Militarized Sebastopol Police?

[ChefJayTay]

So those things piled on top of the cop's trash cans were ducks? How many ducks does a guy have to slaughter to feed his family? Were the ones on the top that you could see the only dead ducks, or were there more corpses piled in the can below? Did he have to use a machine gun, or what, to kill so many ducks?

Wow... you sure are uneducated as to hunting in this country.
Perhaps you should just stop commenting about it.
This is MAYBE a 2 day limit on duck hunting in the majority of the state.
This represents likely 1 good weekend hunting.
As to feeding his family... could your family live off that for a year?
You really have no clue. Machine gun?!?! HA.

[Becky Lynn]

What catches my eye is your opener"I was made to feel uncomfortable", since that is the excuse of the many white Becky s who have been calling the police on black people who are minding their own business, perhaps drinking coffee in public while black. Getting along with each other is the task at hand, uncomfortable though it may be. 

Why are you using my name in a judgmental negative way. I think you can simply get your point across without using mine and anybody else who happens to have the name Becky You are playing the racist card as well.
Stop spreading racist and judgmental crap.. The idea is to rise above without labeling. It's just not a good idea to attach peoples names in this manner, the media and obviously you, just don't get it.

[markwjam]

...Anyone living within and outside Sonoma County who is not concerned about police overreaction and murder has his head in the sand.

[Tofu Larry]

I'm not sure I would classify this as militarized. I don't know what kind of weapons they were carrying, but if they were holstered, they were not AK 47s. They need to be armed, when they are facing bad guys with firepower. As far as bulletproof vests, I think it would be stupid for them not to wear them. Animal control came to my house when I had a dog come after me. The officer was wearing a vest. I commented on it, that it was a sad state when the "dog catcher" has to wear one. He said he had had guns drawn on him twice. It is a dangerous world, especially here in America where it weaponry is commonplace and accepted.

...My complaint was not directed at the police offers at Andy's who were behaving properly, but at their bulletproof vests and semi-automatic weapons. This suggests a police force that is militarized. Sebastopol is not Stockton or Modesto--both very high crime cities. I am not aware of any crimes taking place in Sebastopol which would warrant fitting police officers making their daily rounds fitted with bulletproof vests. This smacks of of intimidation of innocent citizens.

[podfish]

I'm not sure I would classify this as militarized.

I agree. The militarization I worry about is partly about equipment - the light armor (vehicles) that some departments have, for example - but more about tactics. The "Colin Powell Doctrine" if I remember it right - come in with overwhelming force to prevent any resistance from forming. And the principle that officer safety is paramount. Unfortunately, I think it's inherently a dangerous job, and officers do have to accept a terrifying amount of risk. I think the vests are a reasonable balance. But too often the techniques used to lower the risk to the officer are dangerous to the civilian population, or increase the "us vs. them" sentiment in the community. The OP draws a different line than I do, but I think is expressing the same sentiment. And you can see the consequences of getting this wrong in the Andy Lopez case and how it still resonates here.

[wisewomn]

I wonder if there are any statistics showing how many of the officers involved in these shootings are ex-military?
Particularly recently ex-military?

I agree. The militarization I worry about is partly about equipment - the light armor (vehicles) that some departments have, for example - but more about tactics. ...

[forestvaros]

Mike H, I know that "retard" has returned unfortunately to the common parlance as a way of referring to people we dislike and whose behavior we find illogical and undesirable. However, I still take offense at it, with its having started as a degrading way of referring to persons with developmental disabilities and/or Downs Syndrome. Sounds like this law enforcement official behaved inappropriately and it would be wise to report his behavior. Please don't jump into name-calling and disparaging marginalized persons by linking them with someone behaving irresponsibly and unethically. Thanks.

On the contrary, I've every right to look up who this retard running around with a gun and a badge is after he harassed me, violated my rights, came onto my property with no cause, intimidating me, threatening me with jail and other consequences. I did nothing! Especially since my tax dollars were paying to carry his sorry ass on the public payroll.

Anyway, you can have your opinion. Including your opinion of me. My opinion is you can stick your opinion.

[forestvaros]

Becky, I agree it's unfortunate that your name has become a popular way folks are referring to white people behaving in a racist manner. (EG Jennifer Schulte at Lake Merritt a couple of months ago, who before she was identified by name was referred to in memes as "BBQ Becky.")

However, I have to disagree firmly with your characterization of this this post as racist. We are seeing a lot of examples from all over the country of people who are white calling law enforcement on people who are black who are going through their everyday lives, e.g. barbecuing at a lakeside park, using a library, and most recently, eating lunch. To acknowledge that this is happening is not racist. It is a factual, critical observation of a disturbing trend in our contemporary society, a critique that we need to be doing more.

