Whole Foods Boycott Demonstration 9/27 Seb.

[GlenWS]

Hi,

I am putting together a protest and information demonstration in Sebastopol on 9/27 for the WFM boycott. I was handing out flyers today in Sebastopol educating people about Whole Foods CEO John Mackey, his op-ed in the Wall St. Journal and his anti-union, anti-public option stance.

I was surprised that about 50 percent of the people I spoke with had no idea about any of it. Their reaction upon learning about John Mackey's op-ed was positive for a boycott of Whole Foods market.

I am attempting to put together a large group of well informed and well intentioned, not militant, residents who can help spread the word about the boycott. Please contact me at [email protected] if you would like to be an important part of the health care debate. We as average citizens don't get to express our opinions through op-ed pieces in major (conservative) "news" publications. We have to take to the streets to be heard.

We are not anti-Whole Foods or Whole Foods employees. We want John Mackey held accountable for his actions, by the share holders. The only way to do that is to affect their bottom-line and the only way to do that is to not shop at Whole Foods.

If we can't hold our own "progressive" companies accountable, how will we take on oil giants and insurance giants?

Thank You,

Glen.

[federico]

If you are against the position of John Mackey (as am I), then please focus your energy on getting the public option passed through Congress. Please call Finance Chairperson John Baucus and stress your support for the choice of a public option. Call Sen Boxer and Feinstein and stress the same.

To counter Mackey's opinion, please get involved in the campaign to pass the public option. Contact democracyforamerica.org for instance. Protesting at Whole Foods doesn't not accomplish much toward this effort. Rather, I feel it diffuses the progressive movement's energy for universal health care.

[bodegahead]

You just stated you are "not anti Whoke Foods" If you are "not anti Whole Foods" then why boycott Whole Foods? Maybe I`m missing somthing but that statement doesn`t make sense. Are you boycotting Whole Foods or are you protesting John Mackey opinions by informing the publc about John Macky? Boycott Whole Foods, who you say you aren`t against to change the way Glen Mackey thinks? Good luck

Hi,

I am putting together a protest and information demonstration in Sebastopol on 9/27 for the WFM boycott. I was handing out flyers today in Sebastopol educating people about Whole Foods CEO John Mackey, his op-ed in the Wall St. Journal and his anti-union, anti-public option stance.

I was surprised that about 50 percent of the people I spoke with had no idea about any of it. Their reaction upon learning about John Mackey's op-ed was positive for a boycott of Whole Foods market.

I am attempting to put together a large group of well informed and well intentioned, not militant, residents who can help spread the word about the boycott. Please contact me at [email protected] if you would like to be an important part of the health care debate. We as average citizens don't get to express our opinions through op-ed pieces in major (conservative) "news" publications. We have to take to the streets to be heard.

We are not anti-Whole Foods or Whole Foods employees. We want John Mackey held accountable for his actions, by the share holders. The only way to do that is to affect their bottom-line and the only way to do that is to not shop at Whole Foods.

If we can't hold our own "progressive" companies accountable, how will we take on oil giants and insurance giants?

Thank You,

Glen.

[The Owl]

Hi,

I am putting together a protest and information demonstration in Sebastopol on 9/27 for the WFM boycott. I was handing out flyers today in Sebastopol educating people about Whole Foods CEO John Mackey, his op-ed in the Wall St. Journal and his anti-union, anti-public option stance.

I was surprised that about 50 percent of the people I spoke with had no idea about any of it. Their reaction upon learning about John Mackey's op-ed was positive for a boycott of Whole Foods market.

I am attempting to put together a large group of well informed and well intentioned, not militant, residents who can help spread the word about the boycott. Please contact me at [email protected] if you would like to be an important part of the health care debate. We as average citizens don't get to express our opinions through op-ed pieces in major (conservative) "news" publications. We have to take to the streets to be heard.

We are not anti-Whole Foods or Whole Foods employees. We want John Mackey held accountable for his actions, by the share holders. The only way to do that is to affect their bottom-line and the only way to do that is to not shop at Whole Foods.

If we can't hold our own "progressive" companies accountable, how will we take on oil giants and insurance giants?

Thank You,

Glen.

Seems you have good intentions but the CEO isn't going to be affected at all... he's in Texas and could give a rat's ass about your protest. What you WILL do if you are successful and customer numbers are reduced, is cause layoffs of good people who work there and are having a hard enough time as it is paying their rent, etc in Sebastopol and surrounding area.

