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  1. TopTop #121
    podfish's Avatar
    podfish
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Goat Rock Ukulele: View Post
    "One of the options being proposed is to set up this month a temporary indoor and outdoor shelter at the county fairgrounds for those currently living on the trail and others. Officials said the shelter would have 24/7 security, on-site supervision and screening and medical and mental health support services."

    Exactly what most of these folks don't want. Most want someplace where they will be left to do their own thing, not be policed, or on-site supervised, screened or mental health messed with.
    as a practical matter, that's not going to be the policy. With luck it'll be the eventual outcome, but you can't have government help without (at least the appearance of) government oversight. That'll be part of the price of getting the voters to put up the money without too much squawking.
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  3. TopTop #122
    terijane's Avatar
    terijane
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    This partial solution could easily happen in Santa Rosa:

    Tiny House Villages For Seattle’s Homeless by Low Income Housing Institute
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  5. TopTop #123
    cyberanvil
    Guest

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Supes To Discuss Options For Tent-Dwellers Along Joe Rodota Trail https://patch.com/california/rohnert...e-rodota-trail
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  6. TopTop #124
    Dorothy Friberg's Avatar
    Dorothy Friberg
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Keep in mind that this is in part, a seasonal development. As a long time volunteer at the Morgan Street homeless services center, year after year we saw a doubling of need for people to receive services. We considered it flushing of the culverts and saw the same folks year after year. I know of several women who got pregnant at the Armory shelter thereby assuring them of services for a couple of years. This encampment will be made invisible for the time being, but the needs will be ignored when the sun comes out.
    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Goat Rock Ukulele: View Post
    "One of the options being proposed is to set up this month a temporary indoor and outdoor shelter at the county fairgrounds for those currently living on the trail and others. Officials said the shelter would have 24/7 security, on-site supervision and screening and medical and mental health support services."

    Exactly what most of these folks don't want. ...
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  8. TopTop #125
    patnicholson
    Supporting Member

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Homeless Action! has $.5 /million to spend on homeless. .

    where do you think the money is going to come from when a 60yr. old senior comes down w/pneumonia
    after living in a tent in a ditch in the middle of winter? What's that going to cost for a week's stay in a hospital,
    and when she 's released, is she back to a tent in a rainwater ditch?
    Last edited by Barry; 12-18-2019 at 10:27 AM.
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  10. TopTop #126
    tommy's Avatar
    tommy
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    There are some generalizations in your post, that are not accurate. I don't think it's true that most people wouldn't want shelter at the fairgrounds. Likely there are some, but in this cold rainy weather, many would like some kind of shelter that is not wet or cold. Women and parents with children would also like it, for protection, as there are predators in homeless camps. There are also some that would welcome rehabilitation services, so they don't spend the rest of their lives homeless.

    I agree it would be cruel to let them move to the fairgrounds, then run them out in the summer. A government sponsored encampment would let them live there throughout the year.

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  12. TopTop #127
    Shandi's Avatar
    Shandi
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Welcome to the wine country! This shameful, distressing, and disgusting situation is being shared by countries outside ours. See the DailyMail.Co.UK's article on the mile long homeless tent city. Maybe the fact that this might keep tourists away, would be a prod at the city officials to take steps to mitigate this horrendous problem.

    See pictures of the JR trail folks, and other homeless encampments elsewhere in Sacramento, San Francisco, and Los Angeles.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7798083

    Last edited by Barry; 12-19-2019 at 11:46 AM.
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  14. TopTop #128
    Meinvelt
    Guest

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    I completely agree with you!
    Quote Posted in reply to the post by tommy: View Post
    ... I don't think it's true that most people wouldn't want shelter at the fairgrounds. ...
    Last edited by Barry; 12-19-2019 at 11:46 AM.
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  16. TopTop #129
    Goat Rock Ukulele's Avatar
    Goat Rock Ukulele
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    3 richest Americans holding more wealth than the bottom 50%. That is messed up, That math says to me they could buy a condo for every single homeless person and hardly feel it. have fun getting your camel through that needle eye. My hat is off to the guy who went down there with a slew of tarps and couple hundred yards of visqueen.
    Last edited by Barry; 12-19-2019 at 11:47 AM.
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  18. TopTop #130
    Goat Rock Ukulele's Avatar
    Goat Rock Ukulele
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by tommy: View Post
    ... I don't think it's true that most people wouldn't want shelter at the fairgrounds....
    That would depend on what the shelter at the fairgrounds is to be, what the rules are or not.

