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  1. TopTop #1
    Valley Oak
    Guest

    Hillary: You go, girl!

    Hillary is going to make it to the finish line! YES!

    It is mathematically impossible for either candidate to win 2025 delegates. This race is going to be decided in the Democratic Convention! YES!

    Edward
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  2. TopTop #2
    Braggi's Avatar
    Braggi
     

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Valley Oak: View Post
    Hillary is going to make it to the finish line! YES!
    ...
    Yes! Second, behind Obama.

    She'll make a fine vice-president, should she be able to set aside her pride and disappointment.

    -Jeff
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  3. TopTop #3
    Valley Oak
    Guest

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    That would be a dream team, which I would be in bliss to support with my vote in November! Until then, I will continue to support Hillary as I did with my vote in the California primary.

    This is what we should be talking about instead of arguing with racists, bigots, and religious fanatics. Those people are the constituencies of the Republican and Libertarian parties.

    Edward

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Braggi: View Post
    Yes! Second, behind Obama.

    She'll make a fine vice-president, should she be able to set aside her pride and disappointment.

    -Jeff
    Last edited by Valley Oak; 05-07-2008 at 12:48 PM.
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  4. TopTop #4
    Neshamah
    Guest

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    Hillary Clinton kept her name on the ballot in Michigan. Putting voters ahead of arcane party rules seems to me a minimum prerequisite for leading a Democracy (or leading us back to Democracy.) For all their talk, the DNC dares not exclude the Michigan and Florida Delegates because doing so will essentially hand those states to McCain in November. When those states are counted, the race is very close.

    If the Democratic primary was winner-take-all like the national election, Clinton would have won months ago and Obama would be seen as a regional candidate unable to break into the mainstream. Fair or not, electoral math in November heavily favors Clinton as the best to beat McCain.

    Clinton and Obama are not the only people in the Democratic party fit to be on the ticket. They are intelligent and charismatic, but whoever they pick for VP needs more experience.

    If this does go to convention, I wonder if a Gore/Obama or Gore/Clinton ticket would be the solution. Gore has served longer in the Senate than either Clinton or Obama, and he was Vice President for eight years. On top of that, he's already proven he can win the presidency. He has spent the last seven and a half years outside Washington, and that will appeal to most Americans. When was the last time a sitting Senator won the Presidency?

    ~ Neshamah
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  5. TopTop #5
    Barry's Avatar
    Barry
    Founder & Moderator

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Braggi: View Post
    Yes! Second, behind Obama.

    She'll make a fine vice-president, should she be able to set aside her pride and disappointment.

    -Jeff
    Or maybe Secretary of State!
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  6. TopTop #6
    Tars's Avatar
    Tars
     

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Braggi: View Post
    Yes! Second, behind Obama.
    She'll make a fine vice-president, should she be able to set aside her pride and disappointment.
    Can't see it; what would be her motivation? The Dems are going to win the presidency anyway. Not Sec Of State either, unless she just wants to, in effect, retire. Possibly Senate Majority Leader.

    Too bad the Dems' primary process is so messed up, otherwise she'd be the nominee.

    For all our sakes, I hope Obama doesn't turn out to be another Carter. He's big on platitudes, short on hows.
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  7. TopTop #7
    Braggi's Avatar
    Braggi
     

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Tars: View Post
    Can't see it; what would be her motivation? The Dems are going to win the presidency anyway. Not Sec Of State either, unless she just wants to, in effect, retire. Possibly Senate Majority Leader.
    ...
    What would be her motivation? She'd be one of the most powerful, influential VPs ever. She has a huge following. However, she has a mountain of negatives and it will be a feat for her to defeat McCain. The polls don't look that good and the hit pieces haven't started hitting. Hopefully McCain will pick a Dan Quayle for VP. Remember the Republicans still own a lot of voting machines. As VP she would be able to demonstrate her statespersonship. She'd be way out in the news as VP, much more than other recent VPs.

    Senate Majority Leader is also a position of great power, of course.

    If she becomes the nominee, despite being behind in the popular vote, it's likely a whole lot of Black voters will just stay home. A whole lot of hispanic voters might vote Republican that would otherwise vote for Obama.