[GlenWS]

Thank you for your reply and concern. The objective here is to hold Mackey accountable for involving all of the Whole Foods employees in his politics. The Whole Foods employees have not formed a union, so they have no power and no voice. Mr. Mackey's statements in the Wall St. Journal are not the feelings of the progressives who shop at his store or the employees that work there. He mentioned Whole Foods several times in the piece.

Would you be ok with someone putting words in your mouth or representing you against your wishes and in direct contradiction to how you actually feel? That is what Mr. Mackey did to his employees and his clientele. No CEO should do that, it's not only bad business it's unethical.

If the boycott is successful and affects the share holders bottom line, far from ever getting to the point of lay-offs Mr. Mackey would be forced out of his position for putting the company in jeopardy to further his own political motives.

I take it the two people who responded here are not for a public option or universal health care and you wouldn't be the people we are looking for anyway.

But thank you for your reply's, freedom of expression is a wonderful thing.

Thank you to the many of you have emailed me wanting to know details about the protest. I have emailed you all individually and I'm happy to announce we have three local unions joining in the boycott.

Seems you have good intentions but the CEO isn't going to be affected at all... he's in Texas and could give a rat's ass about your protest. What you WILL do if you are successful and customer numbers are reduced, is cause layoffs of good people who work there and are having a hard enough time as it is paying their rent, etc in Sebastopol and surrounding area.

[GlenWS]

This is an important part of the health care debate. This is a "progressive" company that has a huge progressive and pro-public option clientele. For the CEO to express his opposition to President Obama's health care plan, while representing a so-called "progressive" company, doesn't bode well with those of us who have spent thousands upon thousands of dollars at that store.

Again, if we can't hold our own "progressive" companies responsible for their actions, how will take on big insurance and big oil?

I think this Whole Foods issue is of great importance and I don't understand how someone who could be for a public option, upon reading Mr. Mackeys op-ed in the Wall St. Journal, could continue to funnel money into his pocket.

Every organic item sold in that corporate store, can be found elsewhere in Sonoma County at a local business.

Pacific Market
Oliver's Market
Trader Joe's
Andy's Fruit Stand
Our awesome farmers markets
Community Market

We have options people, there is no reason to continue shopping Whole Foods. For goodness sake Walmart of places sells more organic dairy and produce than Whole Foods does.

Principles, get some.

If you are against the position of John Mackey (as am I), then please focus your energy on getting the public option passed through Congress. Please call Finance Chairperson John Baucus and stress your support for the choice of a public option. Call Sen Boxer and Feinstein and stress the same.

To counter Mackey's opinion, please get involved in the campaign to pass the public option. Contact democracyforamerica.org for instance. Protesting at Whole Foods doesn't not accomplish much toward this effort. Rather, I feel it diffuses the progressive movement's energy for universal health care.

[The Owl]

Thank you for your reply and concern. The objective here is to hold Mackey accountable for involving all of the Whole Foods employees in his politics. The Whole Foods employees have not formed a union, so they have no power and no voice. Mr. Mackey's statements in the Wall St. Journal are not the feelings of the progressives who shop at his store or the employees that work there. He mentioned Whole Foods several times in the piece.

Would you be ok with someone putting words in your mouth or representing you against your wishes and in direct contradiction to how you actually feel? That is what Mr. Mackey did to his employees and his clientele. No CEO should do that, it's not only bad business it's unethical.

If the boycott is successful and affects the share holders bottom line, far from ever getting to the point of lay-offs Mr. Mackey would be forced out of his position for putting the company in jeopardy to further his own political motives.

I take it the two people who responded here are not for a public option or universal health care and you wouldn't be the people we are looking for anyway.

But thank you for your reply's, freedom of expression is a wonderful thing.

Thank you to the many of you have emailed me wanting to know details about the protest. I have emailed you all individually and I'm happy to announce we have three local unions joining in the boycott.

Listen, you self righteous jackass. You want to make this personal then fine... charging in there like a half cocked idiot is just the thing that will teach you what no words ever will so go right ahead. Just be ready to tell the employees you were only trying to "help them" when they lose their jobs. If you had the grit you pretend to have, you'd not risk the jobs of these mainly young, entry level employees but you'd go to the corporate headquarters where it might actually do some good, but that would involve you actually risking something.

Attacking me and what you imagine to be my politics is another story. Not only am I for the watered down compromise known as the "public option" but I'm for single payer, Euro style socialist health care and the dismantling of this entire, heartless empire.

