Grab&Grow soil problems?

[heartsong]

I purchased soil from grab&grow and my garden is doing so poorly. I had a problem with them previoiusly with soil being toxic. I'm wondering if there is any one else out there having problems with their soil. Please do let me know.
Thanks Much,
Heartsong

[The A Team]

I started having problems with their mulch(funky garbage smell) , so I switched to Sonoma Compost, which is cheaper and organic . Andrea


I purchased soil from grab&grow and my garden is doing so poorly. I had a problem with them previoiusly with soil being toxic. I'm wondering if there is any one else out there having problems with their soil. Please do let me know.
Thanks Much,
Heartsong

[didijeff]

I have stopped using Grab N Grow as well. Bought soil several years ago to fill raised beds. After about two years the soil became very hard-packed and impossible to dig with a spade because it had so much solids in it (a lot of broken up brick and small stones).

[Deborah1]

Glad to hear we aren't the only ones having problems with Grab 'n Grow soil. Most of the raised beds we're using it in are not doing well. Plants roots just don't grow, it is very heavy and retains a lot of water. We've been mixing in our compost and that is helping the soil to slowly improve. I suspected that the Grab n' Grow soil was the problem. Having read everyone else's posts, I am now sure.

[findingme2]

I also used to use Grab and Grow and had problems. I now use H & M which is down the road (or up the road!!!) from them. My plants are doing so much better and when it is wet out you don't have to deal with the mess of Grab and Grow's parking lot.

Donna

[neil dunaetz]

What is the exact product from Grab and Grow that you are having problems with? You've been calling it "soil", but what does Grab 'n Grow call it? I know they make and sell several products, each with unique characteristics. Are you sure you are using the proper material for your purpose? Are you sure you are using it in the correct proportions and at the correct depth. If it's still "hot" when you get it, do you know to either use it very carefully and very sparingly, or to wait and let it cure some more until it is safer for your plants? For example, I've known people who fill their planting boxes with 100% fresh-made compost. That would be like making multivitamin pills 100% of your diet (you'd be sick!) Even 1 part compost to 20 parts native soil is very rich.

Any good compost that is still hot is potentially detrimental to growing plants if used incorrectly. As a farmer, I've made that mistake more than once. Yea, sure, maybe there is a problem with Grab 'n Grow compost. It's possible. But it seems more likely that the product is fine and is being used incorrectly.

Someone mentioned that Sonoma Compost is cheaper. That's because it isn't as valuable--it has lower amounts of key nutrients. Too much wood, not enough manure in the feedstock they make it from. In my opinion it takes some manure in the mix to make a fine compost, but the high nitrogen level of the manure is also what makes it problematic if used incorrectly.

Aside from the quality of the amendments you use and how you use them, there are other many other things that might be contributing to your poor results. I could make a long list, but it wouldn't mean anything without seeing what is actually happening there.

Neil


Glad to hear we aren't the only ones having problems with Grab 'n Grow soil. Most of the raised beds we're using it in are not doing well. Plants roots just don't grow, it is very heavy and retains a lot of water. We've been mixing in our compost and that is helping the soil to slowly improve. I suspected that the Grab n' Grow soil was the problem. Having read everyone else's posts, I am now sure.

[glenclem]

Yes Grab & Grow is inconsistant in their products and you really need to know what to look for when buying their products. The products from the landfill is cheap and recycled but they are not allowed to add nutrients (manures). The best source for soil ammedments I have found, besides making my own, is Wheeler Zamaroni. There web site is www.wzsupply.com
good growing,
Glen


I purchased soil from grab&grow and my garden is doing so poorly. I had a problem with them previoiusly with soil being toxic. I'm wondering if there is any one else out there having problems with their soil. Please do let me know.
Thanks Much,
Heartsong

[saysni]

Comment #1: We use Grab'nGrow's "Organic Nursery Planter Mix" & "Organic Garden Mix" - depending on drainage needs - and have always had fantastic results! I love Grab'nGrow and love their products - I even love their parking lot/yard, especially in winter (no dust!). And their wonderful aroma...it's a veritable olfactory orgasm. Please don't write them off based only on a handful of well placed negative anecdotal comments. How can anything NOT grow in Sonoma County???! While I do sympathise with those having troubles in their gardens, I agree with a previous poster that y'all should 'liminate other factors before blaming a possible innocent-until-proven-guilty target, yes? It's mirror check time, folks.

