(volunteer) officers. i wish he would give them bikes or good walking shoes instead of cruisers.

[Barry]

I've attached the Sebastopol Police Media Bulletin. It does not contain all incidents. There were a total of 961 incidents logged between September 1st and 20th.

From Chief Weaver:

"Our officers respond with their lights and siren activated to all medical calls within the City Limits and police calls where violence is in progress or believed imminent. There is more of that in Sebastopol than most people know.

So far in September (twenty days), we've responded to twenty-six medical aide calls. That is more than one "lights and siren" response each day.

That does not include the fights (nineteen calls in September) and assaults (three calls in September) and Domestic Violence (four calls in September).

So, between the medical calls, fights, assaults, and domestic violence calls, officers have responded "lights and siren" about fifty-two times so far in September, a bit more than twice a day."

Also note that both Sheriff's Dept and Highway Patrol cruisers can and do use their "lights and sirens" in Sebastopol as well.

[sebastacat]

Quit complaining!

Our Sebastopol Police force is doing an excellent job protecting our small town and looking after our citizens. During the time that my family and I had a business here, we found them to be pleasant, professional and respectable.

On one very rare occasion when I had to call the police to report an incident of shoplifting, they were there in very short order and apprehended the person who had shoplifted from us several times before.

Also, as Mayor Keyes has correctly pointed out, the police are often the first responders to a medical emergency.

You say that you can't imagine "what circumstances make this kind of behavior necessary." I will point out to you that a few seconds can make a huge difference between life and death for someone who has had a heart attack. I know, because my dad had one, and his doctor told me so. And that is true for several other medical emergencies as well.

So the sound of blaring sirens disturbing our peace occasionally in our wonderful little hamlet we call home is a small price to pay in the larger scheme of things - especially when that sound could be helping to save a life.

[dawnaz]

Quit complaining....
Hey! We have a right to find out what's going on with our local police and fire dept. and our community in general. We aren't looking for emotional responses. We're looking for facts.
I live downtown and I too have been curious about the increase in police and the amount of sirens I hear from both police and fire.
I have been made aware of the dangers of being in close vacinity of the high decimal sirens; such as with fire engines, especially for young children. Perenant damage can be made to their hearing.

So. Hey. Let's stay aware without feeling we're complaining.

[pbrinton]

I made a separate thread for this question because I wanted to keep it distinct from the thread complaining about police over-enforcement. I feel that this post and the one it was responding to belong better in that discussion. My concern was more about public safety than over-enforcement.

Patrick Brinton

originally envisioned by who, exactly?

[pbrinton]

This is the second time in as many days that you have presumed to direct my activities. You do realize, I trust, that WACCO has a mechanism by which you can block all posts from a particular person. If you are so unhappy with how I choose to spend my time and energies, I would strongly encourage you to use it. I promise you it will cause me no distress.

Patrick Brinton

Quit complaining!

[pbrinton]

Thank you, Barry, for your research in response to my question (not complaint!). I had not realized just how many emergency calls the SPD responds to every year, so I do see that there are two sides to the question.

Also in the interests of full disclosure, I came of age in the sixties, and I do retain vestiges of prejudice regarding law enforcement agencies. However I find myself with some lingering questions.

First, I would like to make clear the reason for my concern. I was not concerned about the noise (though in the downtown area with its sound reflecting surfaces that is certainly an issue) but rather about the public safety aspect. When deciding on a course of action, we must consider the cost as well as the benefit, and find a way to balance the two. It is not enough to say "We are on a life-saving mission" to justify driving at high speeds on crowded streets. You must show that the benefits of doing this outweigh the risks.

For risks there are, and in my estimation serious ones. It is not always clear which direction the sirens are coming from. In a built-up area the sound bounces around, so someone could move into danger in the impression that they were clearing the way. Those who are strong and alert and in full possession of their faculties may have little trouble knowing what to do when the see red lights and hear sirens. Unfortunately there are many people who do not think clearly under stress, and many people find red lights and sirens very stressful. There are mothers pushing strollers with older children in tow, often burdened with shopping bags; old people, both drivers and pedestrians, who may get confused and move the wrong way; animals that do not have a strong grasp on the rules; it is not hard to think of many opportunities for disaster.

Then in assessing the level of risk we must consider the state of mind of the officer. There is a strong tendency for someone in this situation to become target-fixated; his attention is on getting to the emergency as quickly as possible, and he may take unwarranted risks to do so. There is also a tendency to react to obstacles with anger, and making split-second decisions when angry is never a good idea. I am not, of course, saying that all of these apply at all times; it may well be that they have training in how to keep cool under pressure. I am saying that as you add tendency to tendency (and I have only described a few of the many that come to mind) and multiply by the number of high-speed incidents, the risk factors become uncomfortably large.