[GlenWS]

Well, I sort tune out when the name calling starts, I did a lot of that already back in fifth grade, sort of got it out of my system. I appreciate your passion, I think it's great that you're for single payer. I can also understand why you think a boycott would hurt the corporation Whole Foods' employees and why you would be against that.

Again, long before Whole Foods ever fired one worker on account of this boycott, the share holders would fire John Mackey. And sometimes there are sacrifices to be made. When people take their money out of the Whole Foods corporation and put it into another business, that other business thrives. Soon that other business will be hiring more people and the circle of life continues.

I would love to have an honest debate about the merits of the boycott, with you, but you'll need to control yourself like an adult first and cease with the juvenile name calling.

[The Owl]

Well, I sort tune out when the name calling starts, I did a lot of that already back in fifth grade, sort of got it out of my system. I appreciate your passion, I think it's great that you're for single payer. I can also understand why you think a boycott would hurt the corporation Whole Foods' employees and why you would be against that.

Again, long before Whole Foods ever fired one worker on account of this boycott, the share holders would fire John Mackey. And sometimes there are sacrifices to be made. When people take their money out of the Whole Foods corporation and put it into another business, that other business thrives. Soon that other business will be hiring more people and the circle of life continues.

I would love to have an honest debate about the merits of the boycott, with you, but you'll need to control yourself like an adult first and cease with the juvenile name calling.

Normally I don't go there but this time I felt the situation called for it. I was merely responding in a like manner to your juvenile assumption that I was against health care and "not someone you'd want in your group anyway". So heed your own words about self control and adult behavior... this WAS an adult response whether it fits your personal definition of what that is or not and one you should be more prepared for if you're really going to do a boycott picket and cop that attitude with those who disagree with you. Returning your shot across the bow, as it were.

That being said, I'd be happy to discuss this issue with you in a civil manner. I have been posting since this issue first arose that WF isn't the only place around to get organic food (there's Andy's, Oliver's, Pacific, Fircrest, Bill's and several wonderful farmer's markets each week) but it is the priciest. I only buy occasional hot meals or blender drinks at WF anyway as I find the average $1 to $2 more per pound of everything off-putting. We don't call it Whole Paycheck for nothing.

[GlenWS]

"Seems you have good intentions but the CEO isn't going to be affected at all... he's in Texas and could give a rat's ass about your protest. What you WILL do if you are successful and customer numbers are reduced, is cause layoffs of good people who work there and are having a hard enough time as it is paying their rent, etc in Sebastopol and surrounding area.".

So we have "good intentions" but that doesn't matter cause nothing will come of it so we should just give up? He's in Texas, yes, but when you go into Whole Foods and purchase something, a percentage of your purchase trickles up into his stock. I don't know if you understand how Wall St. works, so I'm trying to make this very simple for you. So yes, we can affect him here in California even though he is a few states away.

Again your layoff argument isn't based in reality. Do you honestly think that the share holders will keep John Mackey as CEO and instead decide to reduce their workforce, thus prolonging the boycott and affecting their stock even more? These people aren't stupid. If they see a reduction of profits based on this boycott, which is the result of John Mackey's op-ed, then they'll fire him.

Boycotts work, they work well, but they only work well when people stand up for themselves and steadfastly defend their principles. I want a single payer program in this country, John Mackey CEO of Whole Foods does not. He is on the opposing side of the debate then we are, and so we DON'T have to support his company, plain and simple.

This boycott is to defend the workers who didn't have a voice-when John Mackey spoke for all of them in his Wall St. Journal op-ed-not hurt them. And let's not forget that Mr. Mackey is a Libertarian, NOT a progressive, he believes in deregulation, he wants less Government oversight of business's, he wants the weak to fend for themselves or die off (he mentioned survival of the fittest) and he was investigated by the SEC for blogging under a fake name for 7 years-negative lies about Wild Oats market-until their stock bottomed and then he bought them up.

Yeah, that's a guy I want to give money to.

[GlenWS]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I gathered from this is that you dn't have willpower and must shop at Whole Foods because they have a hot foods bar and no other business has one? I may be off here, please let me know.

Normally I don't go there but this time I felt the situation called for it. I was merely responding in a like manner to your juvenile assumption that I was against health care and "not someone you'd want in your group anyway". So heed your own words about self control and adult behavior... this WAS an adult response whether it fits your personal definition of what that is or not and one you should be more prepared for if you're really going to do a boycott picket and cop that attitude with those who disagree with you. Returning your shot across the bow, as it were.

