As I was writing a short comment on Gina Ogden's The Return of Desire (see Polyamory Resources: Books on Sex and Sexual Healing (https://aphroweb.net/resources/polyresources-sex.htm)), I came across a quote I want to share.
"Love comes from a fully filled personal well and is about opening up your heart to others. Need comes from an empty personal well and is about seeking approval and nurturing from others - too often from other empty souls who are incapable of intimacy."
I recommend her book!
Cascade Spring Cook
Relationship and polyamory guide
www.aphroweb.net (https://www.aphroweb.net)
Jason 17
01-14-2009, 10:09 PM
As I was writing a short comment on Gina Ogden's The Return of Desire (see Polyamory Resources: Books on Sex and Sexual Healing (https://aphroweb.net/resources/polyresources-sex.htm)), I came across a quote I want to share.
"Love comes from a fully filled personal well and is about opening up your heart to others. Need comes from an empty personal well and is about seeking approval and nurturing from others - too often from other empty souls who are incapable of intimacy."
I recommend her book!
Cascade Spring Cook
Relationship and polyamory guide
www.aphroweb.net (https://www.aphroweb.net)
Ouch the ring of truth--hit me between the eyes.I seem to need more reassurance as of late---my personal well not empty--it just has a small leak.Time may be what's needed to repair the heart and stop the leak.
mykil
01-20-2009, 03:15 PM
Can't we all just love to be needed while alwayz needing to be loved as well? Or is that again just too plain needy? <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
Jason 17
01-20-2009, 09:14 PM
Can't we all just love to be needed while alwayz needing to be loved as well? Or is that again just too plain needy? <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
There's a find balance between need and want,dependence and independence.Can I love when my needs are ever present? I certainly hope so.Having someone love me sets me free.I am enabled,able to achieve more when loved and supported.Yes I know my own worth and it is fully expressed with another. Jason
Braggi
01-20-2009, 10:05 PM
... "Love comes from a fully filled personal well and is about opening up your heart to others. Need comes from an empty personal well and is about seeking approval and nurturing from others - too often from other empty souls who are incapable of intimacy." ...
Gee, how black and white is that? Life isn't black and white. It's everything in between. We all have needs and those needs vary from time to time, just as the fullness of our wells varies from time to time. Do we have enough reserve to see us through times of crisis? Can we support our partner(s) during times of crisis? What if we are both or all in crisis at the same time (which is very often the case)?
In order for a relationship to have longevity and health we all need to be honest about our needs and those of our partners. At least we should be as honest as we can be since we're not always aware of our needs and what we're taking for granted. We need to be strong and healthy enough to be able to roll with the blows when they come in. Hardships will happen and at those times our needs become greater. Hopefully we can rise to those occasions and so can our partners.
Love and need overlap and work together. It's not one or the other. It's both for all of us.
Sorry Cascade, I'm not impressed by your author, at least, not by that sound bite. It sounds like a statement from an immature or an inexperienced person. Hopefully the rest of the book is better.
-Jeff
Cascade
01-20-2009, 10:55 PM
...Gee, how black and white is that? Life isn't black and white. It's everything in between. We all have needs and those needs vary from time to time, just as the fullness of our wells varies from time to time. Do we have enough reserve to see us through times of crisis? Can we support our partner(s) during times of crisis? What if we are both or all in crisis at the same time (which is very often the case)?
...
Love and need overlap and work together. It's not one or the other. It's both for all of us.
-Jeff
Of course you're right, Jeff. Perhaps I should have quoted more to avoid a misunderstanding. I'll quote a little more now:
"These are oversimplifications to be sure, but they point to an essential truth: when the desire for closeness is born of emptiness, the result is bound to be constriction, not expansion. The minute you feel 'I am nothing without you,' closeness shape-shifts into smothering."
Her point is that to have a healthy and vibrant sexual partnership, you need whole and healthy people who are able to share of themselves rather than demanding that the other(s) meet their needs. Codependency gets in the way of a healthy relationship.
Of course we still have needs. We're human, after all.
Gina Ogden's The Return of Desire encourages us to look at the sexual scripts that we follow. What do we really want? How can we expand our own sexual desire beyond the limits we once had?
Cascade Spring Cook
Relationship Guide
www.aphroweb.net (https://www.aphroweb.net)
Karl Frederick
01-22-2009, 12:20 PM
A little out of context, and also worth considering . . .
"Only where love and need are one
And the work is play for mortal stakes
Is the deed every really done
For Heaven and the future's sakes."
