Five Myths About Immigration [Archive]

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Tars

05-03-2010, 05:38 AM

According toDoris Meissner (https://www.migrationpolicy.org/staff/#Meissner), former Commissioner of the US Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS), who is a Senior Fellow at the Migration Policy Institute (MPI, they are:

1. Immigrants take jobs from American workers.

2. Immigration is at an all-time high, and most new immigrants came illegally.

3. Today's immigrants are not integrating into American life like past waves did.

4. Cracking down on illegal border crossings will make us safer.

5. Immigration reform cannot happen in an election year.

She presents an in-depth analysis of the current "illegal immigration" political imbroglio in a WaPo OpEd (https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/30/AR2010043001106.html). This is a person who's intimately familiar with the larger issue of immigration reform. In this piece she provides a clear framing of the current situation, from a historical perspective. Refreshingly, she avoids the party talking points, falsities, and political finger pointing. This article is well worth the read for anyone, of any perspective, who's interested in this topic.

Excerpt:

"Moreover, immigrants tend to be concentrated in high- and low-skilled occupations that complement -- rather than compete with -- jobs held by native workers. And the foreign-born workers who fill lower-paying jobs are typically first-hired/first-fired employees, allowing employers to expand and contract their workforces rapidly. As a result, immigrants experience higher employment than natives during booms -- but they suffer higher job losses during downturns, including the current one.
It's true that an influx of new workers pushes wages down, but immigration also stimulates growth by creating new consumers, entrepreneurs and investors. As a result of this growth, economists estimate that wages for the vast majority of American workers are slightly higher than they would be without immigration. U.S. workers without a high school degree experience wage declines as a result of competition from immigrants, but these losses are modest, at just over 1 percent. Economists also estimate that for each job an immigrant fills, an additional job is created."

LenInSebastopol

05-03-2010, 08:21 AM

Well, gov't spokemouth has laid down the truth from above!
Her special knowledge and experience, especially now that she is working for a lobby, has given her the insight that contradicts every common sense, reasonable, logical thought and approach regarding the issue.
I mean all those guys pounding nails, doing yard work, waiting in restaurants, pouring cement while Hard Core coffee drinkers sip all day long complaining about work makes #1 wrong.
Or #2 must have been translated from Spanish, eh? How can an immigrant be illegal? She/he can't due to the definition of "immigrant"!
#3 is one that is SO wonderful. We can keep Spanish speaking folks as tools for another generation by keeping them out of the American mainstream simply by giving them classes in Spanish. They can be half-stupid in two languages. Happy day!
#4 is obviously true, since the opposite, making all borders open, will keep us safe.
#5, might be true. It is too complex an issue for me to even go into....and since it is from the East Coast, again it must be true.
It is so simple! Now why shouldn't I believe a gov't official? Pendejotissimas!

Barry

05-04-2010, 02:14 PM

someguy

05-04-2010, 03:41 PM

Why is it that immigration brings out the worst behavior in so many people?

Let me remind all participants on this topic to be respectful, especially to your fellow members, as well as all people, regardless of country of origin.

Barry
:heart:

Im curious Barry, what bad behavior are you referring to? I dont see anything out of line in this thread.:hmmm:

Barry

05-04-2010, 03:56 PM

Im curious Barry, what bad behavior are you referring to? I dont see anything out of line in this thread.:hmmm:
Sorry, it may have been on another immigration thread. Some has be edited to correct, some has been deleted by the poster.

LenInSebastopol

05-04-2010, 04:37 PM

Naw, it's me. I said something about East Coast folks and that is tantamount to hate crime....everything coming out of the East Coast is wonderful and we out here are rubes.

Im curious Barry, what bad behavior are you referring to? I dont see anything out of line in this thread.:hmmm:

Tars

05-05-2010, 07:30 AM

Why is it that immigration brings out the worst behavior in so many people?

Xenophobia? Inferiority complex?

LenInSebastopol

05-05-2010, 05:43 PM

When was the last time you were at a Raiders game?

busyb555

05-05-2010, 09:05 PM

Barry,

Its not immigration that we are apposed to, its ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION, you know the kind where they over stay a visa or just ignore the laws. Try it in any other country and see what happens to you. Can you say jail?

Xenophobia? Inferiority complex?

The A Team

07-09-2010, 06:46 PM

For anyone who believes myth # 1 please go to:
TAKEOURJOBS.ORG (https://www.takeourjobs.org/)
Here is their opportunity to work at an immigrant's job and get a different viewpoint if desired.

According toDoris Meissner (https://www.migrationpolicy.org/staff/#Meissner), former Commissioner of the US Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS), who is a Senior Fellow at the Migration Policy Institute (MPI, they are:

1. Immigrants take jobs from American workers.

2. Immigration is at an all-time high, and most new immigrants came illegally.

3. Today's immigrants are not integrating into American life like past waves did.

4. Cracking down on illegal border crossings will make us safer.

5. Immigration reform cannot happen in an election year.

someguy

07-09-2010, 09:52 PM

TAKEOURJOBS.ORG (https://www.takeourjobs.org/)

Thanks for the link. I've been looking for a farm job for a while now, maybe this will be fruitful. Much appreciated!

someguy

07-13-2010, 02:00 PM

For anyone who believes myth # 1 please go to:
TAKEOURJOBS.ORG (https://www.takeourjobs.org/)
Here is their opportunity to work at an immigrant's job and get a different viewpoint if desired.
This whole campaign is a scam. I signed up to get a farm job as promised and after waiting a few days I got this email:

"Dear Citizen and/or Legal Resident:

Hello my name is Patty Aviles, I am a UFW representative. I am contacting you regarding the inquiry you filled out at our www.TakeOurJobs.org website.