That being said, I'd be happy to discuss this issue with you in a civil manner. I have been posting since this issue first arose that WF isn't the only place around to get organic food (there's Andy's, Oliver's, Pacific, Fircrest, Bill's and several wonderful farmer's markets each week) but it is the priciest. I only buy occasional hot meals or blender drinks at WF anyway as I find the average $1 to $2 more per pound of everything off-putting. We don't call it Whole Paycheck for nothing.

[The Owl]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I gathered from this is that you dn't have willpower and must shop at Whole Foods because they have a hot foods bar and no other business has one? I may be off here, please let me know.

You know, your tendency to assume things about other people and to then go hyperbolic is very annoying. You are as off here as you are everywhere else. You believe you are right and that's all that matters. I am always wary of those who claim to be doing things for the good of others. We have a government filled with self absorbed people "helping us". Have fun at your little boycott.

[bodegahead]

As far as me, yes you are wrong. I shop at Whole Foods for the hot food and the salad bar. What the **** do you know about my willpower??? I have the willpower to shop anywhere I want and yes sometimes I hit the hot food/ salad bar @ Pacific if it is in my line of travel. I think you need to stop making assumptions of people if you want me to stop making assumptions about you. You are very off and in being so you diminish any point you are trying to make.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I gathered from this is that you dn't have willpower and must shop at Whole Foods because they have a hot foods bar and no other business has one? I may be off here, please let me know.

[The Owl]

"Seems you have good intentions but the CEO isn't going to be affected at all... he's in Texas and could give a rat's ass about your protest. What you WILL do if you are successful and customer numbers are reduced, is cause layoffs of good people who work there and are having a hard enough time as it is paying their rent, etc in Sebastopol and surrounding area.".

So we have "good intentions" but that doesn't matter cause nothing will come of it so we should just give up? He's in Texas, yes, but when you go into Whole Foods and purchase something, a percentage of your purchase trickles up into his stock. I don't know if you understand how Wall St. works, so I'm trying to make this very simple for you. So yes, we can affect him here in California even though he is a few states away.

Again your layoff argument isn't based in reality. Do you honestly think that the share holders will keep John Mackey as CEO and instead decide to reduce their workforce, thus prolonging the boycott and affecting their stock even more? These people aren't stupid. If they see a reduction of profits based on this boycott, which is the result of John Mackey's op-ed, then they'll fire him.

Boycotts work, they work well, but they only work well when people stand up for themselves and steadfastly defend their principles. I want a single payer program in this country, John Mackey CEO of Whole Foods does not. He is on the opposing side of the debate then we are, and so we DON'T have to support his company, plain and simple.

This boycott is to defend the workers who didn't have a voice-when John Mackey spoke for all of them in his Wall St. Journal op-ed-not hurt them. And let's not forget that Mr. Mackey is a Libertarian, NOT a progressive, he believes in deregulation, he wants less Government oversight of business's, he wants the weak to fend for themselves or die off (he mentioned survival of the fittest) and he was investigated by the SEC for blogging under a fake name for 7 years-negative lies about Wild Oats market-until their stock bottomed and then he bought them up.

Yeah, that's a guy I want to give money to.

I have better things to do with my time than debate you, friend. If you really think that your action can bring down a CEO, then go for it. If, however you believe that he is the only one among the heads of industry in this country that holds those views and that whoever replaces him would be any different then you need this experience to wake you up. You give money to people like that every day, every time you buy something or maybe you think he's the only bad guy out there who is trying to derail health care or to unfairly take over another company. This is the way these guys operate, they think nothing of collapsing entire economies and then being bailed out with your tax money by their shills in Congress... this is the "Normal" Obama is trying to get us back to.

[GlenWS]

Please don't be offended by my post that was in no way directed at you, thus the "quote" of the member I was directing my post at. Why would you get angry at my post, when it had nothing to do with you? So far, we've had a lot of anger from you people here, where is it coming from?

As far as me, yes you are wrong. I shop at Whole Foods for the hot food and the salad bar. What the **** do you know about my willpower??? I have the willpower to shop anywhere I want and yes sometimes I hit the hot food/ salad bar @ Pacific if it is in my line of travel. I think you need to stop making assumptions of people if you want me to stop making assumptions about you. You are very off and in being so you diminish any point you are trying to make.

[GlenWS]

You sound like a Ron Paul guy. maybe just a guy who hates Government. Well hating Government and complaining about it, will only bring strife to your life. If you want to change anything, you need to get off yer butt and go out to the people.

