How should Shelter in Place be eased?

[Barry]

How do you think the shelter in place order should be eased, when that time comes?

I think the first step should be to lift the restriction on public parks, especially the beaches that have lots of open space, but keep the requirement for social distancing (with exemptions for immediate families and people living together). This requirement should be enforced with police officers validating groups of people who are not respecting the distancing protocol and issuing citations with fines for those who are not exempted. The rules and citations should get wide publicity in the early days.

Perhaps more offices and stores could be allowed to open, but again, maintaining social distancing at all times. Perhaps odd/even license plates or certain letters of last name initials could be allowed "out" on specific days.

What are your thoughts?

[Barry]

Here's a good article from the NY TImes about what easing the restrictions might look like. I'm looking at the current shelter in place as boot-camp. Get everybody to take it as seriously as possible, and come up to speed with how safe public exposure works. While the restrictions may be eased somewhat, things aren't going to return to normal until there's a vaccine in 12-18 months. But hopefully, especially during the summer, restrictions should ease some..


The Road to Semi-Normal
Imagining America between the crisis and the cure.

By Ross Douthat
Opinion Columnist
April 4, 2020

There will be three stages to the coronavirus era. The stage we’re in now is the period of emergency, when stores are shuttered, church services suspended, even playgrounds closed. The stage we aspire to reach, the stage with reliable treatments and ready vaccination, is the period of normalcy — or the period when we get to discover what normal after the coronavirus means.

But in between is the phase we may inhabit into 2021: The time of semi-normalcy, when strictures are partially lifted, the economy partially reopened, social and cultural life partially resumed. And since it’s the goal of all our efforts now, it’s worth offering some speculation about what that “semi” will entail.

Balkanized normality. In their “Road Map to Reopening,” Scott Gottlieb of the American Enterprise Institute and his co-authors offer several criteria for making the shift out of emergency: A “sustained reduction in cases for at least 14 days,” a hospital system capable of treating coronavirus cases “without resorting to crisis standards of care,” and the capacity to test and monitor every suspected viral case.

Continues here

( I think this article is not behind a paywall. Let me know if you have trouble accessing it - Barry)

[jesswolfe]

Until we have an antibody test and know who’s had it or not, anything we do to ease restrictions will be dangerous.

[cocreator]

Completely agree about parks, as being in Nature is highly healing, especially at a time when so many people are in deep fear and need to ground. Here's info about how and why to ground.

However, people have been flouting this restriction continuously, which is inconsiderate, as well as dangerous for the rest of us. A few days ago I heard children's shouts, and saw a group of 8 people picnicking in Ives Park, with kids on swings in the playground. Meanwhile, Ragle Ranch Park is cordoned off with orange fencing and rangers keeping watch, but it's really up to us to "police" our own behavior at this time. That's part of what this shift is all about: elevating consciousness.

How do you think the shelter in place order should be eased, when that time comes?

I think the first step should be to lift the restriction on public parks, especially the beaches that have lots of open space, but keep the requirement for social distancing (with exemptions for immediate families and people living together). This requirement should be enforced with police officers validating groups of people who are not respecting the distancing protocol and issuing citations with fines for those who are not exempted. The rules and citations should get wide publicity in the early days.

Perhaps more offices and stores could be allowed to open, but again, maintaining social distancing at all times. Perhaps odd/even license plates or certain letters of last name initials could be allowed "out" on specific days.

What are your thoughts?

[Barry]

...Meanwhile, Ragle Ranch Park is cordoned off with orange fencing and rangers keeping watch, but it's really up to us to "police" our own behavior at this time. That's part of what this shift is all about: elevating consciousness.

I think some fines (along with press coverage of the fines) would go along way towards "elevating consciousness".

[PeterB]

Great article...thanks, Barry. The New York Times has eliminated its paywall for coronavirus related journalism. There is a lot of coverage and it is excellent. The Guardian https://www.theguardian.com/uk has the best coverage I've seen of populations at high risk (think Burkina Fasso, and Lesvos -- where there are 25000 refugees living in intolerable conditions).

Here's a good article from the NY TImes about what easing the restrictions might look like. ...

The Road to Semi-Normal
Imagining America between the crisis and the cure.

By Ross Douthat

Continues here

( I think this article is not behind a paywall. Let me know if you have trouble accessing it - Barry)

[spam1]

There are many "non-essential" businesses that could be safely re-opened. I would start with those first. Sole proprietorships, outside workers, businesses that can easily accommodate social distancing. Much more important to those who lost their living than parks or beaches. Office spaces will be the most difficult, and might have to wait until better, fast testing can be supplied; for some industries doing staggered shifts to keep social distancing is a possibility (many cases the employees can work 30-60% from home, and maybe only need to be in the office a few hours a day, or a day or two each week) .

