Recall Carrillo

What happened, the thread is gone?

Efren Carrillo reached out and requested a conversation. We spoke and came to an understanding. He explained himself and his position convincingly. We've accepted his choices and the reasons for them. He identified the treatment center he checked himself into. It all checks out. So, we've dropped the recall drive. What the hell are we gonna do with all those damn buttons?

This effort was about, and only about, accountability and a defense of liberty. The recent Princeton study defining our current federal government as an oligarchy is chilling. Oligarchies aren't accountable. They don't ask permission. They do what they want. They don't apologize. Apparently, it's no longer a matter of where we're headed; we've arrived.

Oligarchy, Kleptocracy, Kakistocracy, Autocracy, Dictocracy, all abstractions, $2.00 words communicating an eminent end to liberty.

Recent Supreme Court rulings have resulted in an erosion of what once were considered natural rights. Police can enter your home without a warrant. Your phone can be tapped, your email read, your financials revealed, your life laid bare without probable cause or the issuance of a warrant. A broad expansion allowing the practice of eminent domain has made an oxymoron of the term private property. It's chilling

Our police forces have militarized. They're no longer a unit of public service, but paramilitary forces. largely unaccountable. The rate of homicide in this country has plummeted over the last decade. Our police are being outfitted as if for war. Maybe they know something we don't. It's chilling.

Efren's refusal to offer proof he'd honestly entered into rehab had all the appearances of just another straw on the camel's back, one more example of oligarchic entitlement. He was offered the opportunity to put all doubt to rest. In pride he refused. And so the recall drive was born.

Mr. Carrillo has now chosen to offer the necessary proofs. They check out. He's lived up to his side of the bargain. We now live up to ours. We don't retract any the information that has been communicated; it was accurate. We don't condone the actions that landed him in his current situation. His behavior was improper, unacceptable, even frightening. He's very fortunate to be so well connected. Otherwise, we believe, he'd currently be an inmate in the county lock up.

But he has stepped up and made himself accountable. He seems truly committed to a recovery, to acknowledging his condition and to maintaining a composure necessary for his rehabilitation. This we can applaud.

So the drive to recall Supervisor Efren Carrillo has been put to rest. Thank you to those who supported this effort during its brief run. It achieved its purpose. We judge this qualifies it as having been successful, though we regret that it ever saw the light of day in the first place.

Thank you,

Recall Carrillo

It's more important where he is than where he was

https://www.waccobb.net/forums/showt...469#post180469

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

Hello all, it's been a while. I reached out to Barry and asked if he had a problem with my pushing an issue I'm passionate about on WACCO. As gracious as ever (well, more times than not) he invited me to make my case. So here goes.

I'm spearheading an effort to recall Carrillo...

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Barry,
I'm more than a little surprised you let anyone in this forum call another a "prick".

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

...I'm spearheading an effort to recall Carrillo. I gave him the benefit of the doubt for a while. I thought I saw real contrition, honest self evaluation and a commitment to self improvement. Now I feel I've been duped. Indications are he's reverting into the same insufferable, arrogant prick he proved to be up until his meltdown.

So I'm looking to oust him and I'd like to talk about it. What better forum than WACCO. ...

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Wherever he was, he came back the minute people started publicly saying that he wasn't "doing his job"........

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

...In a recent conversation with Efren, he objected to divulging the location on the grounds that to do so would challenge his recovery. ....

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I can't comment on your Recall Carrillo Facebook page without "liking" it, which I don't. If I could comment, I would say this:

I fully support Efren Carrillo in continuing his work as Supervisor, and believe that what he is learning from his mistake will serve his constituency. I think recall efforts are a waste of time, money, emotion, and intellect, and do not benefit our county. Please stop distracting our supervisors and other officials from the vital issues affecting our county and species. And please, let Efren Carrillo do his job.

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

I'll begin the conversation with a post from our new Facebook page RECALL CARRILLO. It explores the whereabouts of Efren during his purported stint in rehab. Let me know what you think, pro or con.