Forum arguments are fodder to fill an empty life. See ya all on 9/27 in Sebastopol!!

I have better things to do with my time than debate you, friend. If you really think that your action can bring down a CEO, then go for it. If, however you believe that he is the only one among the heads of industry in this country that holds those views and that whoever replaces him would be any different then you need this experience to wake you up. You give money to people like that every day, every time you buy something or maybe you think he's the only bad guy out there who is trying to derail health care or to unfairly take over another company. This is the way these guys operate, they think nothing of collapsing entire economies and then being bailed out with your tax money by their shills in Congress... this is the "Normal" Obama is trying to get us back to.

[bodegahead]

Glen WS, your quote:
"Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I gathered from this is that you dn't have willpower and must shop at Whole Foods because they have a hot foods bar and no other business has one? I may be off here, please let me know."

It may have as well as been directed at me also, and possibly others, who shop Whole Foods for the prepared meals and salad bar. It does`nt really matter who you were dirrecting it at, your assumption was that someone who shops Whole Foods for prepared meals or salad bar doesnt have any willpower because there are other alternatives. I am telling you in my case you are wrong and have no idea about about mywillpower or anything else about me and those wrong assumtions make me wonder if you know the truth about anything else you are talking about.

Please don't be offended by my post that was in no way directed at you, thus the "quote" of the member I was directing my post at. Why would you get angry at my post, when it had nothing to do with you? So far, we've had a lot of anger from you people here, where is it coming from?

[GlenWS]

Ok, let me say this one last time and hopefully you'll get it. The post was not directed at you, that is why I first "quoted" the comment of the person I was directing it at. That means I was not assuming anything about YOU since I was NOT directing the post at YOU.

Are you that crazy that you're getting upset over something YOU took out of context? If I said "hey Bodegahead, you have no willpower, what's up?" then yeah, go ahead get angry, by all means scream at the moon!

But again, it was clearly not directed at you, you're making yourself look rather foolish by getting upset by it, but of course that is your right and feel free to be angry at whatever you'd like.

Thanks again for all the emails from those of you interested in joining the boycott, you'll all be getting personal emails with details and more!

Glen WS, your quote:
"Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I gathered from this is that you dn't have willpower and must shop at Whole Foods because they have a hot foods bar and no other business has one? I may be off here, please let me know."

It may have as well as been directed at me also, and possibly others, who shop Whole Foods for the prepared meals and salad bar. It does`nt really matter who you were dirrecting it at, your assumption was that someone who shops Whole Foods for prepared meals or salad bar doesnt have any willpower because there are other alternatives. I am telling you in my case you are wrong and have no idea about about mywillpower or anything else about me and those wrong assumtions make me wonder if you know the truth about anything else you are talking about.

[GlenWS]

In addition, and I hate to say this but here is your actual first sentence "
It may have as well as been directed at me also". Half of it anyway. Does anything strike you as odd or confusing about the order in which you have chosen to put these words? I'm just saying, maybe you need to calm down, take a breath and re-read before hitting "submit".

Glen WS, your quote:
"Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I gathered from this is that you dn't have willpower and must shop at Whole Foods because they have a hot foods bar and no other business has one? I may be off here, please let me know."

It may have as well as been directed at me also, and possibly others, who shop Whole Foods for the prepared meals and salad bar. It does`nt really matter who you were dirrecting it at, your assumption was that someone who shops Whole Foods for prepared meals or salad bar doesnt have any willpower because there are other alternatives. I am telling you in my case you are wrong and have no idea about about mywillpower or anything else about me and those wrong assumtions make me wonder if you know the truth about anything else you are talking about.

[Barry]

Let's leave the personal stuff aside and just focus on the boycott, thanks.

[Magick]

I want to thank you Glen for your even temper in responding to the emails. I am a local activist and have struggled with the issue of Whole Foods for some time.
I really know I should not be shopping there and I have more and more been shopping at all the stores and farmer's markets you mentioned.
I would like to speak with you more about this and hope you will hold a meeting for organizing in person.
Their whole "natural' foods is such a lie and they are putting out of business or hurting real organic, small farmers and other authentic businesses by undercutting their prices, sometimes on their own shelves.
You are right that our friends at Whole paycheck will not get fired just because we protest or boycott but in time if Whole Foods doesn't change these folks can be employed where it is beneficial to them and everyone and truly help maintain the natural balance in our world.
Are we going to keep mountaintop coal mining because people are working in that field?
Whole Foods is non-union and not really what it pretends to be. I honor your courage.
People will disagree with you, too bad they can't be respectful, but like Martin Luther King said,"let no one bring you so low as to hate them."
I feel that dealing with what is in our face every day is where to start and is a valid and necessary action.
Many people find it easier to leap over the local and go to the national but
if you see it you're a part of it. I am working in myself towards starting this boycott with you.
Thanks for leading the way!!
Blessings and Peace, Magick

Let's leave the personal stuff aside and just focus on the boycott, thanks.