    Certainly most folks along the trail would like better shelter at the fair grounds or any other place. I'm saying what they don't want is to be housed in big rooms with the next guy snoring 4 feet away with lights out at 10pm little or no privacy. At least half the people that have been long term on the street are mentally ill and want/need to self medicate. There are also many addicts that would be able to function if they quit using. Many in this group only recover when it gets just as bad as it can.

    I don't believe there are many women with children along the path that don't want to be there. Shelters prioritize women and children for obvious reasons. And certainly they want and need services of all kinds. But most also want one of the only things they have left, freedom to come and go as they please, to have a pets with them or not, to build a hovel no matter how humble, to get stoned or not, to not be managed or over policed, to be able to move their tent a hundred yards down with a friend they made, to not be relocated in June because the fair is coming up, etc.

    I'm for letting people build shanties and bringing in Rvs certain areas or bringing in Home Depot sheds. Native Americans lived here for 10,000 years in hovels of sticks and thatch, an old RV is so much better than that. We have made the requirements of a dwelling so safe (and expensive) that growing numbers can't afford to live in one.

    We are reaching the point where we need economic refugee camps along the lines of a Drs without Borders operation in a war zone. 43% greater homeless population in Los Angeles according to one article I read. We are in an emergency and building code rules need to be suspended for some. It costs $10 to put a smoke detector in tough shed to make it relatively safe. But as someone else said the county/city can never do something like that. They are paralyzed by rules and regulations.

    Put those Home Depot Sheds, Tents, Rvs all round that mile and a quarter race track, I'm sick of seeing horses pushed past their limit, breaking down and being shot anyway.


    Last edited by Barry; 12-19-2019 at 11:50 AM.
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  20. TopTop #131
    AJL's Avatar
    AJL
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    How about parks departments building enormous public membership indoor tennis clubs that can be used for beds for the homeless at night and tennis and/or other indoor sports during the day. People using the tennis courts could help cover the cost of construction/maintaining the building.
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  21. TopTop #132
    M/M's Avatar
    M/M
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Deep State war more and more apparent:

    Criminalizing homelessness - versus - Houston's relatively successful approach of redirecting resources towards PERMANENT housing: https://www.citylab.com/equity/2019/...elters/603670/

    Wonder if Ben Carson our (sic) Housing Secretary will use FEMA camps, as well as former prisons and federal buildings - if this proceeds to Executive Order status? Santa Rosa is in his sights, along w/ 19 other California cities and 4 states.

    Quote Advocates say that they expect an executive order on homelessness to assign new resources to police departments to remove homeless encampments and even strip housing funds from cities that choose to tolerate these encampments.

    Carson’s latest stop is yet another signal that the administration is keen to take a hands-on approach to people who sleep on the street. Advocates say that the government is looking closely at ways to turn former correctional facilities and federal buildings into shelters, a controversial approach backed by Robert Marbut, the newly appointed White House czar on homelessness.

    In addition to 20 cities, four of the places named on the list are states that have homeless populations outside the largest urban centers.

    ....In September, when the White House released a report on homelessness, it signaled a change away from the Housing First direction long favored by the Interagency Council on Homelessness. Going forward, the administration appears to be leaning on a prominent role for law enforcement, with a focus on shelters that sequester homeless people away from downtown in large, centralized facilities.

    ....Late in November, an official at HUD sent an email to Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler and other officials in Oregon to express Carson’s interest in determining whether an unused jail in Portland could be repurposed for a pilot program to address homelessness, according to a report in Willamette Week

    ...
    The Trump administration may pursue its agenda on homelessness on other fronts. An executive order—said to be the brainchild of Benjamin Hobbs, special assistant to the president for domestic policy—might not materialize for weeks (if ever)....

    But the broader campaign to criminalize homelessness hit a snag on Monday, when the U.S. Supreme Court declined to hear a case from Boise, Idaho, about whether local and state governments can make it a crime for people to sleep outside.
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  23. TopTop #133
    BlueBayou's Avatar
    BlueBayou
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Here is the SPECIAL MEETING AGENDA of The Sonoma County Board of Supervisors
    To be held Monday 12/23 9:00am on an EMERGENCY RESOLUTION TO HOMELESS ISSUES and JR TRAIL RESIDENTS

    See Agenda here
    Last edited by Barry; 12-22-2019 at 12:55 PM.
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  25. TopTop #134
    BlueBayou's Avatar
    BlueBayou
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    You can see the attached documents, including a PDF of a Powerpoint presentation here

    Very Interesting.
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  26. TopTop #135
    BlueBayou's Avatar
    BlueBayou
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    If someone does peek at the agenda items being proposed, please confirm my math. I think it reads a 2019-2020 budget approval of 12 million dollars to serve 120 people.
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  28. TopTop #136
    Barry's Avatar
    Barry
    Founder & Moderator

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail



    Sonoma County supervisors approve $11 million in emergency spending on Santa Rosa homeless encampment
    TYLER SILVY
    THE PRESS DEMOCRAT December 23, 2019, 1:31PM

    Sonoma County supervisors on Monday approved a plan to address the county’s largest homeless encampment, agreeing to spend $11.63 million to begin to chip away at the 200-plus-person camp that officials have for months labeled a public health emergency.