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I do not endorse this recall. Although you make some valid points about accountability and responsibility, I have an understanding that comes from 35 years treating addicts and their families, both in treatment facilities and in private practice. I watched with open mind and heart the process that Efren went through, open to join with the side that wants him out, open to the side that has compassion, forgiveness and empathy. I have chosen the latter side because I heard his warm-hearted amends in his testimony. I looked for trickery. I didn't see it. I have seen evidence of authentic recovery.

As I have stated in past discussions, it is so rare these days to support transformation; to discern when to trust and when to ferret out the posers. So many people do not truly understand how deep the change is when recovery is truly embraced, and do not know the painstaking deep work that is then accomplished. It is very hard to discern when this occurs unless one has personal experience and training with such a transformation.

This recall attempt feels like the mirror/shadow of just what the accusation is: abuse and mysogyny. If holding him accountable is the goal, it is met by his committment to abstinence and the ongoing lifetime recovery process.

Revenge doesn't relieve the grief and fear of the vics. Punishment doesn't work. Shame doesn't work. If transformation is the goal, effectiveness needs to be the measure: How effective is the intervention? To the point about holding our leaders to a higher standard of conduct, I say,"This man is a hero in that he WOKE UP, and let us all see this by his vulnerability and honesty." Wouldn't that be amazing if Koch bros, or Bushes or Rove did the same?

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

Hello all, it's been a while. I reached out to Barry and asked if he had a problem with my pushing an issue I'm passionate about on WACCO. As gracious as ever (well, more times than not) he invited me to make my case. So here goes.

I'm spearheading an effort to recall Carrillo. I gave him the benefit of the doubt for a while. I thought I saw real contrition, honest self evaluation and a commitment to self improvement. Now I feel I've been duped. Indications are he's reverting into the same insufferable, arrogant jerk he proved to be up until his meltdown...

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

It is a democracy, you are free to vote your conscience.

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So are you starting a formal process to place a recall on the ballot?
What's required for that to happen?

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

Ten 5th District constituents registered to vote file a request for recall status

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Thanks for the detailed answer to my second question. How about my first question? And if you are starting the recall process, how do you plan to get 10,000 signatures?

Since you asked, I will respond. At the risk of alienating some friends, with whom I do agree, I think a campaign to recall Efren Carrillo would be very expensive and likely to fail. Keeping pressure on him, as the Santa Rosa City Council recently did, is wise. However, I think a recall effort is likely to backfire and strengthen rather than weaken him. Since I think a recall campaign would be futile, I consider it a waste of valuable time and effort. Carrillo has too much support. I think a wiser political strategy is to wait until the next election. He may not even run then.

Getting a strong candidate would be important, whether Carrillo runs or not. Who might good, possible candidates be to represent the 5th District? That seems to me like a better thing to spend time on.

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

"Let me know what you think, pro or con."

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"WOKE UP''?? He didn't wake up, he GOT CAUGHT.

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Posted in reply to the post by Fillie:

I do not endorse this recall. Although you make some valid points about accountability and responsibility, I have an understanding that comes from 35 years treating addicts and their families, both in treatment facilities and in private practice. I watched with open mind and heart the process that Efren went through, open to join with the side that wants him out, open to the side that has compassion, forgiveness and empathy. I have chosen the latter side because I heard his warm-hearted amends in his testimony. I looked for trickery. I didn't see it. I have seen evidence of authentic recovery...

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And so I have edited mine, but without repeating the offensive word.

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

I'll apologize for having offended you, but not for my opinion. I have edited the remark as you do have a point. Prick is rude though I don't find it anywhere near to being as harsh as cocksucker.

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Posted in reply to the post by Shepherd:

Since you asked, I will respond. At the risk of alienating some friends, with whom I do agree, I think a campaign to recall Efren Carrillo would be very expensive and likely to fail. Keeping pressure on him, as the Santa Rosa City Council recently did, is wise. However, I think a recall effort is likely to backfire and strengthen rather than weaken him. Since I think a recall campaign would be futile, I consider it a waste of valuable time and effort. Carrillo has too much support. I think a wiser political strategy is to wait until the next election. He may not even run then.