Most construction should open up (many wear masks any how).

Mask should be required everywhere. I've worn one from the start and my friends in China and Japan just don't understand why we waited so long (there, of course, the mask it to prevent you from infecting others); you only need one mask to protect others, just spray it with cleaner and leave overnight.

Once we have opened the businesses then perhaps we have the resources to open parks, but it will take officials to monitor them to enforce masks and to avoid dangerous overcrowding as initially happened.

[M/M]

From 2 ER doctors in Bakersfield, Kern CO, California... who are actually seeing patients, tested over 5000 people etc. Based on their statistics, looking at other California numbers, they say it is time for people who are not high risk to no longer SIP (shelter-in-place).
ER Physician Drops Multiple COVID-19 Bombshells

Entire interview here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfLV...ature=youtu.be

How do you think the shelter in place order should be eased, when that time comes? ...

[M/M]

From 2 ER doctors in Bakersfield, Kern CO, California... who are actually seeing patients, tested over 5000 people etc. Based on their statistics, looking at other California numbers, they say it is time for people who are not high risk to no longer SIP (shelter-in-place).
ER Physician Drops Multiple COVID-19 Bombshells

Entire interview here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfLV...ature=youtu.be

Censorship alive and well; entire interview w/doctors wiped from Youtube after 5 million views:
"This video has been removed for violating YouTube's Terms of Service."

[M/M]

Coming Out of Lockdown Unprepared https://www.unz.com/proberts/coming-...wn-unprepared/
- suggestions from an immunologist and virologist Marc Wathelet, “A Rational Plan to Come Out of Lockdown,” two versions: a longer detailed version or a shorter summary - in article itself. Good arguments for wearing a mask... due to asymptomatic and aerosol transmission.


Lifting the Lockdown; Easy Does It: https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/lifting...-easy-does-it/

[davidkat]

From 2 ER doctors in Bakersfield, Kern CO, California... who are actually seeing patients, tested over 5000 people etc. Based on their statistics, looking at other California numbers, they say it is time for people who are not high risk to no longer SIP (shelter-in-place).
ER Physician Drops Multiple COVID-19 Bombshells

Entire interview here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfLV...ature=youtu.be

Here's the truth about the bogus info from the Trumpster Bakersfield doctors
. Turns out they were losing lots of money from their seven medical clinics!

Shoddy statistics and false claims: Dr. Erickson dangerously misled the public on coronavirus

[M/M]

Here's the truth about the bogus info from the Trumpster Bakersfield doctors
. Turns out they were losing lots of money from their seven medical clinics!

https://thelogicofscience.com/2020/0...n-coronavirus/

The doctors' politics and business ventures do not make their medically based conclusions wrong. Character assassination seems to be method used by the anonymous blogger you reference. Blogger exhorts open mindedness and willingness to be 'wrong', while blog's reason for being is clearly to sabotage anyone who questions some of modern science and resulting technologies.

"We’ve arranged a society on science and technology in which nobody understands anything about science and technology, and this combustible mixture of ignorance and power sooner or later is going to blow up in our faces. I mean, who is running the science and technology in a democracy, if the people don’t know anything about it?" – Carl Sagan to Charlie Rose, May 27, 1996

[M/M]

Bronx ER doctor and others weigh in:
NY Post: Doctors on the front lines say it's time to begin opening up

[gypsey]

FYI The censorship may have come about b/c they are not ER doctors, they OWN a for profit clinic (nthing wrong with that in the USA, but it is important to note. Also, How could they possibly have tested 5000 patients when these tests were not available?

Censorship alive and well; entire interview w/doctors wiped from Youtube after 5 million views:
"This video has been removed for violating YouTube's Terms of Service."

[gypsey]

I endorse most of your suggestions. I was appalled that close contact services were opened up in Georgia and though some followed guidelines, others did not. These are some of the services we rely on most yet can be high risk such as dog groomers, spas, gyms and hair salons/barbers. This is where testing and enforcement will be important b/c of the close contact. I also endorse opening parks b/c not everyone lives near a country lane or has a pleasant back yard. Getting out in the fresh air and sunshine is important to mental health. .

There are many "non-essential" businesses that could be safely re-opened. ...

[M/M]

Do lockdowns save many lives? In most places, the data say no
T.J. Rodgers The Wall Street Journal

The Real Economic Problem Is Not the Closedown https://www.globalresearch.ca/real-economic-problem-not-closedown/5711340

and in the boggling our minds with stealthy double-speak department:
Flipping the script: WHO lauds lockdown-ignoring Sweden as a 'model' for countries going forward