    The move allocated millions of dollars to set immediately up at least two sanctioned encampments featuring a combination of indoor and outdoor shelter and services and to buy and lease existing housing and cover support services.

    The two sanctioned encampments — locations were not publicly identified or discussed Monday — would cost $2.08 million and are expected to house up to 40 people apiece, according to county documents.

    The county would spend up to $5 million to buy six large, multibedroom houses that could serve up to 60 people; put $750,000 into annual leases of six to seven units to serve another 20 people; and use $3.1 million to hire six new staffers and fund contracts for drug treatment beds and medical support.

    The board’s action gives comes as the population of the camp on the Joe Rodota Trail continues to swell, with tents and other makeshift shelters pitched along a half-mile segment of the county-owned trail near Stony Point Road.


    Continues here

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  30. TopTop #137
    Jude Iam's Avatar
    Jude Iam
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    last week, highest court of our land, "refuses to consider" defense of the most vulnerable among us. jude

    Supreme Court refuses to consider cities' efforts to prosecute the homeless for sleeping outside


    Richard Wolf Chris Woodyard USA TODAY

    ...
    "We’re thrilled that the court has let the 9th Circuit decision stand so that homeless people are not punished for sleeping on the streets when they have no other option," said Maria Foscarinis, executive director of the National Law Center on Homelessness & Poverty. "But ultimately, our goal is to end homelessness through housing, which is effective and saves taxpayer dollars, so that no one has to sleep on the streets in the first place."
    ...
    Last edited by Barry; 12-24-2019 at 11:54 AM.
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  31. TopTop #138
    podfish's Avatar
    podfish
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Jude Iam: View Post
    last week, highest court of our land, "refuses to consider" defense of the most vulnerable among us. jude
    jude,that's exactly backwards. For once they refused to act to support the agenda of business interests over those with little economic power. Sure, they didn't force cities to provide services directly but that wasn't an option in the case before them. They certainly did prohibit criminalizing homeless and implied strongly that cities must provide housing. Unless you have different sources than I've seen?
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  33. TopTop #139
    sealwatcher's Avatar
    sealwatcher
    Supporting member

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    When the Supreme Court refuses to hear a case the lower court decision remains. Would have to read the lower court's decision to know details. podfish, have you read it? "Sure, they didn't force cities to provide services directly but that wasn't an option in the case before them. They certainly did prohibit criminalizing homeless and implied strongly that cities must provide housing. "

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by podfish: View Post
    jude,that's exactly backwards. ...
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  34. TopTop #140
    Barry's Avatar
    Barry
    Founder & Moderator

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Here's a clearer article.

    My understanding is that:
    • Boise tried to criminalize outdoor sleeping;
    • the appeals court overturned the ban: "violates the 8th Amendment insofar as it imposes criminal sanctions against homeless individuals for sleeping outdoors on public property, when no alternative shelter is available to them."
    • the supreme court let the appeals court ruling stand


    Washington Examiner:
    Supreme Court declines to hear challenge to ruling letting homeless sleep outdoors


    by Spencer Neale | December 16, 2019

    Officials across nine Western states are powerless to address growing concerns regarding homeless encampments on city sidewalks after the Supreme Court decided not to hear a challenge on the practice.

    The San Francisco-based 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled against an outdoor sleeping ban proposed, in part, by the city of Boise, Idaho, last year. On Monday, the justices on the Supreme Court turned down hearing a challenge to the ruling without comment.

    Lawyers representing the city argued the "creation of a de facto constitutional right to live on sidewalks and in parks will cripple the ability of more than 1,600 municipalities in the 9th Circuit to maintain the health and safety of their communities."

    The case revolves around how to process homeless people when shelters are available but individuals refuse to utilize them, preferring to sleep in public. The ruling found that a city ordinance "violates the 8th Amendment insofar as it imposes criminal sanctions against homeless individuals for sleeping outdoors on public property, when no alternative shelter is available to them."

    In Los Angeles alone, an estimated 8,000 to 11,000 homeless people live in a 50-block radius referred to as Skid Row, and the city has seen a 12% increase in its homeless population this year. In 2006, the Supreme Court ruled the California city could not enforce laws against sleeping in public places.