[tomcat]

I wonder if... instead of a boycott, (or along with one) everyone who is upset by Mackey's statements (and other things) were to write letters to Whole Foods Board of Directors and/or picket the stores to demand that Mackey be fired.

We should talk to the store managers about it every time (IF) we shop there.

Perhaps a huge group of loyal customers protesting Mackey might sway the WF Board of Directors more than the disappearance of a smaller group from the stores. Out of sight is out of mind you know.

... and don't forget that right wing radio is telling their listeners to start shopping at WF to support Mackey! This could be a fantastic marketing ploy by Mackey if WF actually GAINS sales during this boycott.

I would really like to see WF change to a better way of doing business instead of disappearing. They could be a really great store if they tried and they do employ a lot of really nice people.

Thank you for your reply and concern. The objective here is to hold Mackey accountable for involving all of the Whole Foods employees in his politics. The Whole Foods employees have not formed a union, so they have no power and no voice. Mr. Mackey's statements in the Wall St. Journal are not the feelings of the progressives who shop at his store or the employees that work there. He mentioned Whole Foods several times in the piece.

Would you be ok with someone putting words in your mouth or representing you against your wishes and in direct contradiction to how you actually feel? That is what Mr. Mackey did to his employees and his clientele. No CEO should do that, it's not only bad business it's unethical.

If the boycott is successful and affects the share holders bottom line, far from ever getting to the point of lay-offs Mr. Mackey would be forced out of his position for putting the company in jeopardy to further his own political motives.

I take it the two people who responded here are not for a public option or universal health care and you wouldn't be the people we are looking for anyway.

But thank you for your reply's, freedom of expression is a wonderful thing.

Thank you to the many of you have emailed me wanting to know details about the protest. I have emailed you all individually and I'm happy to announce we have three local unions joining in the boycott.

[GlenWS]

Great suggestion. There is currently a letter writing campaign running strong for the past three weeks. Our facebook account has 33,000 members who have joined in the boycott.

Speaking with store managers is great, just remember though that they are not a union and many of them would be hesitant to express our feelings, to their high-ups for fear of who knows. They simply are powerless because they have no union and no voice. They won't risk their jobs for us, we must fight for them.

The boycott will work because it hits these thugs where it hurts, in their pocket book. Standing out in front of Mackey's house in Austin and protesting, won't sway the man to change is Libertarian ideals.

The "buycott" which is being pushed by the very small opposition to our boycott, is not a marketing ploy. New research has discovered that business's grow the most by having a loyal base of customers that turn others onto the company. We are that base for Whole Food's. Mackey would have to convince people who are used to shopping at Foodmaxx, that they should come to Whole Foods and spend $20 on a pound of free-range beef and $6 on a gallon of milk. Whole Foods would have to make up for the tens of thousands of customers they've lost, while at the same time convincing people who spend 3 percent of their budget a month on food, to double or triple that for principles sake.

Not gonna happen. These are people who still buy goods from china, even though china is a communist country, and these patriots are all about liberty and freedom. They buy cheap goods, even though doing so goes against their principles.

We are the progressive base that keeps Whole Foods afloat. That company exists because of us. Now lets force them to behave ethically or risk losing our dollars forever.

I wonder if... instead of a boycott, (or along with one) everyone who is upset by Mackey's statements (and other things) were to write letters to Whole Foods Board of Directors and/or picket the stores to demand that Mackey be fired.

We should talk to the store managers about it every time (IF) we shop there.

Perhaps a huge group of loyal customers protesting Mackey might sway the WF Board of Directors more than the disappearance of a smaller group from the stores. Out of sight is out of mind you know.

... and don't forget that right wing radio is telling their listeners to start shopping at WF to support Mackey! This could be a fantastic marketing ploy by Mackey if WF actually GAINS sales during this boycott.

I would really like to see WF change to a better way of doing business instead of disappearing. They could be a really great store if they tried and they do employ a lot of really nice people.

