How CVS Conned Sebastopol

[rossmen]

I think this is a terrible idea. Left turns on busy highways without a turn lane? And most local drivers coming west on 12 turning north already take the alternative routes.

Please take critique of your ideas and people not responding to you a little less seriously. The only person with any real power here is barry, and the worst he can do is kick you off, not a big deal and some would say a badge of honor! I for one welcome your participation on waccobb.

John, I know you wont reply to me but I'm writing this more for the greater good of Sebastopol.
The way to solve the L-turn into CVS would be simple. ...

[Bob2]

Ross, the lane would be the L-Turn lane, just like it it is right now turning onto Main.

I'm irked by the hypocrisy of some lost sheep...
Im just an Ol' Foole, Ross
I thought this site was more for diversity, but me thinks it's more about follow the leader

I think this is a terrible idea. Left turns on busy highways without a turn lane? ....

[Bob2]

I rarely use 12 to get into town. I come down Healdsburg and go back on Petaluma or Bodega. So yesterday night I decided to check it out and see what the problem is. With the streets empty it is plain to see for everybody what the problem is!
From John; "It should be noted that there is no center turn (or “refuge”) lane at this location, as there is serving the businesses immediately east of it. "
Let me repeat that; It should be noted that there is no center (left) turn lane , as there is serving the businesses immediately east of it.
WOW, go out there and see for yourself the hypocrisy from people blaming CVS for the traffic problems. If the L-turn (refuge) were to be extended only a few yards there would be no problem! Why should Benedetti and all the other businesses benefit from a refuge lane and CVS not? To focus only on putting up a barrier to Barnes is like spreading Trumpian, self-serving disinformation.
Not only does it create a dangerous situation from people wondering how to get to CVS, it's a mockery of what is in the best interest and safety of Sebastopol in the long run.

...
Caltrans submitted a letter to the City of Sebastopol on September 20, 2012 that agreed with the need to place a restriction on left turns at this location.

At present, no indicators (signs, pavement markings, etc.) have been installed on westbound Highway 12 that left turns into the project are not allowed. A “No Left Turn” sign and a “Right Turn Only” pavement marking have been installed on Barnes Avenue where it intersects Highway 12.

It should be noted that there is no center turn (or “refuge”) lane at this location, as there is serving the businesses immediately east of it. Therefore, all left turn movements into/out of Barnes Avenue are from/into the westbound traffic lanes....

[photolite]

Hmmm. Interesting observation indeed.

...
Let me repeat that; It should be noted that there is no center (left) turn lane , as there is serving the businesses immediately east of it.
WOW, go out there and see for yourself the hypocrisy from people blaming CVS for the traffic problems. If the L-turn (refuge) were to be extended only a few yards there would be no problem! Why should Benedetti and all the other businesses benefit from a refuge lane and CVS not?....

[rekarp]

It's not that simple. The current center turn lane stops far enough back for about 16 cars to be in a 2nd lane and be ready to turn left on Main street at the following intersection. If the center turn lane was extended so that people could turn left into CVS, there would be room for about 8 cars. Maybe Caltrans, or whoever is responsible for this intersection, thinks there is a capacity issue for traffic moving through the intersection. I can imagine gridlock where the cars wanting to turn left on Main back up through the Petaluma Avenue intersection and block the single lane that allows cars to go straight through or right on Petaluma Avenue.

Caltrans might have guidelines, but a traffic engineer could figure it out.

...Let me repeat that; It should be noted that there is no center (left) turn lane , as there is serving the businesses immediately east of it.
WOW, go out there and see for yourself the hypocrisy from people blaming CVS for the traffic problems. If the L-turn (refuge) were to be extended only a few yards there would be no problem! ...

[Bob2]

Rekarp, I have to refer you to my previous post, where I suggested to prohibit a right turn onto Petaluma.
If you watch the traffic flow coming from 12, you'll see that the right turn onto Petaluma is what's causing most of the delays NOT the L turn!

"My proposal would make the traffic flow better in all lanes.
By not allowing a right turn onto Petaluma ave, and directing the traffic to McKinley before Petaluma Ave via Morris or Depot or Barlow, It takes traffic off of 12 and the CVS intersection.
You end up with TWO lanes, the right lane would be for straight to Bodega traffic, the left lane would be for left turns into Barnes AND Main street."

It's not that simple. ...

[rekarp]

Are you suggesting that traffic be routed through the Barlow?

...
By not allowing a right turn onto Petaluma ave, and directing the traffic to McKinley before Petaluma Ave via Morris or Depot or Barlow, It takes traffic off of 12 and the CVS intersection....

[Bob2]

Karp, Traffic for the Barlow through the Barlow, it was so wonderfully designed for that.....
Traffic for Whole Foods/downtown could be diverted through Morris.
Traffic for the Hotel/ Mimi could use Depot or maybe Brown
This would take a lot of traffic of that intersection and make it safer too.
What is your suggestion, Rekarp?

Are you suggesting that traffic be routed through the Barlow?

[rekarp]

So Barlow traffic can already use Morris. If Whole Foods and downtown traffic turns right on Morris, would they go through the Barlow, or go Laguna Park Way past the police station and take a right at Whole Foods?

...Traffic for Whole Foods/downtown could be diverted through Morris....

[Bob2]

What is your suggestion rekarp?

So Barlow traffic can already use Morris. If Whole Foods and downtown traffic turns right on Morris, would they go through the Barlow, or go Laguna Park Way past the police station and take a right at Whole Foods?

[rekarp]

I'm just trying to figure out if your idea is better than what we have right now. I don't think it's a good idea to route non-Barlow traffic through the Barlow.

Until the bridge is complete, it's hard to say exactly how bad the traffic problem will be.

What is your suggestion rekarp?

[Bob2]

If you look at a Google map, you'll see hat there is an actual street after Morris and before Depot. It has no name but is on the map. It looks like the Barlow has confiscated this public thoroughfare, maybe John can educate us on the history. This would be my ideal entrance to WF if it is public domain. I remember it as a wide back alley for trucks back in the days . It really is all in the sign posting and the Barlow should welcome traffic through there, it's good for business!

I'm just trying to figure out if your idea is better than what we have right now. I don't think it's a good idea to route non-Barlow traffic through the Barlow.

Until the bridge is complete, it's hard to say exactly how bad the traffic problem will be.

[scamperwillow]

I frequently turn right on Morris to go to Whole foods - misses all the town center congestion.

So Barlow traffic can already use Morris. If Whole Foods and downtown traffic turns right on Morris, would they go through the Barlow, or go Laguna Park Way past the police station and take a right at Whole Foods?