Flu Shots?

[Barry]

I got the flu this year. Chances are you did too. Not very fun, plus you're out of commission for a week or two!

I haven't gotten a flu vaccine before, figuring the vaccine might be more harmful than the flu, I'm not in a high risk group (but getting closer every year!) and it may not be effective.

I'm considering getting one next year.

What's your experience been?
Have you gotten a flu shot?
Did you get the flu anyway or not?
(The CDC Reports the shot is only 60% effective)

Did you not get flu shot?
Why not?
Did you get the flu?
Will you get one next year?

[The A Team]

I got the flu this year. Chances are you did too. Not very fun, plus you're out of commission for a week or two!

I haven't gotten a flu vaccine before, figuring the vaccine might be more harmful than the flu, I'm not in a high risk group (but getting closer every year!) and it may not be effective.

I'm considering getting one next year.

What's your experience been?
Have you gotten a flu shot?
Did you get the flu anyway or not?
(The CDC Reports the shot is only 60% effective)

Did you not get flu shot?
Why not?
Did you get the flu?
Will you get one next year?

Hi Barry,

We use the method below. When I remember to do this,I don't get the flu,
also everyday I drink homemade Kombucha mixed with Elderberry syrup.

Dr. Vinay Goyal is an MBBS,DRM,DNB (Intensivist and Thyroid specialist)
having clinical experience of over 20 years.
The following message given by him, I feel makes a lot of sense and is
important for all to know.

The only portals of entry are the nostrils and mouth/throat. In a
global epidemic of this nature, it's almost impossible to avoid coming
into contact with H1N1 in spite of all precautions. Contact with H1N1 is
not so much of a problem as proliferation is.

While you are still healthy and not showing any symptoms of H1N1
infection, in order to prevent proliferation, aggravation of symptoms
and development of secondary infections, some very simple steps,
can be practiced:

1. Frequent hand-washing.

2. "Hands-off-the-face" approach. Resist all temptations to touch any
part of face (unless you want to eat, bathe ).

3. *Gargle twice a day with warm salt water (use Listerine if you don't
trust salt). *H1N1 takes 2-3 days after initial infection in the throat/
nasal cavity to proliferate and show characteristic symptoms. Simple
gargling prevents proliferation. In a way, gargling with salt water has
the same effect on a healthy individual that Tamiflu has on an infected
one. Don't underestimate this simple, inexpensive and powerful
preventative method.

4. Similar to 3 above, *clean your nostrils at least once every day with
warm salt water. Blowing the nose hard once a day and swabbing both nostrils with cotton buds dipped in
warm salt water is very effective in bringing down viral population.

5. *Boost your natural immunity with foods that are rich in Vitamin C
(cherries and citrus fruits). *If you have to supplement with Vitamin
C tablets, make sure that it also has Zinc to boost absorption.

6. *Drink as much of warm liquids (tea, coffee, etc) as you can.
*Drinking warm liquids has the same effect as gargling, but in the
reverse direction. They wash off proliferating viruses from the throat
into the stomach where they cannot survive, proliferate or do any harm.

Andrea

ps If you have a pine tree near your house- pine needle tea pack s a punch.
It has 6x the Vitamin C as citrus and is delicious.

[Barry]

Hi Barry,

We use the method below. ...

Thanks for the good info, Andrea!

Just to be clear, although I used the cartoon that referenced H1N1, I was speaking/asking about flu and flu shots in general, not just H1N1, which doesn't seem prevalent this year.

When I remember to do this,I don't get the flu

Ah, there's the rub: remembering to do all that! Your words imply that you don't always remember. Have you gotten the flu since you first started the regimen you posted?

[spam1]

I travel a lot for my job. Jet=flu factory. I try to get a flu vaccine as soon as it comes out. So far no flu, but a really good case of "intestinal distress" from my last trip to China. Cipro fixed in 4 hours. Now I always carry that too.

[The A Team]

I didn't do it last year and got the flu once. This year and previous years I've used that method & stayed well year round. It works well for any airborne flu virus. This year so far , so good.
Dr.Goyal's notes were in response to clinics wanting to stockpile Tamiflu. But being that H1N1 is a mother of a virus, this method is a great way to avoid the less robust colds etc.