I would like to assist you in making sure you can make a connection with a farm employer.

We are not an employment agency but would like to work with you to assure you can find employment as a farmworker.

We are going to connect you with a free government service in your state through the One Stop Shop Employment Development Department in you area.

I. Please go to California Job Service:: CalJOBS:: Employment Resource (https://www.caljobs.ca.gov)

In order to use this free government service you will have to register.

II. In the middle of the website there is a JOB SEEKER box, please select REGISTER.

Please complete the registration form and once completed you will be directed to the JOB SEEKER SERVICE MENU.

III. SELECT BROWSE JOBS BY CATEGORY

please select ALL COUNTIES.

IV. Select FARMING, FISHING & FORESTY listing

Please review and if interested in any job position, select the position. You will be directed to the job listing and how to apply.

We really want to make sure that this program works. We would like to hear from you if you were able to get a job.

Once you apply to the job listing, we will follow up with you to further assist with the process.

If you submitted your application electronically please save the date and time of your application. The Employment Development Department or Employment Agency website in your state often provides a confirmation number. Please save it and have it with you when you communicate with the UFW office.

Please make sure you apply on or before July 23, 2010.
Patty Aviles
UFW representative

PS: Please feel to email me at [email protected] if you have any problems contacting your E.D.D or state Employment Agency representative in your area."

Tars

07-13-2010, 05:12 PM

It looks to me like the UFW is using the state EDD database as a clearinghouse for farm labor. Makes sense to me. The state database is going to bring a registrant's name up if there's a demand for farm workers in the Sonoma County area. Thing is, I don't believe most farm employers hire via the EDD. Perhaps the UFW will use the database to fill temporary farm worker jobs, or to fill in where, for whatever reason, they can't supply enough labor in time to meet a harvest deadline. That could quite conceivably happen around here during the wine crush.

someguy

07-13-2010, 05:32 PM

It looks to me like the UFW is using the state EDD database as a clearinghouse for farm labor. Makes sense to me. ... Thing is, I don't believe most farm employers hire via the EDD. Perhaps the UFW will use the database to fill temporary farm worker jobs, or to fill in where, for whatever reason, they can't supply enough labor in time to meet a harvest deadline...

Here is how the takeourjobs.com website describes what it does:

"Farm workers are ready to welcome citizens and legal residents who wish to replace them in the field. We will use our knowledge and staff to help connect the unemployed with farm employers. Just fill out the form to the right and continue on to the request for job application."

Yeah it took them a lot of knowledge to refer me to Caljobs! Which by the way I'm already signed up for and hardly ever has any farm jobs available. What a load of crap!

"Mad" Miles

07-13-2010, 06:18 PM

I just wanted to link my most recent contribution to this topic, to this thread. Most people reading this thread have also probably read it, but just in case....

Lies About Undocumented Workers and the Immigration Debate (https://www.waccobb.net/forums/waccotalk/69668-lies-about-undocumented-workers-immigration-issue.html)

Someguy,

Are you really exercised about the UFW campaign, "Please Take Our Jobs"?

As previously discussed on this board, it is an obvious sendup on their part to make the point that most Americans (U.S.) would not want to work in the fields of industrial farms because of the: pay, conditions, health hazards, personal facilities, housing, etc.

Complaining that they're not sincere in actually making a direct effort to plug people into farmworking jobs, kind of misses the point. Perhaps the fact that those jobs are rarely, if ever, advertised on the CalJobs site is part of the point they're trying to make?

If you really want a field hand job, I suggest you contact one of the labor contractors who act as middle men between workers and farmers. Although I think it's unlikely such contractors are looking for hands that don't meet the criteria they're used to dealing with, i.e. mojados.

podfish

07-14-2010, 08:42 AM

someguy

07-14-2010, 08:48 AM

if you claim to be more serious about this than you think they are, show it by following up. So far it seems you've only reprinted their response and haven't acted on it. She gives you a followup contact, use it! If you were legitimately applying for a job I hope you'd be more persistent.

Umm I already said in a previous post that I am signed up for caljobs. Furthermore, I do apply for farm jobs posted on caljobs regularly.

You people....... My god......

You get on me, when you should be getting on Patty Aviles and takeourjobs. This is a clear scam, and the only reason why they have it is to try and make white people look bad. It is so freakin obvious.

Why get on me about this?:hmmm:

podfish

07-14-2010, 09:05 AM

Umm I already said in a previous post that I am signed up for caljobs. Furthermore, I do apply for farm jobs posted on caljobs regularly. You people....... My god...... You get on me, when you should be getting on Patty Aviles and takeourjobs. This is a clear scam, and the only reason why they have it is to try and make white people look bad. It is so freakin obvious.