    I think she's a real liability to the Democrats ability to win. I don't think "experience" means much of anything. Charisma, values and the ability to make decisions while under fire are the most important things. You can hire experience. Bush didn't have any and he has been incredibly successful at getting his programs adopted. I hate to say it, but he's probably the most successful president in my lifetime in that regard. The fact that all of those programs are horrible even adds to his strength of influence.

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Tars: View Post
    ...

    For all our sakes, I hope Obama doesn't turn out to be another Carter. He's big on platitudes, short on hows.
    I don't get that he's a micromanager the way Carter was which was probably Carter's greatest downfall. Carter also had the financial community working against him and intentionally making him look bad. I doubt Obama will have that problem.

    The scariest thing to me about Obama is his old school military "advisers" who are actually shills for the Military Industrial Political Complex. I hoped for better.

    -Jeff
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  8. TopTop #8
    Dynamique
    Guest

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    Or just former Senator from New York and former First Lady who currently writes political novels and gives speeches.
    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Barry: View Post
    Or maybe Secretary of State!
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  9. TopTop #9
    Tars's Avatar
    Tars
     

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    I'll preface my reply by saying that, if Barack's the nominee, and everything else stays approximately the same in November, I will vote for him.

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Braggi: View Post
    What would be her motivation? She'd be one of the most powerful, influential VPs ever.
    See: Lyndon Johnson in particular, and the huge majority of other VPs in U.S. history.
    Quote If she becomes the nominee, despite being behind in the popular vote, it's likely a whole lot of Black voters will just stay home.
    And how would that be different from any previous election? I'm waiting for any ANY of the political pundits who are creaming their jeans over "Obama's popular vote lead", to even mention that black voters vote almost exclusively for Barack. When I've seen blacks interviewed on the street, and asked about any of Obama's projected policies, there's almost universal ignorance. Purely a racist vote. If anything, black pundits by and large are worse racists. Does the Democrat party now cater to racists? I thought that was the GOP's thing. In the general population what percentage is black - 7% - 10%? The net effect of having a black Dem candidate will more likely be an increased turnout of racist Republicans.

    Quote A whole lot of hispanic voters might vote Republican that would otherwise vote for Obama.
    You've evidently been watching a different primary than the one I've been watching. The large majority of hispanic voters are pro-Clinton.

    Quote I don't think "experience" means much of anything. Charisma, values and the ability to make decisions while under fire are the most important things.
    So far, all Obama's demonstrated is that he tends to get rattled and/or pouty "under fire". If you value this criteria, you should by rights be a strong Clinton supporter instead.
    Based on past inexperienced politicians' records on being president, we'll be lucky if it takes any less than half his first term before Barack gets anything moving. That leaves him less than a year to accomplish his goal of "Change" in Washington. This is probably an optimistic projection; the GOP will try to shut him down, drag their heals, filibuster, and do all the other political dirty tricks they're famous for.

    Quote Bush didn't have any and he has been incredibly successful at getting his programs adopted.
    Heh, you don't really want to compare Barack to Bush Jr., do you? At best this is an example of why we need separation of powers. We'd be better served at this point having a president who is more experienced, when dealing with a most-likely strongly-liberal congress, who have a whole lot of strong agendas which are knee-jerk repugnant to almost half of the U.S. population.

    Quote I don't get that he's a micromanager the way Carter was which was probably Carter's greatest downfall.
    I didn't see "micro-managing" as Carter's main problem. He was forced to it by a lack of cooperation from members of the political establishment, and it was magnified by his own inexperience. His presidency illustrates why our country would be best served by an experienced global-level politician, not a local state pol who magically makes it to the big league.

    I'm struggling to be optimistic that history is wrong, and Obama will be a great president.
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  10. TopTop #10
    Braggi's Avatar
    Braggi
     

    Re: Hillary: You go, girl!

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Tars: View Post
    ...

    I'm struggling to be optimistic that history is wrong, and Obama will be a great president.
    I'll hope along with you. I know the deck is stacked against anyone who wants to do something positive in Washington, D.C., but let's keep hoping.

    Hillary will drop out of the race before the Convention.

    You read it here first.

    -Jeff
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