[Bird Watcher]

[What's your experience been?
Have you gotten a flu shot?
Did you get the flu anyway or not?
(The CDC Reports the shot is only 60% effective)]

I've obtained a flu shot for the past 3 years (I just turned 57). Have not gotten the flu since 1994 (such a miserable experience that I remember the year!), but want to reduce chances by any percentage. BTW, last fall I either heard or read a debunking of the theory of getting the flu from its vaccine. And I have never felt any side effects. Planning to continue to get the annual shot.

[occihoff]

I've gotten the flu shots for more years than I can count and--thank god!-- have never gotten flu since. So far I've forgotten to do it this year, and so far have also not gotten flu. Thanks for reminding me! I really don't know what the paranoia against flu shots is all about. I'm so grateful for them!

[Artaloha]

Hi Barry: I have been getting flu shots
for several years now, and I must say that
I am mighty pleased that I have. I have NOT
gotten the flu once in all these years, whereas
before I got it a couple of times. My doctor and
Medicare insist that I get the shot yearly, and
it is very much to my advantage that I do.
I used to be anti-shots, but now I'm older and have
copd and emphysema, flu could kill me. I suggest
you start getting your flu shot yearly around October; that
will carry you through the season.
Stay well!
Leyland

I got the flu this year. Chances are you did too. Not very fun, plus you're out of commission for a week or two!

I haven't gotten a flu vaccine before, figuring the vaccine might be more harmful than the flu, I'm not in a high risk group (but getting closer every year!) and it may not be effective.

I'm considering getting one next year.

What's your experience been?
Have you gotten a flu shot?
Did you get the flu anyway or not?
(The CDC Reports the shot is only 60% effective)

Did you not get flu shot?
Why not?
Did you get the flu?
Will you get one next year?

[elienos]

Well, I have never had a flu shot. I am 36 and have had the flu twice as far as I can remember. I had it when I was ten (the first time I remember) and then when I was 21. I might have had a 24 hour flu 8 years ago but not sure. I don't get the flu shot cause I already get sick less then everyone else, so why mess with my immune system. My daughter hasn't gotten a flu shot ever as well. She is 6. She might have had the flu up to 3-4 times each time for a week or less. No flu this year. She also gets sick less often than the kids around us (except the year she started preschool, she was sick almost all year), so, same thing, why mess with a great immune system. The tell you the thruth neither of us have hardly even had a cold this winter season...

Also, they say about 50% of times you think you have the flu you don't. There are many diseases and viruses that give you "flu-like symptoms." Usually, even when a doctor says you have the flu, the actual diagnoses is "flu-like symptoms."

[wbreitman]

Hi Barry,

I've received a flu shot every year for the last 20 years at least. No flu, no problems, no reactions. I'm 73.

W

[sandoak]

The paranoia about flu shots comes from the occasional bad reaction. Here's an example. My mother's neighbor got his first flu shot at age 60-something. He became completely paralyzed, and spent nearly a year in the hospital. I think he has regained his ability to speak and most of his mobility, but still uses a wheelchair. I've heard of worse reactions, but this is the one that affected someone I know personally.

I also know people who get flu shots every year and are fine.

And a cautionary note about nasal cleaning. In some parts of the country the public water supply carries a microscopic parasite that can find its way to the brain via the nasal passages. I don't know whether our water supply has it, but you might want to boil any water you're putting up your nose. This little bug is apparently a new side effect of civilization.

I've gotten the flu shots for more years than I can count and--thank god!-- have never gotten flu since. So far I've forgotten to do it this year, and so far have also not gotten flu. Thanks for reminding me! I really don't know what the paranoia against flu shots is all about. I'm so grateful for them!

[tezor]

I've been in the fire service for 32 years, and drove an ambulance for 8 of those. I've responded to all sorts of sick folk. I've never had a flu shot, and don't intend to start. I have had the flu once or twice, but I couldn't trace it back to exposures I've experienced. I did have to get the Hepatitus B shot series or I couldn't volunteer. I think a stimulated immune system, meaning lots of good food, water, rest, a positive attitude (damn I'm stuck with just attitude) and being as happy as you can is all you need. Best of luck out there.

[phillip123]

For years all the hype was enough for me to avoid the flu shot.
Eight years ago I changed my concerns. Have never had a cold or
flu in eight years!

[Imagery]

The last time I was asked to get a flu shot (and did) was the last time I had the full-blown flu. Since reading up on what's in the 'vaccine' that they try to talk me into, I think I'll pass. I suffer from a cold now and then (and currently have one), but nothing as bad as the flu (that kept me out of work for three weeks).