So what are we gaining in return for these risks? According to MapQuest, from Bloomfield Road to Occidental Road is 4.5 miles, and takes 7 minutes in normal traffic conditions. Both locations are outside the town limits. At 60 mph this distance takes 4.5 minutes, so we are saving 2.5 minutes. Shorter trips involves smaller gains. We have been told here that in many medical emergencies a delay of mere seconds can mean the difference between life and death. The evidence offered was the word of a doctor. I am not sure I would accept this as an unbiased source. Doctors have an economic incentive in making people believe they should seek their services without delay. I would prefer more statistically based evidence; what proportion of medical emergencies turn on such fine timing? Is it possible to classify calls so that in cases where timing was not so critical the risks can be avoided? Are these matters already taken into account? It would be comforting to know that they were.

Furthermore I would feel better if I knew that all the officers who are authorized to drive this way were specially trained in high-speed driving. I know that Sebastopol uses officers from other jurisdictions as reserves; are all of these officers vetted for their ability to drive safely at high speed? Many of them seem young; what experience do they have?

Someone suggested I go talk to Chief Weaver, and I am willing to do that, but first I thought I would see if any of this was already known.

Patrick Brinton

[Barry]

...For risks there are, and in my estimation serious ones. It is not always clear which direction the sirens are coming from. In a built-up area the sound bounces around, so someone could move into danger in the impression that they were clearing the way. Those who are strong and alert and in full possession of their faculties may have little trouble knowing what to do when the see red lights and hear sirens. Unfortunately there are many people who do not think clearly under stress, and many people find red lights and sirens very stressful. There are mothers pushing strollers with older children in tow, often burdened with shopping bags; old people, both drivers and pedestrians, who may get confused and move the wrong way; animals that do not have a strong grasp on the rules; it is not hard to think of many opportunities for disaster....

I contacted Chief Weaver regarding this and he was kind enough to send the following reply:

All of our officers receive training in emergency driving, both during the police academy and thereafter, both behind the wheel and in a driving simulator. They have on-going training on our Emergency Driving Policy and Procedure as well.

When dealing with a medical emergency, violence in progress, or potentially imminent violence, seconds do matter. If someone is choking, seizing, having a heart attack or stroke, seconds can make the difference between life and death. When responding to violence in progress or imminent violence, seconds also matter. When a woman is being beaten by her husband, a grandmother being physically attacked by her grandson, or two men are throwing blows behind a bar {all of which have occurred within this month so far} it is important to get there as quickly, and safely, as possible to stop the violence and prevent further escalation of violence.

The proof of the officers training and compliance with our Policy and Procedure is the lack of collisions involving our officers while driving with their lights and sirens on. It has been many, many years since our officers caused a collision by their emergency driving. Contrast that with the many times per year we save lives and prevent injury.

Just for clarity, our Reserve Police Officers do not work for other agencies; they work for the Sebastopol Police Department. Therefore, they have the same training during the police academy and thereafter as the full-time police officers.

Also just for clarity, we have not modified our response criteria since I've worked for the Sebastopol Police Department. We respond with our lights and sirens on when, based on all of the information known to us and our training and experience, we believe there is a medical necessity or the need to prevent death or injury due to a violence act in progress or that we feel is imminent.

I hope this information is helpful.

Chief Weaver

[pbrinton]

Thank you for that; it does make me feel better. I am glad I asked, rather than just stewing about it! Please pass on my thanks to Chief Weaver.

Patrick Brinton

All of our officers receive training in emergency driving, ...

[Barry]

I have moved several of the posts on this thread to a new thread in General Community call "Level of Local Police Enforcement". Let's keep this thread about "lights and sirens".

[Barry]

Thank you for that; it does make me feel better. I am glad I asked, rather than just stewing about it! Please pass on my thanks to Chief Weaver.

"Thanks" passed and received!

Chief Weaver also added the following comments:

Folks are always welcome to stop by and ask questions about our operations and/or share their concerns. It's best if they call ahead to make an appointment but, if they drop by and I'm free, then I'll meet with them as well.

One of the best things about us responding to medical calls is that we can often cancel the fire truck and ambulance or have them reduce their response so they don't need to use their lights and sirens. Since the fire trucks are so large and since the ambulances often come from great distances, it is a very good thing if they can be prevented from unnecessarily driving "light and siren" to a call. Same thing with fires. We respond to all fire calls, many of which we can handle with a fire extinguisher, thereby preventing a larger fire and reducing the need for multiple fire trucks to respond with lights and sirens on.

Chief Weaver