Comment #2: I don't know the particular nomenclature of soil product classification but I cannot imagine that "Organic" has the same meaning as it applies to food products. There is NO WAY any business which takes in "yard waste" (i.e. Grab&Grow, the County Dump/Sonoma Compost) from the general AND corporate public to be "recycled" and then resold as an "organic" product", can regulate - much less control - any ingredient contained therein. What i'm getting at is don't expect ANY commercially obtained "soil product", even those labeled as "organic", to be free from pesticides, herbicides, or any other chemical floating around in the environment, it's just not realistic. I infer "organic" - when referencing soil products - to mean that it is/was sourced from living matter; nothing more, nothing less.

:2cents: ps. I utilize both the county and grab'grow dump sites and, believe me, the folks at g'n'g are a lot MORE strict about what they allow you to drop off in their source pile. The dump people are a lot LESS particular. Everytime i'm at the "dump" dropping off green waste I ALWAYS see stuff in the pile we're told not to dump: i.e. painted wood, trash, bamboo, palms, etc. They may catch it later before it gets processed but to me it's bad form and is discouraging to see. Not to mention the jackasses who KNOWINGLY dump their shit where they know they're not supposed to! And don't get me started on all the "recycleable" material i see going onto the main dump floor that gets crushed and trucked off "somewhere else". Sonoma County used to be much better about keeping stuff out of the landfill there on Meacham Rd. Now that is goes "elsewhere" it's like back to the bad old days. I guess maybe the alternative is people wouldn't use the dump if they're harrased too much by the dump employees for not better separating their loads.
Oh well - have a nice weekend everyone! And keep smiling (it'll make everyone wonder what you're up to!).

[glenclem]

Greetings,
I rarely write off anyone or any thing. People need to educate themselves when they are being consumers lest they be consumed. I have used and been satisfied with grab and grow planter mix but before buying it I asked its content, age of manure (it was fairly new so I knew it might be to hot to plant in right away). The mulch from the land fill is fine for suppressing weeds in an area that is not for food production (best used over sheet [cardboard/newspaper] mulch). Wheeler Zamaroni is the most consumer ready and consistant product I have found for my clients, Personally I make my own compost and have a worm bin. There is no one magic ingredient to healthy soil, it takes work, observation and time. Check out the book "Secrets to Great Soil" by E.Stell, it is a great resurce for any level gardener and is in the Sonoma Co. library system. Alsooo at thhellibrary iss the "California Master Gardeners Handbook" which relates to our local growing conditions and was written by many different specialists in the fields covered. If youu need to be awed and inspired take a look at the videoo series "The Life of Plants" D.Attenborouch (BBC) it is truly amazing.
Get Smart,
Get Growing
Glen

ps One of the joys of gardening for me is that there is always something new to learn, some way to adapt and compromise with natures ways.

[saysni]

Right-on and amen brother glen. Good and sage advise.


...People need to educate themselves...Check out the book "Secrets to Great Soil" by E.Stell & "California Master Gardeners Handbook"...& the video series "The Life of Plants" D.Attenborough (BBC) it is truly amazing.

(Stevie Wonder's "The Secret Life of Plants" is a nice audio accompanyment to any outer or inner journey. - Says)

[clgus]

I purchased soil from grab&grow and my garden is doing so poorly. I had a problem with them previoiusly with soil being toxic. I'm wondering if there is any one else out there having problems with their soil. Please do let me know.
Thanks Much,
Heartsong

GrabNGrow soil is rather "anemic" as far as nutrients go. I've been using their "organic" mix for a while and it definitely needs some fortification. I usually mix in a few bags of organic chicken manure in the top few inches of soil and repeat on a weekly basis. Things grow well if I am diligent and in between use some liquid fish emulsion (watch out for raccons!), organic stuff.

[kcflowers]

I have used Grab-N-Grow for years when I am pinched for time - 80% of the time I have been unhappy with the results: from noxious weed seeds and garbage in the soil and compost (legible writing on the garbage!), planting mix way too hot and brick hard in the boxes, organic nursery mix with no nutrition even though they claim to add organic fertilizer, and on and on.

The compost facility across from the sewer treatment plant has a wonderful and inexpensive compost for gardens and lawns. They test their product often and will readily show the results. Wheeler-Zamaroni has awesome products but they are on Petaluma Hill Road - a bit of a drive from West County.