Getting a strong candidate would be important, whether Carrillo runs or not. Who might good, possible candidates be to represent the 5th District? That seems to me like a better thing to spend time on.

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I agree with you Shepard that a recall is very expensive and that he has deep pockets within the Democratic party and many large resource extraction industry businesses in this county BUT what is the cost to the tax payers by letting him continue many of his anti environment/pro business votes in support of his business allies and collecting his pension as well? I do not have an answer to that myself nor do I have all the numbers in front of me as most do not either but if a petition is brought forward I will be glad to sign it.

Filie: I absolutely agree that forgiveness and compassion for the person who committed the action of question and for that person to wake up is what heals the heart for many. I sincerely hope that does happen for him as I do for everyone on the planet. I agree the recall does feel like revenge but to a point. To draw attention away from Carillo by bringing up far worse offenders is a "duck and dodge" ploy that I do not feel bears merit. Did you want to have those men recalled and held for trial for their actions? I did and still want them tried. However like those whom you mentioned (Bush Cheney Rove), Carrillo is a public figure and by that measure IS held to a higher standard and is accountable for such obscene behavior. He has proven that he is not in control of himself with regards to women and seems to continue with an attitude of " I got off again and I have the connections and a slick lawyer to carry on". In my opinion he should do his healing for his own well being, but out of office right now!

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

Hello all, it's been a while. I reached out to Barry and asked if he had a problem with my pushing an issue I'm passionate about on WACCO. As gracious as ever (well, more times than not) he invited me to make my case. So here goes.

I'm spearheading an effort to recall Carrillo. I gave him the benefit of the doubt for a while. I thought I saw real contrition, honest self evaluation and a commitment to self improvement. Now I feel I've been duped. Indications are he's reverting into the same insufferable, arrogant jerk he proved to be up until his meltdown....

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Why don't you begin your recall effort by giving wacco a name, preferably your real name. I noticed you joined yesterday, an early indication of a possible troll. You want to put yourself out there, then do it for real instead of hiding.

That said, Efren was acquitted. I know he has been supremely embarrassed by this silly and regrettable incident and he is trying to put it behind him and just do the job he was elected to do. Was he acting in his official capacity during the incident? No. Is he entitled to a private life? I believe he is. Did he make a mistake, take responsibility, and express sincere regret? Absolutely. Does the public need folks like you chewing his arse ad nauseum? Nope. Let Efren do his job and his fate will be decided at the next election.

"Woke up" refers to his subsequent recovery process, including abstinence, attendance at AA for life, restoration work, which the public is not necessarily privvy to. In my post, I kept referring to transformation, waking up. Since addiction is an impairment of the will, it takes many more dire consequences for the addict to fund a will to change. We all receive wake up calls from the Universe, whether or when we heed them rests on multiple and complex influences. Most addicts do not wake up. He did.

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Posted in reply to the post by Sara S:

"WOKE UP''?? He didn't wake up, he GOT CAUGHT.

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Very sensible, Shepherd.

I'd like to add that, whatever its outcome for Efren Carrillo, a recall campaign is certain to weaken our community. The waste, the animosity, the divisiveness will do none of us any good, and undermine our ability to act collectively for our common good.

Although I tentatively plan to vote for Efren Carrillo if he runs again, I completely agree that finding a strong candidate is a better thing to spend time on. Equally good is staying in touch with Efren's current work, not necessarily "keeping pressure on him," but observing the quality of his insights and actions through the course of issues between now and the next election. And letting him know what you expect, what you see as the important and best directions for our county to move.

Depending on his responses, you may end up voting for him yourself.

Thank you for your gentle, common sense assessment of the recall.

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Posted in reply to the post by Shepherd:

...I think a campaign to recall Efren Carrillo would be very expensive and likely to fail. ...I think a wiser political strategy is to wait until the next election. ...Getting a strong candidate would be important, whether Carrillo runs or not. ....

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Addiction treatment is covered by insurance as a medical condition, therefore it is HIPAA and CFR 42, Pt.II protected, so even if you were to find out which facility he was at for initial treatment, they would not reveal if he was there or when he may have been there. Since most inpatient private treatment centers are small operations, they do not have security personnel, and would probably request that Carrillo not expose them to any controversial involvement by a furious public. Kaiser does have a security force.