[Shandi]

I'm one of the fortunate few who rarely get sick with a cold or flu like symptoms. Up until my 60's I never went to a doctor except deliver my babies, and fix broken bones from a car accident. I had to see an endochronologist for my hyper thyroid, and he wanted to do radiation. I studied up on it, and said "no way!". He disapproved of people trying to find out about their diseases through online information, and pointed to his dipolmas on the wall. He was the most arrogant man I've ever met, but only one of 2 endochronolists in Marin County. The other one was a woman....just as arrogant! I chose to take the medicine which was very inexpensive, and quit after about a year. My thyroid had normalized itself. (I think they said I'd have to take it for the rest of my life....oh well, so much for that theory.)

I've also done a lot of reading about flu shots, and I'm sure many of you have also. My intuition tells me not to get them. And now that I'm "older" my Kaiser GP stresses that I need to get both flu and pneumonia shots. I refuse each time I see her. I wonder if at some point they'll blackmail me into getting them, or deny health care?

The only time I've had anything that I could call the flu, was twice in the past 6 years, when I've been living under highly stressful home conditons. In the first one, I was actually being tortured, but couldn't get away because I couldn't walk due to extremely painful arthritis, and in the 2nd one, I had difficulty finding a place to live, after putting a lock on my door to keep my landlady out. On my last night there, she tried to break in, while I was reading in bed. So, yes I did get sick at both of those places. I don't think a flu shot would have helped. The stress had supressed my immune system that had always come through for me during my lifetime.

I've had some additional stress in my new location, which took it's toll in a case of hives that lasted about a week, and then I got something like a cold that last about 4 days.

I'll continue to take my chances with the flu and pnuemonia. I generally have a positive attitude, and I think that goes a long way in keeping me healthy. I've always been thankful to a strong immune system. It might have been from living in extreme poverty as a child, where I built an immunity to bugs of all kinds. I was never sick as a child, except for chicken pox.

I think I may have passed it on to my sons; they never missed a day of school with sickness, so I used to let them take "wellness days" when they felt like it. They're still pretty healthy, but seem to pick up things being around their children's school friends. The stuff you pick up from little school kids can do you in, big time. I'd wear a mask around kids with runny noses, sneezing and coughing...just as a precaution.

Whenever I've felt a tickle in my throat, like it's going to get sore, I start garling with warm water and Vit C crystals. If I get it right way, I can avert a sore throat every time. I always keep a bottle of crystals in my medicine cabinet, with the Tea Tree, Rescue Remedy, Melatonin, and other natural helpers.

We're all so different, I think it's wise to tune in to oneself, when making choices of any kind. Gather information, see what resonates, and trust yourself. Ultimately, it's all your choice anyway, because doctors are people with different opinions too, so you can't count on them to make the best decision for you.

Especially when they're being bribed by Big Pharma, with Big Bucks, and plenty of perks to share with the good doctors...... but we don't have participate by putting our money in their collection plate.

This is just my opinion, and I urge everyone to consult themselves, and take time to perform "due dilligence" in this matter of vaccines, and many other things that we're told will be "good" for us.
The bottom line for me is "No vaccines, unless it's going to save my life" and when it comes right down to it, I might even say "no" then.....if I'm feeling like it's a good day to die.

[Kalia]

If you're not sure about the whole vaccination concept, there's a very
clearly written 3-part blog on the subject. The first entry is here:

https://freethoughtblogs.com/amillio...r-vaccination/

Vaccination does work, is safe, and makes an enormous difference to an
enormous number of people. There are a lot of people out there
waving around their personal and utterly unscientific ideas about how
vaccination is some sort of evil plot.

Take a look at the article, then read the other 2 parts of it. It may
take a little rummaging in that blog site since it's not super well
organized. If you want to read further and can't find the links, let me
know and I'll dig them up for you.

I've gotten flu shots 3 times, all in high-intensity nasty flu years
(including this one). I have not gotten sick in any of those years, and
I have not had any negative effects from the shots (except for the
slight soreness anyone would feel after having a needle shoved into
their arm muscle). I'm 49 and in generally good health. My husband is
59 and also got a flu shot. He also has dodged this year's icky flu.
We've been around a lot of sick folks this year and haven't had so much
as a sniffle. Vaccines work.