Kay Hafiza Mathieu made an analogy between this trend and the starting point of this post, an implicit principle that when we feel uncomfortable, there is an external problem that is responsible. It's a reasonable analogy, not "playing the racist card." It seems that you are also falling into a behavior of labeling that is exactly what you're calling out.

Why are you using my name in a judgmental negative way. I think you can simply get your point across without using mine and anybody else who happens to have the name Becky You are playing the racist card as well.
Stop spreading racist and judgmental crap.. The idea is to rise above without labeling. It's just not a good idea to attach peoples names in this manner, the media and obviously you, just don't get it.

[Becky Lynn]

Becky, I agree it's unfortunate that your name has become a popular way folks are referring to white people behaving in a racist manner. ...However, I have to disagree firmly with your characterization of this post as racist. ...

My point is to stop spreading sensational racist news made up by the media to get your comparison point made. And stop tarnishing my name in order to do that. The more we give attention to racist people, the more they continue to behave that way. And you are totally guilty of using and abusing my name in your post as well. Stop spreading racist rhetoric.

[occihoff]

I agree. Maybe the word "retard" in such situations as Mike H described should be replaced by the word "asshole." Although that word has the defect of also referring to a perfectly excellent part of the body that has become besmirched with prudish disgust! But that's also why it has become so powerful as an epithet in our deeply prudish culture. "Jerk" would have been too mild. "Bully" would be pretty good. But "asshole" really expresses your rage and contempt in a situation where you've been brutalized by a bully who is unfairly protected by his badge, club, pepper spray, and gun!

Mike H, I know that "retard" has returned unfortunately to the common parlance as a way of referring to people we dislike and whose behavior we find illogical and undesirable. However, I still take offense at it, ...

[forestvaros]

Yeah, once again, no. Talking about racism is not racist and is not spreading racism.

"Made up by the media" is a ridiculous claim that I am confident you cannot justify.

And no, I am not abusing your name. Let me introduce you to a concept called the quotation.

My point is to stop spreading sensational racist news made up by the media to get your comparison point made. And stop tarnishing my name in order to do that....

[occihoff]

Unfortunately, Podfish, there seem to be way too many publicized cases in which "individual cops have acted improperly." And for every publicized case I bet there are a lot of cases that the public never gets to hear about. Certainly we all would agree with you that great attention should be paid to the departments and their policies, which all too often however tend to deny any wrongdoing, no matter how gross the offenses, and all too often they are backed up by politicians and a political system that does not want to get on the wrong side of the police. We hear case after case on the news of brutal cops literally getting away with murder, and for every such case you can be assured that there are many more instances of brutalization that do not amount to death.

I think one's slant on this issue has a lot to do with our social class. Middle class white people such as I don't tend to have the same life experiences involving police as poor people of color. However, my experiences with the police riots in Berkeley during the Free Speech and People's Park movements gave me a huge glimpse into a world I would never have known otherwise!

.... But except for the cases where individual cops have acted improperly, the attention on policing should be aimed at the departments and their policies.

[Becky Lynn]

Yeah, once again, no. Talking about racism is not racist and is not spreading racism. ...

The racist rhetoric used by the media abusing my name in a racist way on mainstream t.v. and internet, and now it's being spread on this site. Nobody would want their name used and talked about in such a negative way.

[podfish]

Nobody would want their name used and talked about in such a negative way.

yeah, me and my brother John feel the same way, as does my relative with your name and her friend Dick. We get no respect.

-- Peter

[ChefJayTay]

A dude was throwing bombs under police cars in Guerneville today...
...and people wanna complain about police being prepared for war.

[Reheymann]

I understand your concern that the police be prepared for "war."* This is not the issue. The issue is that the police often act impatiently, with excessive and misdirected force. Did you hear about the decorated war veteran in Aurora, CO who police killed last Friday after he shot and killed a violent intruder in own home? The police claimed that he refused to drop his gun after repeated demands to do so. That sounds fishy to me. A war veteran would likely know better. The homeowner was clearly identified by his wife in her call to the police. Of course, since the only witnesses present were police, neither I nor anyone else can disprove that.

* Do you really mean "war?" We have military for that.

[Becky Lynn]

yeah, me and my brother John feel the same way, as does my relative with your name and her friend Dick. We get no respect.

-- Peter

Yeah thanks for the warped humor that goes with some names. Using my name in such a prejudice way is not only disrespectful it's outright discriminatory

[forestvaros]

Becky, I hear that you are truly distressed about your name standing for a white woman with a particular of characteristics, and I'm sorry for that. The irony is that the more you keep talking, the more you embody exactly the stereotype from which you are wanting to distance yourself. Using your name in the way that has become popular is disrespectful to the name, yes, but it is neither racist nor discriminatory. Prejudiced, perhaps. But not discriminatory and definitely not racist.