This is all pretty reasonable to a knowledgeable person so I am trying to give you the info. in hopes of creating a deeper understanding of recovery. I can say I am feeling shocked at the attitudes about addiction being so vengeful--smacks of prohibition views of punishment and retribution, so ice age. I am wondering what the motivation is for such punitive and judgmental positions. As a public, we don't punish or vilify the schizophrenic who screams at their demons on the street, especially if we understand that affliction (the system may, but those of us who have a family member with that disorder, or who have taken a lot of LSD or who have had a psychotic episode) do not. C'mon ppl, lighten up.

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

As devil's advocate I'll ask what will be your justification should it be revealed that Efren never entered rehab, but instead was squirreled away by his enablers?

The motivation behind the recall drive is his refusal to name the center he purportedly entered. ...

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Posted in reply to the post by sandoak:

"I'd like to add that, whatever its outcome for Efren Carrillo, a recall campaign is certain to weaken our community. The waste, the animosity, the divisiveness will do none of us any good, and undermine our ability to act collectively for our common good."

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Congratulations, you've just dissed an entire generation's effort to effect change. Now it's all about slogans. "HOPE", "CHANGE" "OCCUPY" "There, we've said 'em, we're done. Wait, we forgot to get arrested. Let's go sign up and get hog tied. After making bail we should be home by dinner time. I've got a crock pot cooking".

Do you forget Vietnam, Nixon. LBJ, Kent State, Civil Rights, South African Apartheid, the LBGT Movement to name just a few of the issues that generation tackled? And now all is well. We can rest on our laurels cause everything and everyone is so damn righteous in acting "collectively for our common good." Let me inform you, these protest as rancorous as they could be did not "weaken our community." They made it stronger.

My aunt, 17 at the time, had her head opened up by a cop's billy club at the Chicago 68 Republican Convention. A "square" wrapped her wound with his tie to staunch the bleeding before she was taken to the hospital. She saved that blood encrusted totem as proof of her commitment. She'd find your words ridiculous. Before her death, she would have been proud to have been called "divisive".

As many waccopolitans will attest, I have been a vocal critic of Efren Carillo and his latest exploits. Having said that, I am sorry that Recall Carillo chose to stoop so low as to use this particular picture of him as an avatar - out on the town having a good time. I can't get behind cheap shots. Would I like to see him recalled? You bet! But not for tearing up the dance floor...

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

Yes, Barry the initial petition is in the works. We expect to be certified around the 1st of July. This is a concerted effort drawing on a diverse cross section of the 5th District. There's a lot more discontent than you'd imagine. Once we submit the initial petition the press will pick up the story. It's going to be interesting.

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I don't have much money, but I would contribute all that I can for recalling Carrillo. When women are not protected by the legal system, it's time to step up to the plate, and throw away rotting garbage.

I really wish there was an "ingratitude" button. Sandoak....wow, I am speechless. I can only wonder what "special interest" you have in Efren Carrillo's continuation as a Sonoma County Supervisor. As a woman, I can't imagine how you could justify the actions of a man violating your home in this way. (Perhaps his "celebrity" status entitles him in your eyes???)

I don't want Efren to "do his job" as you say, which actually is sucking up to the wine industry as well as sucking up our tax dollars into his salary when he should be in jail as a felon for admittedly attempting to break and enter a woman's bedroom with intent to ..........???

The "vital issues" you refer to need to be dealt with by responsible, trustworthy, honorable individuals. These adjectives do NOT describe Mr. Efren Carrillo.

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Posted in reply to the post by sandoak:

I can't comment on your Recall Carrillo Facebook page without "liking" it, which I don't. If I could comment, I would say this:

I fully support Efren Carrillo in continuing his work as Supervisor, and believe that what he is learning from his mistake will serve his constituency. I think recall efforts are a waste of time, money, emotion, and intellect, and do not benefit our county. Please stop distracting our supervisors and other officials from the vital issues affecting our county and species. And please, let Efren Carrillo do his job.