    “Just as the state may not criminalize the state of being homeless in public places,” wrote 9th Circuit Court Judge Marsha Berzon, "the state may not criminalize conduct that is an unavoidable consequence of being homeless — namely sitting, lying or sleeping on the streets.”

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  36. TopTop #141
    Jude Iam's Avatar
    Jude Iam
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    ah, yes, thanks for correction.

    anyway, reminds me of Anatole France's
    “The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread.”

    jude
    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Barry: View Post
    Here's a clearer article.

    My understanding is that:...
    Last edited by Barry; 12-25-2019 at 11:19 AM.
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  38. TopTop #142
    Dorothy Friberg's Avatar
    Dorothy Friberg
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Well, what about the rich who steal the bread from the poor?

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Jude Iam: View Post
    ah, yes, thanks for correction.

    anyway, reminds me of Anatole France's
    “The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread.”

    jude
    Last edited by Barry; 12-27-2019 at 01:15 PM.
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  40. TopTop #143
    cyberanvil
    Guest

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    It truly saddens me to think of the homeless and their condition. No matter the reason, these people could be helped if our elected government officials were really serious and thought it would benefit themselves. Many good people and organizations are trying, but this situation needs a coordinated and focused resolution involving major agencies. Surely there is intelligence and money to solve this problem.

    Bullet Trains and Smart Trains are built, taxes are raised and life goes on as the politicians pat themselves on the back. Yet there are people, citizens, hungry, cold, ill, traumatized and etc. that need help. But the trains will run and we will feel proud.

    As happens too often, the situation isn’t taken seriously until the pot boils over in a massive way. Consider the homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail. 200 people caused the Country to offer some Band-Aids. An old Japanese proverb, 'The nail that sticks out shall be hammered down'? Do you think this is normal? An American idiom "The squeaky wheel gets the grease. ..... Could we have fewer hammers and scythes and more buckets of grease?
    Last edited by Barry; 12-27-2019 at 12:58 PM.
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  42. TopTop #144
    Jude Iam's Avatar
    Jude Iam
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    YES, to actually do something about the rich who steal from the poor -
    NOW IS THE TIME FOR THAT:
    https://act.berniesanders.com/signup/volunteer


    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Dorothy Friberg: View Post
    Well, what about the rich who steal the bread from the poor?
    Last edited by Barry; 12-27-2019 at 12:58 PM.
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  44. TopTop #145
    finnie
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    I suggest that a bunch of opinions about what other people want or don't want for reasons they say bear no weight with me. They're just a stab in the dark. What is true is that most people on the Rodota trail don't want to go the Sam Jones shelter because of previous bad experiences. But they're going to be offered a better system than the overcrowded Sam Jones dormitories. Let's wait and see what they actually choose - all these opinions from people who have houses are meaningless.
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  46. TopTop #146
    Thad's Avatar
    Thad
     

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    I'm thinking a 3D dictionary with a campground.

    remnant of a fire council

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by finnie: View Post
    I suggest that a bunch of opinions about what other people want or don't want for reasons they say bear no weight with me. They're just a stab in the dark. What is true is that most people on the Rodota trail don't want to go the Sam Jones shelter because of previous bad experiences. But they're going to be offered a better system than the overcrowded Sam Jones dormitories. Let's wait and see what they actually choose - all these opinions from people who have houses are meaningless.
    Name:  1RemnantofaFireCouncil.jpg
Views: 189
Size:  21.7 KB
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  47. TopTop #147
    cyberanvil
    Guest

    Re: Homeless encampments along the Joe Rodota Trail

    Has anyone actually heard/listened to anyone who is or has been homeless?
    This is one viewpoint.

    "I'm good now, but i have a mental disorder, I've been a drug addict and I've been homeless. i understand it can be circumstances that gets you in this situation, but it can also be your fault. I'm talking about the type of homelessness that is their fault. The people that trash their surroundings, poo on the street, shoot up in public. the people that take advantage of the kindness of strangers. we have to differentiate between people that deserve a hand up and those that should be in jail. people that as a society we should be expecting more out of. not all homeless are the same. and not all homeless will do better with housing and a warm meal. when we talk about the homeless, lets not be so quick to judge those of us that want these people i'm talking about put in jail, taken off the street and stopped from doing harmful things to our society. its fine for you caring people to care for the mentally ill and those that are homeless for no other reason then a bad situation. we need more help there. don't make it out that all homeless are the same, they are not. we wont judge you, don't judge us."
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