["Mad" Miles]

I've noticed in the course of this back and forth, I hesitate to call it a debate, that people keep writing as if Mackey is just some employee that might be dismissed by the board of WF, if enough pressure to their bottom line can be applied.

From my reading he is one of, if not the, founder(s). He is also most likely one of the major shareholders. He's the Big Kahuna/Cheese/Chief of WF. So don't get your hopes up about him being shown the door.

That said I support this protest and the boycott. Although it's hard for me to back a boycott of a place I never shop. (It's Pacific / Fiesta in Sebasto and Speers in F'Ville for me. When I lived in Rincon Valley it was Oliver's on Montecito.)

As for the damage to the employees of any successful boycott. Well that's what they said about the poor and non-white in South Africa when we were calling for sanctions and divestment in the late seventies and eighties.

That's what they say about the Burmese people suffering under the brutal dicatorship.

That's what they always say.

It's a way to sideline things and and an attempt to make us feel guilty for using one of the most effective, non-violent means to protest injustice.

It's an argument that deserves to be ignored.

Yes, talk to the managers, the workers, the customers. Explain why a boycott is justified. Change comes when the cost of doing business is raised to an unacceptable level for those in power.

As for WF being supported by a progressive community. I question that claim.

How progressive can the consumers who shop at WF be, when these issues: union busting, greenwashing, spitting in the face of progressives on issues of social justice; have been well known among informed progressives for decades?


GlenWF, your original post in this thread excluded the "militant". That put me off. What's wrong with being militant? If it's in the pursuit of justice?

Please familiarize yourself with the history of militancy in protest culture.

Yes, some extreme militancy can give the cause a bad name, but that by no means encompasses all who are militant.

When organizing a protest, may I suggest not alienating the very subset of your audience who are the most likely to want to show up?

There's nothing wrong with wanting to control the expression at an event that you are organizing. Within broad limits of free expression of course.

But pre-judging potential participants isn't a very effective way to get significant participation!?

End of pro-militant militant rant.


Everybody, don't forget that the 12th Annual Progressive Festival is this Sunday in Petaluma!

Walnut Park
noon to 5:00
9/20/09

Peace Out,

"Mad" Miles

[markwjam]

the best summation I"ve seen on this, Miles.
thanks
Mark B

I've noticed in the course of this back and forth, I hesitate to call it a debate, that people keep writing as if Mackey is just some employee that might be dismissed by the board of WF, if enough pressure to their bottom line can be applied.

From my reading he is one of, if not the, founder(s). He is also most likely one of the major shareholders. He's the Big Kahuna/Cheese/Chief of WF. So don't get your hopes up about him being shown the door.

That said I support this protest and the boycott. Although it's hard for me to back a boycott of a place I never shop. (It's Pacific / Fiesta in Sebasto and Speers in F'Ville for me. When I lived in Rincon Valley it was Oliver's on Montecito.)

As for the damage to the employees of any successful boycott. Well that's what they said about the poor and non-white in South Africa when we were calling for sanctions and divestment in the late seventies and eighties.

That's what they say about the Burmese people suffering under the brutal dicatorship.

That's what they always say.

It's a way to sideline things and and an attempt to make us feel guilty for using one of the most effective, non-violent means to protest injustice.

It's an argument that deserves to be ignored.

Yes, talk to the managers, the workers, the customers. Explain why a boycott is justified. Change comes when the cost of doing business is raised to an unacceptable level for those in power.

As for WF being supported by a progressive community. I question that claim.

How progressive can the consumers who shop at WF be, when these issues: union busting, greenwashing, spitting in the face of progressives on issues of social justice; have been well known among informed progressives for decades?


GlenWF, your original post in this thread excluded the "militant". That put me off. What's wrong with being militant? If it's in the pursuit of justice?

Please familiarize yourself with the history of militancy in protest culture.

Yes, some extreme militancy can give the cause a bad name, but that by no means encompasses all who are militant.

When organizing a protest, may I suggest not alienating the very subset of your audience who are the most likely to want to show up?

There's nothing wrong with wanting to control the expression at an event that you are organizing. Within broad limits of free expression of course.

But pre-judging potential participants isn't a very effective way to get significant participation!?

End of pro-militant militant rant.


Everybody, don't forget that the 12th Annual Progressive Festival is this Sunday in Petaluma!