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If he wasn't so well connected, he would have been out in a couple of hours. I had a parallel situation happen to me -screen cutting, the whole thing. My not-famous lowlife was out of jail in 3 hours and charges dropped in three days. I went to the DA's office to ask how they decided who to let go and who to go after. I was waiting for my trial at the time and the atty said what he did wasn't that impt but I was a menace. Then a Lurch-like protector came out, hand on gun and said if he ever saw me near the DA's office again, he'd arrest me. Believe me, I'd rather have Efren outside my window and have a cadre of people to protect me than having to fight the system alone.

I personally respect Efren for not being cowed by all the "off with his head" people and not just running away from a humiliating situation. . He admitted his disease; he went into rehab. I don't think it's anyone's business where he went or if it was inpatient or out. I'm pretty sure anyone who would ask those questions knows nothing about alcoholism. I think he can be a role model for kids- to admit when they are sick or wrong and stand up and say it. And follow his lead and get help. Who's going to admit any wrongdoing or mistakes if they see they're going to be crucified for it.. And all this crap about it's the legal system's antifeminist stance, blah, blah, blah. What am I mincemeat? I'm a woman and believe me, no one came to rescue me when I got roughed up by the cops and thrown in jail. I lost a part of myself when I realized there is no justice. Anywhere.

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

What happened, the thread is gone?

Efren Carrillo reached out and requested a conversation. We spoke and came to an understanding. He explained himself and his position convincingly. We've accepted his choices and the reasons for them. He identified the treatment center he checked himself into. It all checks out. So, we've dropped the recall drive. What the hell are we gonna do with all those damn buttons?

This effort was about, and only about, accountability and a defense of liberty. The recent Princeton study defining our current federal government as an oligarchy is chilling. Oligarchies aren't accountable. They don't ask permission. They do what they want. They don't apologize. Apparently, it's no longer a matter of where we're headed; we've arrived...

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To: Fillie:

Addiction is no more an impairment of will than diabetes is. Read a book that was written past 1930. They took homosexuality out of the DSM too. Maybe you should get up to date.

I am sorry to see that the recall drive is over for Carillo. I am also more concerned about how the most important issue involving his actions within this thread has been side tracked which is very symptomatic of our society. That is his behavior towards women. This was side tracked not just by men but by many women on this thread as well. Alcohol was only the catalyst for his actions. His abusive predatory nature towards women is a far deeper issue and alcohol rehab is not going to fix that.

Yes, substance abuse is a big issue and can cloud judgement and clear thinking and policy making. Far to many of us recognize and are guilty of this and that includes myself. I believe this is reason enough for someone to take time off WITHOUT PAY to get rehab but his disregard and violent actions towards women also cloud his judgment and places all of us in jeopardy by having someone with deep unconscious prejudice that disregards women in general passing laws and ordinances. And then he doesn't have the dignity to step down. Just look at history and current trends to see how equality, respect and honoring of women is still a dangerous problem and endemic within society and how many women are unconsciously part of that as well including responses within this thread.

His behavior towards women and his campaign lies about him being an environmental candidate and then voting in favor of his donors (big agribusiness and resource extraction industries) , not those who voted for him, in my opinion is why he should step down and why I am very sorry the campaign recall has ended. Future politicians can now expect to not be held accountable.

Thank you Jon, that was the first thing I noticed about "Recall Carrillo". Appearances seem to be that we are not dealing with a person. Leaves zero credibility about anything it does &/or has to say. In my opinion the most important element in discourse, polls, petitions, activism efforts, etc. is to vet your sources. Who are we engaging with and what is the real agenda. Wise of you to notice the recent wacco join date juxtaposed against the faceless postings, and to make an issue of it. Thank you again - I wish more people would pay better attention.

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Posted in reply to the post by jbox:

Why don't you begin your recall effort by giving wacco a name, preferably your real name. I noticed you joined yesterday, an early indication of a possible troll. You want to put yourself out there, then do it for real instead of hiding.

