Letter on Efren Carrillo sent to Sonoma County Democratic Party

In the article which appeared in the Press Democrat last night on line and this morning in print regarding the statement issued by the Sonoma County Democratic Party involving whether or not Efren Carrillo should resign his position as fifth-district supervisor, the following sentence was included:

"The Latino Club is set to take up the issue next week."

In fact, yesterday afternoon, on August 14, at 3:15 p.m., Laura Gonzalez, who is a member of that club and I believe a past president, was on Station KSRO and announced that the Sonoma County Latino Democratic Club is, in fact, calling for Supervisor Efren Carrillo's resignation.

I thought that all Waccobbians who have been following this extremely important matter should be aware of this latest development.

Effen (sic) Carrillo wasn't important or threatening enough for anyone to bother; I have always believed, however, that John Lennon's death was orchestrated, since he was the only person in the world who could have (and was) urging millions of people to mobilize for peace.

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Posted in reply to the post by arthunter:

Jbox,

Let me say again that there is nothing silly about the suspicion of Cointelpro tactics within the political arena ..

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That is perceptive of you Meherc, and Shepherd, stick to sheep because not only do I perceive this as a witch hunting lynch mob, but also a group of people who are caught up in a blood lusting feeding frenzy not unlike a school of sharks; and I'm sure there will be other victims on these pages in future, once you have finished off your present target.

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Posted in reply to the post by meherc:

Getting a little defensive, Shepherd, when people disagree. I have to say that in our few meetings, you literally ran away from me when I disagreed with an emotional interpretation.
Perhaps a hard time with disagreement? Maybe not. We don't have all the facts.

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I believe the quote was "lynch Mob Mentality", and we could quibble about the difference and intended meaning of that, but I do also see that there are those here on this thread that are carrying on a mob like mentality. They are quick to defend their position and attempt to weaken the position of those who disagree with it. They are encouraging others to follow their lead to demand resignation with continued ranting as well as heart felt belief. That seems to me more like a torch and pitchfork mob mentality than a lynch mob mentality. (or maybe just a hot debate)

There may well be those who are ready to take up the torch and follow that lead.

I haven't made up my mind about the situation yet.
I am waiting for all of the available facts to come out.

It won't be long.
There will be plenty of time for a re-call if it is warranted. (I don't believe he will resign)

For me, Life is too short to get all angry, hot and bothered, but you are indeed welcome to if you'd like.

Tom

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Posted in reply to the post by Shepherd:

Your accusatory language like "lynch mob" is hardly "reasonable." There is no attempt to lynch anyone but to pressure an elected official to stop hiding and speak up. We voters deserve that. Efren Carrillo is obviously hiding something. I am angry and do not intend to "cool" until he resigns or is recalled. What is reasonable is that Mr. Carrillo speak to his constituency, rather than hide from us. He was caught with "his pants down," literally, as other politicians have been, figuratively. He is no longer believable. I do not intend to be silenced by your name-calling.

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Once again, we do not have the facts of this case ... we do not know what Efren was working on when these two incidents occurred ... like others on this forum I am in favor of suspending judgement until certain facts are known ... the ideas I've presented are only possibilities given the current climate of covert action against those that are politically active ...

Yes, it is a fact that John Lennon was harassed because of his peace stance ... this world is ruled by money not concern for it's residents ...

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Posted in reply to the post by Sara S:

Effen (sic) Carrillo wasn't important or threatening enough for anyone to bother; I have always believed, however, that John Lennon's death was orchestrated, since he was the only person in the world who could have (and was) urging millions of people to mobilize for peace.

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Posted in reply to the post by tomcat:

... I do also see that there are those here on this thread that are carrying on a mob like mentality. They are quick to defend their position and attempt to weaken the position of those who disagree with it. They are encouraging others to follow their lead to demand resignation with continued ranting as well as heart felt belief. That seems to me more like a torch and pitchfork mob mentality than a lynch mob mentality. (or maybe just a hot debate)...

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when a thread has deteriorated to the point where a central feature of many posts are speculations about the motives or beliefs or psychological state of other posters, rather than about the issue at hand, it's a sign that it's been beaten to death. It may exhibit the dead-cat bounce now and again, but I think any life has been sucked out of it.

The part that is troubling for me is the way in which Efren Carrillo was hustled into rehab so quickly. That felt like complete damage control. Most of the public, I would presume, must have been shocked. As time goes on, people's emotions tend to settle down. In other words, Carrillo supporters are hoping that the public can get used to the "idea" of him being a recovering alcoholic - if that, in fact, is his problem. After rehab, Efren can present himself to the public as getting well which might convince enough people that there's been no real damage. And I'm not sure that the real truth will come out. I think this is what Efren and his supporters are truly hoping for. The "minimal damage" issue which has been thoroughly addressed in rehab.