(Hi Neil!) Kathy


What is the exact product from Grab and Grow that you are having problems with? You've been calling it "soil", but what does Grab 'n Grow call it? I know they make and sell several products, each with unique characteristics. Are you sure you are using the proper material for your purpose? Are you sure you are using it in the correct proportions and at the correct depth. If it's still "hot" when you get it, do you know to either use it very carefully and very sparingly, or to wait and let it cure some more until it is safer for your plants? For example, I've known people who fill their planting boxes with 100% fresh-made compost. That would be like making multivitamin pills 100% of your diet (you'd be sick!) Even 1 part compost to 20 parts native soil is very rich.

Any good compost that is still hot is potentially detrimental to growing plants if used incorrectly. As a farmer, I've made that mistake more than once. Yea, sure, maybe there is a problem with Grab 'n Grow compost. It's possible. But it seems more likely that the product is fine and is being used incorrectly.

Someone mentioned that Sonoma Compost is cheaper. That's because it isn't as valuable--it has lower amounts of key nutrients. Too much wood, not enough manure in the feedstock they make it from. In my opinion it takes some manure in the mix to make a fine compost, but the high nitrogen level of the manure is also what makes it problematic if used incorrectly.

Aside from the quality of the amendments you use and how you use them, there are other many other things that might be contributing to your poor results. I could make a long list, but it wouldn't mean anything without seeing what is actually happening there.

Neil

[nicofrog]

Hi Folks wow what a wealth of info;
I have simply observed that a pile of that manure based yard waste compost will sit there a year or more and no weeds will grow in it, or some I got from Albion sprouted out with a lot of hemlock!
I don't like the smell or feel of steer manure based"Compost" and most commercial mixes have way too much wood chip residue which will rob the nitrogen they add as the chips break down.In my opinion it's crazy to send green bin waste to a company if you have room on your property to pile it up and let it compost.
if they accept lawn clippings from big lawn people it's quite possible theres broad leaf herbicide in it that will kill your squash etc.
I make hot compost,and worm compost.I help people set up and run composting systems,and I sell worms and worm compost.Composting is a great way to give back to the plants for giving us so much!
Nico 684 0341



I purchased soil from grab&grow and my garden is doing so poorly. I had a problem with them previoiusly with soil being toxic. I'm wondering if there is any one else out there having problems with their soil. Please do let me know.
Thanks Much,
Heartsong

[ambiguous]

Why didn't Heartsong reply to any of those replies? I hope she isn't taking her own embarrassment to seriously....


Hi Folks wow what a wealth of info;
I have simply observed that a pile of that manure based yard waste compost will sit there a year or more and no weeds will grow in it, or some I got from Albion sprouted out with a lot of hemlock!
I don't like the smell or feel of steer manure based"Compost" and most commercial mixes have way too much wood chip residue which will rob the nitrogen they add as the chips break down.In my opinion it's crazy to send green bin waste to a company if you have room on your property to pile it up and let it compost.
if they accept lawn clippings from big lawn people it's quite possible theres broad leaf herbicide in it that will kill your squash etc.
I make hot compost,and worm compost.I help people set up and run composting systems,and I sell worms and worm compost.Composting is a great way to give back to the plants for giving us so much!
Nico 684 0341

[brian]

Why didn't Heartsong reply to any of those replies? I hope she isn't taking her own embarrassment to seriously....

I've been a professional licenced landscape contractor for over 20 years and the finest bulk compost I've ever seen is at Sonoma Compost. Their ' Mallard Mix' is just duck manure, rice hulls, and our debri waste made into compost.
It's black like compost from any well managed pile, and it grows worms as it sits on a pile !

Best of Gardening Days to You All

[gardendoc]

Morning!
Yes, I have purchased from Grab N Grow for the last three years. Two years in a row I purchased the Mango Mulch, 25 yards each year and this year I purchased the Organic Garden Mix ($$$$ at 40.75 per yard) 40 yards total. I have 35 raised beds and several in ground garden plots.

The Mango mulch, ok as it goes but needs ALOT of adds. On its own is to light and drains too well, causing a derth of moisture for the first half of the growing season until plant roots (and worms) can firm it up and hold the water. I would use only as an addition to a soil based bed which is what I use it for currently.