That said, Efren was acquitted. I know he has been supremely embarrassed by this silly and regrettable incident and he is trying to put it behind him and just do the job he was elected to do. Was he acting in his official capacity during the incident? No. Is he entitled to a private life? I believe he is. Did he make a mistake, take responsibility, and express sincere regret? Absolutely. Does the public need folks like you chewing his arse ad nauseum? Nope. Let Efren do his job and his fate will be decided at the next election.

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In two days, Recall Carrillo, a drive I initiated and a group of concerned and outraged constituents championed was able to wrest from Efren Carrillo verification that he had, in fact, been in rehab. For close to a year no one outside his immediate circle had this knowledge. I was asked by the PD If I would reveal the location. Apparently our local news outlet couldn't get verification. Yet, we did and in just two days.

I'd call that a success. The aim of Recall Carrillo was accountability. It's aim was achieved. I don't disagree with your points, though I would suggest that the Board of Sups, in total, also share responsibility for the current mess. The attitude of entitlement that pervades the BOS is not an extension of Efren. Efren is an extension of the BOS culture.

I don't trust Efren. But I believe and respect that he's attempting the hard work of taking responsibility for his decisions. As a former drunk, I've personal experience. It's hard to put on the "recovered" face when you're talking to a pro. He's not recovered, won't be for a long time, if ever. But I believe he wants to be. That's the first step. And I agree that he shouldn't be on the board, never should have been elected. Too young, unseasoned, and in the clutches of some ugly people.

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Posted in reply to the post by danargraves:

I am sorry to see that the recall drive is over for Carillo. I am also more concerned about how the most important issue involving his actions within this thread has been side tracked which is very symptomatic of our society. That is his behavior towards women. This was side tracked not just by men but by many women on this thread as well. Alcohol was only the catalyst for his actions. His abusive predatory nature towards women is a far deeper issue and alcohol rehab is not going to fix that...

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I'm actually a bit sorry that there was no effort to recall Efren. Note that the more organized groups (Sonoma County Democratic Party) have called for Efren to resign but have chosen not to organize a recall that would be bound to be ugly, expensive and most likely unsuccessful.

Henry Bernard's "Recall Carrillo" campaign was hinged on the non-disclosure of the name of the rehab facility. Now that Henry knows where he went and why is wasn't disclosed he is is dropping his campaign. A bizarre end to a bizarre and ugly campaign.

However, it got me thinking. I, like many others, call for Efren's resignation, but not for a recall for the above reasons. While his despicable actions were ruled not-illegal, they are despicable none the less.

I came across Efren at the recent Open Our Hospital Campaign Launch. I shook his hand by instinct. I was rather shocked by the change in his personal energy. He clearly has be shaken to his core. For those of you who think he should be punished, I submit he has been punished 100 times more than an "ordinary" citizen would be for the same act.

His behavior laid bare serious character flaws. I truly believe these are being addressed. I doubt there is a spec left of the bravado that got him in trouble. I can only assume he is also addressing his other flaws.

But now the problem is that he has lost the legitimacy to represent us, which is why I call on him to resign. The path to restoring legitimacy is to be re-affirmed by his constituency after such a serious breach. His term continues through November 2016. That's a long time to be represented by a hobbled supervisor. This is why I am sorry to see that there will be no recall campaign. If he would stand for a recall, and survive it, his legitimacy would be restored, if not full respectability. However, as I mentioned above, the recall campaign would be ugly (as demonstrated in this thread) and expensive. There is no good answer.

So it seems that Efren will continue to be our supervisor, as uncomfortable as that is. As many have pointed out, we are paying him alot of money to do so. So the best we can do is to allow him to do the job and try to forgive (but not forget), accept and eventually trust him again (well, as much as we ever did), because there is no other choice.

Not so fast, Barry. Bizarro Henry here. Eddie Alvarez has communicated that he is picking up the torch and continuing the drive. He, today, left a post on the Recall Carrillo Facebook page asking my assent. It was given, so I imagine this thread will continue and the rancor will increase. Fun times, huh?

Eddie hasn't requested it, but I imagine that he will and I'll be transferring all Recall Carrillo assets over to him. The Facebook page is Recall Carrillo, the email address is [email protected].