Neither you nor anyone in your family would be barred from immigration or migration on the basis of your name. You wouldn't be barred from making a dinner reservation under the name Becky or be refused service because of your name. You haven't had to pay more for a car or struggle to get a loan or a lease because of your name, and you haven't experienced difficulty getting a raise or a promotion any more than a Sally or a Roberta. You experience plenty of discrimination on the basis of your sex, yes. But not because of your name. And assuming you are white, which based on this conversation is an assumption I feel fairly confident in making, you still enjoy the many spoils of white privilege that I or any other white person gets to enjoy. Which means that we are simply not the subjects of racism, full stop.

You're right, I wouldn't want my name to become the term to describe a particular type of person, either. But you are vastly overstating the degree of your persecution to the point of sounding ridiculous. Which, I suspect, is why Peter made a joke about it.

Yeah thanks for the warped humor that goes with some names. Using my name in such a prejudice way is not only disrespectful it's outright discriminatory

[rossmen]

Why puff up a minor incident to justify militant enforcement of societal order? Clearly you have a a lot to lose. I have never called on law enforcement to deal with problems and never will. They have been called on me and sometimes were cool, but too often they made the situation worse and i suffered injustice. I've rode along and worked with and even trained law enforcement personnel. I am very aware that just by writing this post I could be justifying my own death by cop. Weaver is the best of a bad lot. I challenged him, was berated by him, fought him in court and won. He cut off communication. Yes and he will probably improve the rodent park police process.

Call the cops, invite death, destruction, and injustice...

A dude was throwing bombs under police cars in Guerneville today...
...and people wanna complain about police being prepared for war.

[nicofrog]

Well here we are then;
we have cops with their job(not an easy one but one THEY chose) we have people scared and confused by a showing of more potential force by the now "better" equipped force. and we have a few groovy dudes who stand behind increased gun violence as a solution to increased gun violence.

There was a several million dollar studies of the Columbine shootings and it never mentioned TV at all, or the local propensity to normalize the concept of just everyone having a gun. In Japan people used to carry a special dagger to kill themselves with to avoid shame. It was normal. it was a way of organizing society that worked for them at that time. Now we have Atom Bombs poised to eliminate cities or entire countries if we so desire(and pollute the world into permanent cancer for everyone and every animal). NORMAL is a funny word.

I was born very viscerally into gun culture my dad wwII vet, my toy guns and tanks, I KNEW beyond a doubt that guns were a solution to weakness in the face of BAD GUY problems. (I still have lingering suspicion that perhaps there are bad guys/girls?) ..The "equalizer" it could be called.

I went and saw the Sonoma County Sheriff's collection of pretend need toys such as fighting vehicle, super boat and bomb de-bugging robot and etc I met Gelhous, It was mildly distasteful to me.

To some, he is a hero. MY opinion may not be important. as a phenomena his attitude and propensity I see as a sick distortion, and SCAB on this huge wound we have in an overpopulated rat cage of humans. When Rat cages are overfull they begin to turn on each other.

So GO through the TV channels(what are there like 400 500 now? ) make a list how many show solving problems with guns and how many don't? I do not know if this has been done, but my guess just by checking out toys store shelves etc would be about 86% of all stories out there show violence as a solution or at least a source of Adrenalin rushes, with music to match the narrative. And who does not believe that we could not have bested Hitler without them? BAD GUYS about 1/3 of toys were guns or army when I was a kid now it a little less.

I am ready to put down my gun on the ground and step forward with my hands out at my sides (and probably be shot) with all my opinions go to my finish. ~~~~~~~~
but will that serve the grandchildren and the so-called "Future"? I doubt it. so no solutions here folks just a LOT more questions.

I agree with the girl in the video "I'd take away the guns" but I also agree with "If I had a Rocket Launcher" by Bruce Cockburn no solutions. And I SAW the Sebastopol police pull out automatic weapons once in a crazy late night drunken driver event where he passed me, ran OVER a guys subaru (luckily he was not killed) and flipped his big pickup before he could crawl out of the truck there was a soldier(Seb Police) in full uniform with a automatic weapon "on " him.. and I thought welll, I'd probably do that same thing and felt protected from a nutcase.

now some of the protectors can BE nutcases (and shoot children with toy guns) and we need to and I believe WILL deal with them, and build a lot more memorial parks till we get this right,or at least better.

If I saw those cops at a cafe, I would engage with them and ask about weapons,and how their protocol is for a school shooting or etc? what we should do . They are "PEACE OFFICERS" after all and many of them pride themselves in helping people saving lives and getting cats out of trees.

there was a great sign in a town I lived in years ago.. "If you don't like cops when you are in trouble call a hippy"
whatever man........peace!