Kalia

[intheflow88]

#1 – Healthy People Need To Get Sick Once In Awhile

We need to stop thinking of germs as predators from the outside and start thinking of them as scavengers within. They are not attacking us, they are opportunists that live off the messes we leave in our own bodies. Gross, I know, but true.

Most of the time we live in relative peace with a host of pathogenic germs, but too much stress, or sugar, or whatever knocks our body off balance biochemically, leaving a glut of food that one germ or another prefers. When this happens germs take us up on our generous offer and have a nice old sit down dinner. Does this make us sick? Yes and no.

Germs are notorious for excreting all kinds of toxic waste after they eat, and this can make us feel tired. For the most part, though, the peak of infection is usually marked by no symptoms at all. It is only when our body begins to fight back that we get “sick,” because the fact of the matter is that fever, diarrhea and other unpleasant things are not what microbes do to us, it’s what we do to THEM. Our bodies are creating inflammation, which is the cure, not the disease.

Inflammation, as the word implies, is like a fire in the body which burns up the waste and debris, along with the germs which feed on waste and debris, and cleanses the body. Thus it is our immune system which causes us to become sick, by creating inflammation to drive out infection and renew us.”

Here’s the kicker: The stronger our immune system, the stronger the illness. Bouts of intense illness – or “healing crisis” as they are sometimes called – indicate the presence of a thorough housekeeper [aka immune system]. Chronic symptoms of “feeling bad” and fatigue without periods of acute illness, on the other hand, are signs of low-grade toxicity in the body – the result of our housekeeper being too weak to do her job” - Vaccines: Questions All Parents Should Ask. Ted Koren p. 107

Don’t just take my word for it, though, even this doctor says fevers are a child’s friend and may actually help them recover faster! I disagree with her on pain relievers, though. See this post to find out why.

So what does this have to do with vaccines in 5 words or less? Vaccines cripple our inflammatory response.

Okay, I’m obviously going to need more than 5 words.

#2 – How Vaccines Work Explains Why They Don’t (Really) Work

Our immune systems are actually comprised of two sub-systems. The humoral system mainly recognizes pathogens and produces antibodies which prevent them from entering cells – this is the TH1 system.

The cell-mediated system “primarily destroys, digests and expels foreign antigens out of the body through the activity of its cells found in the thymus, tonsils, adenoids, spleen, lymph nodes and lymph system throughout the body” – this is the TH2 system. The TH2 system is what turns up the thermostat in our bodies to clean up when things get ugly inside.

The Th1 system is most effective against viral, gram-negative bacterial and fungal infections, and tuberculosis. It is also the system which digests cancer cells within our bodies. Th2 function mainly deals with gram-positive bacterial and parasitic infections. Both are needed, but they must function together in harmony.

So what does this look like usually? In a healthy person, TH1 function is dominant. Pathogens are hunted by stealth ninja T cells, digested and escorted to the exits constantly. Vaccination turns this balance on it’s head, making the TH2 system dominant. That’s a HUGE problem, and here’s why:

A Th2 response to a specific virus infection will specifically suppress Th1 cells from becoming activated against the same virus. With the resulting failure to generate a Th1 response, cells infected with virus cannot be destroyed.”

So basically, vaccines actually cripple our ability to expel viruses. Sure, they can “help” (and I use this term loosely) us produce antibodies that allow fewer cells to be infected, but the cells that do become infected are literally paralyzed from doing anything about it. In that sense, vaccines do “work.” They keep us from experiencing the sensations we associate with illness, but there is a cost.

Infected cells cannot fight well when the TH2 system is dominant, so they just try to manage until they get really sick and tired of being sick and tired. Then they start trying to game the system for some relief.

Chronically infected cells, like nerve cells, can occasionally trick the immune system into reacting to and attacking similar nerve cells resulting in autoimmune disease such as multiple sclerosis, Guillain Barré, etc. Cells chronically infected with live vaccine viruses also risk having the viruses mutate, trade genes with each other, as well as interact with the host cell DNA.¹”

In other words, vaccines may work in the short term to block the infection of some cells and reduce the incidence of acute illness, but in doing so they may very well trigger autoimmune reactions, prevent our TH1 systems from dealing effectively with the rogue cancer cells we all have, and modify the immune system in ways we can’t predict. They also negatively affect herd immunity, but that’s another post!