And finally, why are people so resistant to understanding that my complaint did not concern a rehab center? The failure to disclose the rehab center is not the disease, it's but a symptom. The disease is lack of accountability, a refusal to be answerable. It permeates the board of Sups and county administration. It runs rampant over at the SCWA. It has led to a decaying infrastructure, crumbling roads, runaway pension obligations, county credit card abuse, exporting water to Marin (wtf?) and the list continues. I took aim at the weakest of the herd and brought it down. Don't begin to believe that I'm finished. My hunger is hardly sated. Efren was only an appetizer.

So that's it for me. Possibly someone from the ongoing campaign will begin posting in my place, trust it won't be me so please don't attack the poor soul.

Best, Henry

p.s. are you allowed to "Barry's Pick" yourself? (sorry, I couldn't resist)

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Posted in reply to the post by Barry:

I'm actually a bit sorry that there was no effort to recall Efren. Note that the more organized groups (Sonoma County Democratic Party) have called for Efren to resign but have chosen not to organize a recall that would be bound to be ugly, expensive and most likely unsuccessful.

Henry Bernard's "Recall Carrillo" campaign was hinged on the non-disclosure of the name of the rehab facility. Now that Henry knows where he went and why is wasn't disclosed he is is dropping his campaign. A bizarre end to a bizarre and ugly campaign.

However, it got me thinking. I, like many others, call for Efren's resignation, but not for a recall for the above reasons. While his despicable actions were ruled not-illegal, they are despicable none the less.

I came across Efren at the recent Open Our Hospital Campaign Launch. I shook his hand by instinct. I was rather shocked by the change in his personal energy. He clearly has be shaken to his core. For those of you who think he should be punished, I submit he has been punished 100 times more than an "ordinary" citizen would be for the same act.

His behavior laid bare serious character flaws. I truly believe these are being addressed. I doubt there is a spec left of the bravado that got him in trouble. I can only assume he is also addressing his other flaws.

But now the problem is that he has lost the legitimacy to represent us, which is why I call on him to resign. The path to restoring legitimacy is to be re-affirmed by his constituency after such a serious breach. His term continues through November 2016. That's a long time to be represented by a hobbled supervisor. This is why I am sorry to see that there will be no recall campaign. If he would stand for a recall, and survive it, his legitimacy would be restored, if not full respectability. However, as I mentioned above, the recall campaign would be ugly (as demonstrated in this thread) and expensive. There is no good answer.

So it seems that Efren will continue to be our supervisor, as uncomfortable as that is. As many have pointed out, we are paying him alot of money to do so. So the best we can do is to allow him to do the job and try to forgive (but not forget), accept and eventually trust him again (well, as much as we ever did), because there is no other choice.

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Although I do not want to weigh in on the issue of recall--I do agree it would be expensive and divisive--I would like to address one concern that lingers for me. I do not understand why Carillo's behavior is explained by alcohol. I'm not disputing his admission that he has a problem with alcohol. Rather, what doesn't make sense to me is that the arresting officers did not find him sufficiently impaired to call him drunk in public nor did they think a test for intoxication was called for.

This keeps gnawing at me. In addition, his behavior, as it has been described, is not typical of alcoholic intoxication. It suggests other substances, some sort of euphoric, something that makes you think everyone loves you and that you love everyone. I've seen people on substances that cause this type of behavior and it seems closer to what is described about that night.

Every time this is blamed on alcohol and we're told to be forgiving because he is in recovery, this comes up. I feel like I'm being duped. I would like this to be addressed so that I, personally, can stop thinking about it and put this sad, ugly episode to rest.

The photo is from Catwalk For A Cure where all models danced down the runway in this fundraiser for Sutter. Not sure which year - he has participated several times. Found it: https://www.watchsonomacounty.com/20...n-the-catwalk/

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Posted in reply to the post by Victoria Street:

As many waccopolitans will attest, I have been a vocal critic of Efren Carillo and his latest exploits. Having said that, I am sorry that Recall Carillo chose to stoop so low as to use this particular picture of him as an avatar - out on the town having a good time. I can't get behind cheap shots. Would I like to see him recalled? You bet! But not for tearing up the dance floor...