Why get on me about this?:hmmm:

reread this:

If you submitted your application electronically please save the date and time of your application. .....

Patty Aviles
UFW representative

PS: Please feel to email me at [email protected] if you have any problems contacting your E.D.D or state Employment Agency representative in your area."
what do you mean "you people", anyway?? I'm just holding you accountable for your own post. You make an explicit claim it's a scam. Whether or not there's a deeper agenda behind this isn't relevant to that claim - I see her making a direct offer to help that you haven't pursued. So before you offer slurs like that why don't you follow the steps she outlines? If she blows you off when you contact her with the info about your job application, then you have a basis for your attitude. Till then you're just showing your prejudice. It may not be as
so freakin obvious to others as it is to you.

someguy

07-14-2010, 09:35 AM

reread this:

what do you mean "you people", anyway?? I'm just holding you accountable for your own post. You make an explicit claim it's a scam. Whether or not there's a deeper agenda behind this isn't relevant to that claim - I see her making a direct offer to help that you haven't pursued. So before you offer slurs like that why don't you follow the steps she outlines? If she blows you off when you contact her with the info about your job application, then you have a basis for your attitude. Till then you're just showing your prejudice. It may not be as to others as it is to you.

I don't need Patty Avil's help to go to EDD or to go to a state employment agency.... Why would I need help with that? Im not mentally disabled or something. Just like I can sign up for caljobs without Patty's help either. It is so extremely simple. Maybe Patty should be contacting these places for me, since her website said that they were going to get me a job working on a farm to replace an illegal worker, not tell me where to go to get one. If its not obvious to you that this is how they represented themselves, then I don't know what to say. The website made it seem as though they had a bunch of illegals lined up ready to hand over their tools to me as soon as I signed up. No? And like I already said there are like no farm jobs on the caljobs website. I have applied many many times for farm work via caljobs and nothing ever. I never even get a response. Same goes for any job Ive ever applied for via caljobs.

Tars

07-14-2010, 11:29 AM

I've known quite a few farmers. I've never known one who said they'd listed a job at EDD. You're probably wasting your time looking for farm work there. Maybe you'll get some crush work. I suggest you go on the "Farms and Gardens" For Sale forum on craigslist, and post there that you're looking for farm work.

If you really want to take a farm work job from a foreign worker, do as they do - go door to door on farms and ask if they need a worker. Make cards with your phone number; post 'em all over. Stand on a corner in Fulton or Graton. Hold up a sign that sez, "Will do any farm work for $10/hour".

Pointless to get angry at UFW.

Hotspring 44

07-14-2010, 01:13 PM

I located some Farm related jobs (and others) here: Job Search Engine | Juju (https://www.job-search-engine.com/)

https://wineserver.ucdavis.edu/venjobs/index.php

> HARVEST CREW Applications now being accepted for temporary winery positions at Raymond (St. Helena) and DeLoach (Santa Rosa). Est. 8/01 to 12/01. Duties include all aspects of wine production and crush. Candidates must be energetic, dependable, and willing to work long hours. Flexible schedule including overtime. Winery experience preferred. Forklift a plus. Basic English required for all positions. Must have ability to lift 50 lbs., climb, work on heights, work in changing conditions, and handle standard winemaking materials. Hourly wage,doe. Submit resume to: [email protected] or mail to: 849 Zinfandel Lane, St. Helena CA 94574. No phone calls.
Jobs - Harvest Crew in St Helena (https://www.bajobs.com/Details.aspx?ListingID=39c34d9c-41b3-4858-965d-c5f99a719020)

> WINERY HARVEST POSITIONS Seasonal harvest positions that run from late August to end of harvest. General & skilled cellar workers Candidates must satisfactorily pass a pre-employment physical & drug screen, perform sustained physical labor & be available for flexible hours, including weekends. Above it all, a positive, flexible attitude is a must. Competitive wages, a safe work environment & opportunity to learn from & work with the best in the business. Apply at Kendall-Jackson (Cardinale) 7600 HWY 29, Fax resume to 707-944-5628. Email [email protected]

Thanks for the link. I've been looking for a farm job for a while now, maybe this will be fruitful. Much appreciated!

someguy

07-15-2010, 04:31 PM

someguy

07-15-2010, 05:00 PM

"All applicants need to do is fill out an online form under the banner "I want to be a farmworker" at TAKEOURJOBS.ORG (https://www.takeourjobs.org), and experienced field hands will train them and connect them to farms."

Read more: Comedian Colbert takes up farmworkers' cause - Agriculture - Modbee.com (https://www.modbee.com/2010/06/24/1225244/comedian-colbert-takes-up-farmworkers.html#ixzz0tnZVnMfX)

Heres a description of what the takeourjobs campaign supposedly does...... I am really effing mad about these blatant lies. No one offered to train me or connect me with a farm. What they did was refer me to caljobs so that I can compete with the thousands of other unemployed Californians for the maybe one farm job available if I'm lucky. Words can't describe how angry I am right now.