Vaccine makers know this and have made attempts to stimulate TH1 responses instead of TH2. So far they have all failed, so they keep selling us the same old line about how vaccines are safe and effective.

Riiiiight.

This brings me to my next point, which is that . . .

#3 The Flu Shot May Be More Dangerous Than The Flu

This year’s vaccine has been formulated with three strains: Influenza A (H3N2), Influenza B and Influenza A (H1N1). In 2009, the H1N1 vaccine was linked with a 700% increase in miscarriages.

According to this article, “Dr. Hugh Fudenberg, a world-leading immunogeneticist, has extensively studied the effects of the flu vaccine on neurological health. The results of his research indicate that an individual has a 10-time greater chance of getting Alzheimer’s disease after receiving five flu shots in the course of their life compared to individuals who have had zero to one shot in their lifetime.

Dr. Fudenberg and other researchers believe the increased risk of Alzheimer’s is a result of the combination of mercury and aluminum within the flu vaccine.”

Others have drawn the same conclusion, including Dr. Bernard Windham, who has testified before the FDA regarding his findings. According to Windham, mercury toxicity blocks sulfate oxidation which allows cysteine levels to build up in the brain and CNS to neurotoxic levels. He cites numerous studies which have found elevated cysteine levels – about 500% higher than controls – in patients with Alzheimer’s, ALS, Parkinson’s, Lupus, rheumatoid arthritis and autism.

Mercury exposure can also cause memory loss, depression, ADD, oral health problems, digestive imbalances, respiratory problems, cardiovascular diseases and many more serious health problems. Note: Single use flu vaccine vials may not contain mercury. The inhaled vaccine never does. Single use vials with a pink syringe plunger rod in the pre-filled syringe contain only “trace” amounts of mercury – these are the made for children from 6-36 month old. They are made in limited quantities so children often receive the mercury-containing vaccines.

So, it contains mercury AND it’s risky for pregnant women and the elderly, despite the fact that these are the “vulnerable” populations targeted for vaccination? Pass.

#4 – Oh, And It May Double Your Risk Of Getting The Flu!

What happens when an individual compromises their TH1 immune function to be “protected” from the 3 strains of flu that came in this year’s vaccine? They’re vulnerable to the other 297 strains that will circulate this year, of course!

Back in the spring of 2009, just when the swine flu hysteria was building, a Canadian study revealed that people, who had received a regular, seasonal flu shot, were twice as likely to catch swine flu. This was initially passed off as unproven but, lo and behold, in 2010 the results of several epidemiologic investigations revealed that seasonal flu shot DID increase the risk of catching swine flu.

The four studies, which were conducted by public health agencies in Canada, involved about 2,700 people in all, and each one had the same result: if you got the seasonal flu shot, you were more likely to get the swine flu. The researchers wrote in PLoS Medicine:

” … Estimates from all four studies (which included about 1,200 laboratory-confirmed pH1N1 cases and 1,500 controls) showed that prior recipients of the 2008–09 TIV [seasonal flu shot] had approximately 1.4–2.5 times increased chances of developing pH1N1 illness that needed medical attention during the spring–summer of 2009 compared to people who had not received the TIV.”

Does The Flu Shot Increase Your Risk Of Getting The Flu?

#5 – There Is Evidence Of Widespread Manipulation Of Flu Vaccine Data

In an analysis of 50 published studies conducted by the well-respected, independent Cochrane Review, researchers found that only studies funded by pharmaceutical companies found a benefit. Their analysis revealed a far different conclusion:

“reliable evidence on influenza vaccines is thin”
“there is evidence of widespread manipulation of conclusions”
there is no evidence that vaccination prevents viral transmission in adults (so much for getting the vaccine to protect herd immunity!)

Oh, And Did I Mention They Don’t Work?

According to “a large-scale, systematic review of 51 studies, published in the Cochrane Database of Systematic Reviews in 2006, found no evidence that the flu vaccine is any more effective than a placebo in preventing influenza in children under two. The studies involved 260,000 children, age 6 to 23 months.”

Source: https://bit.ly/VDduO0

[cocreator]

Susan,

Thank you for this intelligent, beautifully supported article. I couldn't have said it better ~ and now I can simply refer people to your post. Perhaps you can write one on the dangers of microwave ovens next...