From the end of "Two Tramps in Mud Time"
Robert Frost 1936
Jason 17
01-22-2009, 01:14 PM
A little out of context, and also worth considering . . .
"Only where love and need are one
And the work is play for mortal stakes
Is the deed every really done
For Heaven and the future's sakes."
From the end of "Two Tramps in Mud Time"
Robert Frost 1936
I don't understand what Frost is saying.If you don't need anyone,your life is set up for one can you fall in love and feel that desire for someone else described as just beyond bearable?I want to be with my love not to the exclusion of all else but because all else pales. Jason
greennoblework
01-23-2009, 02:18 PM
Thanks, Cascade for the true statement regarding love and need. I saw both nonsense and wisdom written regarding the relationship of these. Without having read the entire discussion thread, the only relationship that comes to the mind of this one is that the ideal lover sees, knows and meets the needs of his/her beloved. It helps to have one's beloved skilled in assertivenes, requesting and compassionate communication skills. George
Gee, how black and white is that? Life isn't black and white. It's everything in between. We all have needs and those needs vary from time to time, just as the fullness of our wells varies from time to time. Do we have enough reserve to see us through times of crisis? Can we support our partner(s) during times of crisis? What if we are both or all in crisis at the same time (which is very often the case)?
In order for a relationship to have longevity and health we all need to be honest about our needs and those of our partners. At least we should be as honest as we can be since we're not always aware of our needs and what we're taking for granted. We need to be strong and healthy enough to be able to roll with the blows when they come in. Hardships will happen and at those times our needs become greater. Hopefully we can rise to those occasions and so can our partners.
Love and need overlap and work together. It's not one or the other. It's both for all of us.
Sorry Cascade, I'm not impressed by your author, at least, not by that sound bite. It sounds like a statement from an immature or an inexperienced person. Hopefully the rest of the book is better.
-Jeff
jaino
02-02-2009, 08:34 AM
today is groundhog day, the 4 yr. anniversary of a 17 yr. life partner's passing....Her name was Karen Taft and I want you all to know she is buzzing around in Eternaspace, quite busy and content. So much has changed in my heart since her transition. Mostly, I see the amazing, transient nature of love and life on this planet. So, love yourself wholly, completely, intently....for the vast and surprising mystery you are......and everything else is "Gravy".
As I was writing a short comment on Gina Ogden's The Return of Desire (see Polyamory Resources: Books on Sex and Sexual Healing (https://aphroweb.net/resources/polyresources-sex.htm)), I came across a quote I want to share.
"Love comes from a fully filled personal well and is about opening up your heart to others. Need comes from an empty personal well and is about seeking approval and nurturing from others - too often from other empty souls who are incapable of intimacy."
I recommend her book!
Cascade Spring Cook
Relationship and polyamory guide
www.aphroweb.net (https://www.aphroweb.net)
NorseViking869
02-15-2009, 10:14 AM
Namaste:
I have always been confused by the difference of love and need. Is it not healthy to need someones touch, as it is to breath air, drink water or eat. I know last night I needed, not desired intimacy. Not pretty at all. Not sex, just loving contact. I was missing arms around me in bed. I was missing a shoulder to cry on. Was missing the laughter. I was needy. I had plans for months to make yesterday romantic for my ex lover;however, we had a nasty break up. My plans were shattered and my heart was broken. So I was alone after a 2 year relationship and did not feel good. Sure I could have went to meet singles, but I was dealing with the tail end of loss.
I do understand the dfference between love and lust but that is another post.
Cascade
02-15-2009, 06:04 PM
I have always been confused by the difference of love and need. Is it not healthy to need someones touch, as it is to breath air, drink water or eat. I know last night I needed, not desired intimacy. Not pretty at all. Not sex, just loving contact. I was missing arms around me in bed. I was missing a shoulder to cry on. Was missing the laughter. I was needy. I had plans for months to make yesterday romantic for my ex lover;however, we had a nasty break up. My plans were shattered and my heart was broken. So I was alone after a 2 year relationship and did not feel good. Sure I could have went to meet singles, but I was dealing with the tail end of loss.
Ouch! It really hurts to break up with someone you love, and to miss that loving touch. It hurts when you've made wonderful plans to please your lover, only to break up before you can enjoy them together.
Yes, we humans need touch and intimacy. However there's a difference between grabbing for someone to fill the empty hole in oneself, and reaching out to share joy, love, friendship, touch. I suspect that one reason so many rebound relationships don't last is that we usually need time to recenter ourselves and to get past the desperate need to fill the void left by our former lover. We need time to grieve.