Now the bad news: The Organic Garden Mix. In 15 years, the all time worst soil I have had to deal with. There was no where near the amount of good manure or balanced nutrient claimed to be in there. The bulk of the soil is actually clay which the lava rock (used to break apart the clumping) is supposed to help keep the soil "friable" - useless. I now have to re-do every bed that has this as a base. The upshot: well, I am still looking and figure I have several compost piles and a good supply of mulches that will be added to the beds along with this years "green manure" crop I will plant in the fall.
I did find if I added about 1.5 inches of well composted chicken manure to the beds with the O.G.S. that it did a bit better, the bigger problem however is how badly it compacts and the roots then struggle which takes away the growht to the plant and / or fruit.

The leasson for me: Never again with the "Organic Garden Mix" in the meantime, just keep the soil "broken" as much as possiable.


I purchased soil from grab&grow and my garden is doing so poorly. I had a problem with them previoiusly with soil being toxic. I'm wondering if there is any one else out there having problems with their soil. Please do let me know.
Thanks Much,
Heartsong

[cosmiccorn]

I purchased a couple of yards of the Tango Mulch for a raised bed vegetable garden that I installed for a neighbor. I had heard good things about Grab'n Grow products but I was very disappointed in the quality of the soil that we bought from Grab'n Grow. The Tango Mulch had a grey hue to it and did not drain evenly, but rather clumped together in tenacious bundles of compacted 'soil' which allowed the water to flow through without even distribution in the beds.
I ended up bringing in amendments from my home compost pile to address the challenges.




Morning!
Yes, I have purchased from Grab N Grow for the last three years. Two years in a row I purchased the Mango Mulch, 25 yards each year and this year I purchased the Organic Garden Mix ($$$$ at 40.75 per yard) 40 yards total. I have 35 raised beds and several in ground garden plots.

The Mango mulch, ok as it goes but needs ALOT of adds. On its own is to light and drains too well, causing a derth of moisture for the first half of the growing season until plant roots (and worms) can firm it up and hold the water. I would use only as an addition to a soil based bed which is what I use it for currently.

Now the bad news: The Organic Garden Mix. In 15 years, the all time worst soil I have had to deal with. There was no where near the amount of good manure or balanced nutrient claimed to be in there. The bulk of the soil is actually clay which the lava rock (used to break apart the clumping) is supposed to help keep the soil "friable" - useless. I now have to re-do every bed that has this as a base. The upshot: well, I am still looking and figure I have several compost piles and a good supply of mulches that will be added to the beds along with this years "green manure" crop I will plant in the fall.
I did find if I added about 1.5 inches of well composted chicken manure to the beds with the O.G.S. that it did a bit better, the bigger problem however is how badly it compacts and the roots then struggle which takes away the growht to the plant and / or fruit.

The leasson for me: Never again with the "Organic Garden Mix" in the meantime, just keep the soil "broken" as much as possiable.

[PeterB]

I am having the same problems with poor soil quality. A couple of months ago I purchased G & G compost and the plants that I have used it on seem stunted and not doing well at all. In fact, I found a syringe in the compost, so what are they actually composting?

PeterB

[Sybil de Ville]

I have purchased from G&G with fair results, but if you really want some good stuff, try the product from the Biosolids Compost Facility at the Treatment Plant on Llano Road (someone else suggested below). Some, but not much contamination with pieces of plastic bags and such, probably comes from the bulking agent (yard waste). The results are spectacular. Everybody all green and happy.

[Lisa G]

Hello,
regarding grab And Grow - I was told once they get their compost and manure from anywhere without checking it. I do not know if this is tru but Iknow someone who used to bring manure to them and they were never even asked what was in it.

If you want some great compost and manure I have fabulous manure which breaks down with in 6 months. I am very careful about avoiding exotics - such as non CA blackberry, thistle or duck weed. It is high in Nitrogen and can be used directly on some plants that like it hot. It makes rich wormy soil.
Plants love it.

I am in Fulton. It is free if you shovel yourself. $4 a feed bag full. $125 a pick up load delivered with in 20 miles of me.

and there are no syringes!

Lisa
575-9106

[GC3]

Biosolid sludge is contaminated with heavy metals and god knows what else (antiobiotics, endocrine interruptors, pharmeceuticals, etc.). Plastic bags and other refuse is a sign that you are using material that is questionable at best.

[Tars]

regarding grab And Grow - I was told once they get their compost and manure from anywhere without checking it.

A local Sebastopol trucking company hauls our horse manure/stall bedding to Grab 'N' Grow during the wet months. The trucking company owner just stopped by to get a sample of this mixture to provide to Grab 'N' Grow for analysis.