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Regarding drinking and alcoholism, my understanding of the disease is that drinking is merely the symptom, not the disease itself. There are many functioning alcoholics out there who no longer drink yet their behavior remains much the same. Hence the label "dry drunk".

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Posted in reply to the post by oliviathunderkitty:

...I do not understand why Carillo's behavior is explained by alcohol....

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I think that's rather despicable. Why do you need to know the name of the rehab he's attending? You obviously don't know anything about recovering from the DISEASE of alcoholism. I'd like to know the names of the the last 5 people you slept with so I can be assured that you have a healthy sex life and so are sane enough to be posting these things publicly. Same thing to me.

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Posted in reply to the post by Recall Carrillo:

In two days, Recall Carrillo, a drive I initiated and a group of concerned and outraged constituents championed was able to wrest from Efren Carrillo verification that he had, in fact, been in rehab. ....

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carrillo seems most addicted to power, arrogance, and sex, his self description when he seems to be most honest. stepping down from community service would demonstrate most to me amends. having been through 12 step for behavior addiction, i know it is a long difficult road, and life changes are a needed part of the process. clinging to your old job in the face of unanimous peer request, i would and have stepped down, and still struggle to understand. opportunity is abundant in this blessed and crazy world we live in...

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Posted in reply to the post by photolite:

Regarding drinking and alcoholism, my understanding of the disease is that drinking is merely the symptom, not the disease itself. There are many functioning alcoholics out there who no longer drink yet their behavior remains much the same. Hence the label "dry drunk".

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It's creepy to me how often people so quickly see what they 'want' in another's words and then react with haughty disdain to their own contrived picture in a twisted attempt to justify some stagnant personal agenda they need to keep reinforcing.

It was clear to me that finding out what rehab Carrillo went to had ZERO to do with caring about 'the name' of it, it was 100% about making sure he was accountable for having gone to one at all instead of taking a taxpayer paid $12,000/mo vacation.

I very much appreciate that this confirmation was done. With the stakes so high and our confidence in him so greatly breached, we absolutely had the right to confirm that he was telling the truth which he had not willingly offered verification of himself. Thank you.

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Posted in reply to the post by Fillie:

As a public, we don't punish or vilify the schizophrenic who screams at their demons on the street...or who have taken a lot of LSD or who have had a psychotic episode...

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I commonly encounter statements from people who think that taking LSD might create serious lasting psychotic symptoms. Is there really any reason to believe this is true, or is it just another manifestation of anti-drug mythology?

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Posted in reply to the post by Dixon:

I commonly encounter statements from people who think that taking LSD might create serious lasting psychotic symptoms. Is there really any reason to believe this is true, or is it just another manifestation of anti-drug mythology?

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This is an area that is difficult to research, as you can't take two groups of people matched for age, family history, socioeconomic status, etc and compare their responses to LSD vs placebo.

Despite the lack of randomized controlled trials, I believe the generally accepted answer in the mental health/chemical dependency treatment community is that hallucinogenics can cause both temporary and permanent episodes of psychosis with a life separate from the ingestion of the drug. It doesn't seem to happen very often.

Dr Pam

I'm not understanding why this is a failing of Efren . What about all the women strutting down the runway in tight dresses?. This is not a particularly unusual way to raise money, like auctioning off dates with men or women. it's not my thing but I'm assuming you are criticizing Efren for participating in a charity event. Can't your opinion be interpreted as anti-feminist? The women are just as responsible for their behavior. I'm sure Efren did not just volunteer to dance down the runway; I would guess he was asked to participate and he was supporting a good cause. So, are you saying this is a good thing or a bad thing? Would it be okay if it was Frank Pugh on the runway? oobr>

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Posted in reply to the post by grandmagr:

The photo is from Catwalk For A Cure where all models danced down the runway in this fundraiser for Sutter. Not sure which year - he has participated several times. Found it: https://www.watchsonomacounty.com/20...n-the-catwalk/

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