government intrusion in your life

[wildfire]

where are you with that?Do you see more laws and ordinances as a good or bad thing?Are you concerned your property and civil rights are being eroded slowly by this intrusion or do you believe government is your daddy and needs to regulate our behaviors.Do you feel this regulatiom tends to be for the betterment of all or is for our "safety:.I live in Southern oregon where there is a growing trend especially in these trying economic times. to not trusting government.iving in Sonoma co. life is definitely easier , more liberal, way better weather and better economically.However many foreclosures here and people losing their homes i would suspect would have people questioning their government more.I am rather struck by those that want to build communities but come up against the PRMD of Sonoma co. ah the government so where do you stand!:):

[wildfire]

Breaking news*******city of sebastopol votes3-2 to ban not restrict leaf blowers, a tiny vocal minority gets a power point presentation against leaf blowers and on the same night city votes to ban wait til this takes effect homeowners and workers will have none of it.this will be unenforceable! A restriction on hours of use would have been enough. No electric blowers either! "hi i am from the government and i am here to help you" god help us all lets make criminals out of a few more folks especially workers, too bad there wasnt a power point presentation from an opposing view that would have been fair and then a vote.vote no on all government funding we need less laws libertarianism by default governments cannot enforce ridiculous laws if they dont have the money right?

[Conrad Bishop]

Speaking not to the issue of leaf-blowers but to "government intrusion." We're probably in agreement that laws can be intrusive. Question is, which ones? Are you against all zoning laws & would be delighted to have a McDonald's built in your residential neighborhood? Or have your neighbor raise walruses and do target practice with automatic weapons? Absurd examples, maybe, but for some people not much different from leaf blowers. Personally, I'm not bothered by them, though I think they're silly and totally unnecessary. But I like speed limits, non-smoking regulations for public accommodations, the city or county to fix my streets, Medicare and Social Security, and most regulatory agencies. Even if they fuck stuff up sometimes, I have more trust in them than I do in BP, Massey Energy, and the entire food & drug industries.

I would be very upset if a "tiny minority" held power to diddle with our lives. (Though I guess you could argue that the massive concentration of wealth in 1% of the population gives them a power that puts leaf-blower bans to shame.) But is the city council agenda secret? (That's a real question.) Was there no opportunity for presentation of the opposing view? Normally, regulatory proposals get massive opposition from the industries affected economically. Strange that they were missing.

[Peacetown Jonathan]

Wildfire, I am concerned about my civil rights. I am and have been for a very long time, a civil libertarian. I am disgusted by the War on Drugs and the War on Marijuana, about the many millions of lives ruined because of the choice free people make to put one drug in their body instead of another. That's intrusion, and that's where I wish you would focus your anger at government intrusion (along with sneak and peak survelliance, constant searches, wiretapping, the arrest of proesters for free speech, etc).

But the right to blow toxic dust at 200 mph and impose deafening sounds upon your neighbors and fellow citizens because it saves you a little time to use a leaf blower is no more about liberty than your right to blow cigar smoke in a crowded elevator for everyone to breathe around you.

And this ordinance will be as enforceable as stopping people from blaring music at 2 am and waking their whole neighborhood. Most people will voluntarily comply. some will be asked by their neighbors to comply with the law. A tiny, tiny minority will insist on their "right" to deafen and pollute the air of their neighbors.

If you want to be among that obnoxious minority, knock yourself out. I just don't agree with your wrapping yourself in the cloak of liberty while you do it. :waccosun:

[podfish]

I would be very upset if a "tiny minority" held power to diddle with our lives. (Though I guess you could argue that the massive concentration of wealth in 1% of the population gives them a power that puts leaf-blower bans to shame.) yeah, that does seem like a possible argument. Weird how "the government" is more scary. Even weirder how in an earlier post the foreclosure problems were implicitly being linked solely to the government - presumably as a sign we need less of it.