#1 – Healthy People Need To Get Sick Once In Awhile

[Kunnskaping]

In 2009, the H1N1 vaccine was linked with a 700% increase in miscarriages.

When I see statements like that repeated year after year, I get a longing for a healthy dose of skepticism:
https://skepdic.com/skeptimedia/skeptimedia117.html

[podfish]

So basically, vaccines actually cripple our ability to expel viruses.

I guess the smallpox virii just got religion... peace to all men! now we don't even bother to attack them anymore - clearly a win all round.

[Kalia]

Thanks for finding the scoop on that statistic. I was dubious as well but didn't have time to do more than peek at Snopes.com (nothing there). Vaccination works. Really and truly. The anti-vax folks are causing more harm than they know.

When I see statements like that repeated year after year, I get a longing for a healthy dose of skepticism:
https://skepdic.com/skeptimedia/skeptimedia117.html

[Barry]

Susan,

Thank you for this intelligent, beautifully supported article. I couldn't have said it better ~ and now I can simply refer people to your post. Perhaps you can write one on the dangers of microwave ovens next...

Indeed it was a " intelligent, beautifully supported article" however Susan didn't write it, nor did she claim to. She included the link to the original: https://www.mommypotamus.com/should-...u-shot-or-not/ which contains active links with references, one of which is disputed above by Kunnskaping (post #19) who also provides an excellent link.

[sebastacat]

Thanks to all who have posted regarding this extremely important health topic.

I have two friends who live in Vallejo, one in their early 60's and one who is 97. BOTH of them got the flu shot this flu season, and BOTH of them got the flu. In fact, they told me it was the worst case of the flu that they have ever gotten!
What is going on here? What kind of snake-oil is the public being injected with?

Worse yet, the medical establishment -- hopefully unintentionally -- continues to dutifully promote the flu shot at the start of each flu season with such inane statements as "85 percent effective against the flu," "95 percent effective against the flu," etc. I suspect that it is the pharmaceutical companies that are coming up with these rabbit-out-of-a-hat numbers, and we all know that we can trust them, right?

If that were indeed the case, why are we hearing about so many people who have gotten the shot contracting the flu?
Could it be that the flu virus has now become so powerful that it is able to resist even the strongest vaccine?

I'm no doctor, but I'm afraid that this is indeed the case and that if something isn't done to turn this tide, no flu vaccine -- and no amount of flu vaccine -- is going to be capable of protecting us when a real epidemic strikes.

That said, I did not get the flu vaccine this year; my parents did. So far (cross your fingers and knock on wood) none of us has gotten the flu. Just sayin'.....

[podfish]

BOTH of them got the flu shot this flu season, and BOTH of them got the flu. In fact, they told me it was the worst case of the flu that they have ever gotten!
What is going on here? What kind of snake-oil is the public being injected with?..Worse yet, the medical establishment -- hopefully unintentionally -- continues to dutifully promote the flu shot at the start of each flu season with such inane statements as "85 percent effective against the flu,"

this is a perfect example of why crazy policies happen. When you find qualified opinions (qualified does not mean "issued by an authority", by the way) less believable than absolutist statements, you're showing that you don't understand the way this works at all. Demagogs love to use absolutist statements and they succeed in swaying people because too many find statements made with certainty inherently more believable than those expressed as probabilities.

If you find this at all a compelling topic, take a little time to find out how the flu vaccine system works. The fact two people who took the vaccine still got the flu is about as relevant as that a couple of people in a car crash were hurt even though there were air-bags. You ask rhetorical questions ("why are we hearing about so many people who have gotten the shot contracting the flu?") as if the answers aren't readily available, and stretch it to absurdity (" Could it be that the flu virus has now become so powerful that it is able to resist even the strongest vaccine? ") . The problem with that, is people participating in these discussions often treat the off-the-cuff ideas like that one with the same value as ones that actually have been presented with supporting evidence.

Leaping to the idea that we're going to be helpless when a "real epidemic" strikes is fun, but nothing in this thread so far points in that direction at all. When we're just tossing out apocalyptic dangers I prefer to worry about grey goo.

[Gene]

Inflammation, as the word implies, is like a fire in the body which burns up the waste and debris, along with the germs which feed on waste and debris, and cleanses the body. Thus it is our immune system which causes us to become sick, by creating inflammation to drive out infection and renew us.”