I think many of your observations are probably pretty accurate. Most of us, called to service by a true friend or family member, would likely also try to mitigate the catastrophe to the best of our ability. Particularly if they were aware of a growing personal problem that seemed to be escalating. Hustling someone into treatment on short notice by those closest to a person is by definition an intervention. From what few facts we do have it seems likely that Efren's people had more than enough reason for these actions. Some are no doubt political but that doesn't necessarily mean that there aren't more compelling reasons as well.

An aspect of this conversation that has surprised me is how few people here seem to fully understand the nature of alcoholism and the alcoholic. Certainly not to recommend it but there are very, very many "high functioning" alcoholics in the world and I would guess the political arena likely has a greater percentage of these folks than most other walks of life. Virtually all our Founding Fathers functioned in a society that fostered this behavior. There are likely way more alcoholics in public life who don't wipe out while in office and serve us well as there are those that fall from grace. This situation may well save Efren's life now that there's no hiding from it. Even should he be convicted of the worst of these allegations and wind up in jail, if he's in fact an alcoholic and getting treatment, it could be his well hidden silver lining, if not his just desserts.

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Posted in reply to the post by dominus:

The part that is troubling for me is the way in which Efren Carrillo was hustled into rehab so quickly. That felt like complete damage control. Most of the public, I would presume, must have been shocked. As time goes on, people's emotions tend to settle down. In other words, Carrillo supporters are hoping that the public can get used to the "idea" of him being a recovering alcoholic - if that, in fact, is his problem. After rehab, Efren can present himself to the public as getting well which might convince enough people that there's been no real damage. And I'm not sure that the real truth will come out. I think this is what Efren and his supporters are truly hoping for. The "minimal damage" issue which has been thoroughly addressed in rehab.

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Hey, can I come, too? What time?

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Posted in reply to the post by riverosprey:

OK, Barry, Edward, Shephard, Jon, Sebastacat, et al...Hopmonk Tavern, Friday Aug,23rd...First rounds on me :).

Tom Lynch
..looking forward to a collegial discussion:banana:

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Of course you are invited, Sara! This is not just another old, white male get together for drinking alcohol at a local bar. And getting to meet you in person for the first time will be a pleasure after so many years of a merely electronic acquaintance.

But I'm not aware of any specific hour, though. And the only rule is to talk about anything except Carrillo. That's going to be hard to do but I'll try.

Edward

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Posted in reply to the post by Sara S:

Hey, can I come, too? What time?

Sara

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I think that we need to set a time. Any proposals? I hope that Sandy Eastoak might also join us, as she has been an important contributor to this conversation. Do we need any other ground rules, like no name-calling or personal attacks? I also look forward to the face-to-face contact, which changes the possibilities. I would also like to avoid much talking about Efren Carrillo.

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Posted in reply to the post by Edward Mendoza:

Of course you are invited, Sara! This is not just another old, white male get together for drinking alcohol at a local bar. And getting to meet you in person for the first time will be a pleasure after so many years of a merely electronic acquaintance.

But I'm not aware of any specific hour, though. And the only rule is to talk about anything except Carrillo. That's going to be hard to do but I'll try.

Edward

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Posted in reply to the post by Shepherd:

I think that we need to set a time.

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Tom had thrown out "after 5", this Friday, Aug 23rd, at the Hopmonk, which sounds good to me. Tom assures me that indeed "the first round" is on him

:toast:

, so you might want to get there on the early side if you don't want to miss that!

This is a wacco-community wide gathering. Everyone is invited! I'll try to get a reserved area at the Hopmonk outside. There's lots to talk to about and it would be good to meet everybody.

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Do we need any other ground rules, like no name-calling or personal attacks?

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I expect this to be a social gathering even though local politics will be on many of the participant's minds. So yes, please mind your manners!

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I would also like to avoid much talking about Efren Carrillo.

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That's your prerogative, Shepherd. As this is likely a largish gathering (over 10 for sure, could be over 25) I think most of the discussions will be informal among small groups. If there's interest, and it seems feasible, we'll try to pull together brief circle where everybody has a short time to share comments and questions. The topic that Tom called out was "the future".

I look forward to discussing matters concerning Efren, "intergenerational equity", Sonoma Clean Power (one of Efren's pet projects), fluoride, and anything else that comes to mind! Cheers!

I hope you'll stick around for the Tom Finch Group and Achilles Wheel concert at 9pm.

Efren was charged with the misdemeanor of "peeking" today. I have started a new thread called "Efren charged with "misdemeanor peeking" in General Community to discuss this. I am closing this thread.