Nonsence, Not True, This Whole Article is full of bad information and quotes from discredited research.

[sebastacat]

Thanks for your reply, Podfish.

However, we are not talking about the implementation of policy here; we're talking about a serious health issue.
Barry put out a question, and I believe that people are doing their best to respond in an honest, helpful way.
If you want to dismiss it all as "grey goo," that's up to you.

In the end, I have to say that I agree with one of the earlier posters who posted some precautionary hints earlier, i.e., gargling, hand-washing, etc. That is probably the best safeguard we human beings have to avoid getting sick from this scourge.

You will note that I ended my post by giving the example of my parents getting the flu shot and me not getting it. I believe that it is personal choice that should govern. I am NOT telling anyone to NOT get a flu shot; if they feel that it is something that they should do, it is their personal choice. The point is that there may be other choices out there available to those people who do not wish to be injected with something that the medical establishment all too often makes it sound is a life-or-death proposition if you don't.

[podfish]

If you want to dismiss it all as "grey goo," that's up to you.

I'm referring to another doom-and-gloom scenario, on a par with the idea that "the flu virus has now become so powerful that it is able to resist even the strongest vaccine". The weird controversies and hyperbole that surround the whole vaccination issue if anything make such a scenario more plausible - an easy way to limit spread and evolution of diseases is to limit the number of available hosts.

[phooph]

I guess most people missed the news that this year's flu shots were a disappointment to the CDC. One wonders how well flu shots can work at all given that flu viruses constantly mutate and the vaccines are made from whatever strains are around at the time they make the vaccines which can be months ahead of the season. Notice that we don't have a vaccine for colds, which are also constantly mutating viruses. They mutate fast enough that little effort is put into something that is usually less lethal than the flu.

The following article mentions that only 56% of the elderly were protected by this year's variety of flu shot. I want to ask how they came up with that number. Did they compare the incidence of flu in vaccinated populations against the un-vaccinated or did they just count the number of vaccinated who got the flu or didn't? How do we know that the vaccinated who didn't get the flu escaped due to the vaccine and how many were not exposed to the flu or had immune systems that warded it off. There are some people who never get colds or flu no matter what the exposure, and others who rarely get them. I didn't get the shot and didn't get the flu.

I am usually susceptible to everything going around but often ward them off with a number of supplements if I feel something coming on. I did have a day of unexplained exhaustion, headache, achy joints and queasy stomach but hit it will everything at hand and woke up the next day feeling fine. I can knock out a cold in a couple days if I don't catch it in time, but it's the follow up sinus infection that really gets me. That takes a couple weeks.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/02/21/usa-flu-vaccine-idUKL1N0BL6IQ20130221

Thanks for your reply, Podfish. However, we are not talking about the implementation of policy here; we're talking about a serious health issue. Barry put out a question, and I believe that people are doing their best to respond in an honest, helpful way. If you want to dismiss it all as "grey goo," that's up to you. In the end, I have to say that I agree with one of the earlier posters who posted some precautionary hints earlier, i.e., gargling, hand-washing, etc. That is probably the best safeguard we human beings have to avoid getting sick from this scourge. You will note that I ended my post by giving the example of my parents getting the flu shot and me not getting it. I believe that it is personal choice that should govern. I am NOT telling anyone to NOT get a flu shot; if they feel that it is something that they should do, it is their personal choice. The point is that there may be other choices out there available to those people who do not wish to be injected with something that the medical establishment all too often makes it sound is a life-or-death proposition if you don't.

[spam1]

grey-goo

hee-hee... I got it (sheesh, doesn't any one read any more?)

[scamperwillow]

I got the flu this year. Chances are you did too. Not very fun, plus you're out of commission for a week or two!

I haven't gotten a flu vaccine before, figuring the vaccine might be more harmful than the flu, I'm not in a high risk group (but getting closer every year!) and it may not be effective.

I'm considering getting one next year.

What's your experience been?
Have you gotten a flu shot?
Did you get the flu anyway or not?
(The CDC Reports the shot is only 60% effective)

Did you not get flu shot?
Why not?
Did you get the flu?
Will you get one next year?

Are you sure you had the flu Barry? There have been some nasty colds and other viruses going around but I hear the flu really knocks you out with fever, chills, aches and pains. I've had the cold and it lasted three weeks, but not the flu. And I did get a flu shot for the first time in many years.