Walnut Park
noon to 5:00
9/20/09

Peace Out,

"Mad" Miles

[tomcat]

Dear Mr. Mad Miles,

>>> I've noticed in the course of this back and forth, I hesitate to call it a debate, that people keep writing as if Mackey is just some employee that might be dismissed by the board of WF, if enough pressure to their bottom line can be applied.
From my reading he is one of, if not the, founder(s). He is also most likely one of the major shareholders. He's the Big Kahuna/Cheese/Chief of WF. So don't get your hopes up about him being shown the door. <<<

Lots of CEO's have lost their jobs, but you may be right. He may have an extreme hold on his powerful position, but the Board may have the power to fire him. This would certainly be a good area for some research.



<<
How progressive can the consumers who shop at WF be, when these issues: union busting, greenwashing, spitting in the face of progressives on issues of social justice; have been well known among informed progressives for decades?<<<

I have shopped at the Sebastopol and Santa Rosa Whole Foods stores and I see Lots and Lots of people who seem to me to look like progressive people from the community (Judging by their appearance and bumper stickers) when compared with people I see shopping at other stores. Perhaps we both might be confusing progressive and radical? I believe the line between those two MOVES depending on ones point of view. How progressive does one have to be to earn the label? ...and at what point does one become a radical? ...and in whose eyes?


>>> GlenWF, your original post in this thread excluded the "militant". That put me off. What's wrong with being militant? If it's in the pursuit of justice?

Please familiarize yourself with the history of militancy in protest culture.

Yes, some extreme militancy can give the cause a bad name, but that by no means encompasses all who are militant. <<<

Miles, can you explain what you mean by "militant"? It always makes me think of fire bombing, tire slashing, gun toting, rock throwing, window breaking... etc. I sure wouldn't want to be in support of or participating in anything like that over someones opinion on health care!

Tom

["Mad" Miles]

Tomcat,

Militant Definition | Definition of Militant at Dictionary.com

mil⋅i⋅tant
  /ˈmɪlɪtənt/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [mil-i-tuhnt] Show IPA
Use militant in a Sentence

See images of militant

–adjective

1.	vigorously active and aggressive, esp. in support of a cause: militant reformers.

2.	engaged in warfare; fighting.

–noun

3.	a militant person.

4.	a person engaged in warfare or combat.

---

Origin:
1375–1425; late ME < L mīlitant- (s. of mīlitāns), prp. of mīlitāre to serve as a soldier. See militate, -ant

Related forms:
mil⋅i⋅tan⋅cy, mil⋅i⋅tant⋅ness, noun
mil⋅i⋅tant⋅ly, adverb

Synonyms:
1. belligerent, combative, contentious. See fanatic.

mil·i·tant(mĭl'ĭ-tənt) adj. Fighting or warring. Having a combative character; aggressive, especially in the service of a cause: a militant political activist. n. A fighting, warring, or aggressive person or party. [Middle English, from Old French, from Latin mīlitāns, mīlitant-, present participle of mīlitāre, to serve as a soldier; see militate.] mil'i·tance, mil'i·tan·cy n., mil'i·tant·ly adv.

In the case of the first definition above, in the context of political activism, I mean it in sense number one, in the case of the second definition, in the same context, the same meaning (that I was using) is number two.

Is it possible to be a "soldier" for peace and justice? A question I've asked myself for quite a while. I grew up an Army Brat, the last three out of four of my patrilineal generations graduated from West Point and were career artillery officers, also my maternal grandfather. Mine is the first generation in five not to go that direction (with the exception of one cousin who is currently serving in Iraq to "train the Iraqi Army so we can come home") Prior to the mid-eighteen hundreds my paternal ancestors were English and later American (U.S.) Quakers.

I'm a product of the sixties (graduated high school in 1974) and have been involved on the Left end of things ever since. All I know is that it takes passion to try to make change, and sidelining the most passionate is not a very effective way to build a movement. I've seen overly cautious controlling organizers ("we don't want to be seen as too far outside of the mainstream") do that over and over again. Usually the primary effect is that they alienate themselves from the very people most likely to do, or who are already doing, the work. Two egregious examples, which I'm saving for my book on organizing, leap immediately to mind as I write this.

Are you familiar with the name "Peace Warrior"? I've seen it used here and there. It seems to me that central to the practice of active non-violence, whether non-violent direct action (my preferred strategy) or classic civil disobedience, that not all contestation, not all conflict, is necessarily violent.

Part of the problem here is the trap of binary oppositional thinking. But we do make distinctions in order to understand and clarify meaning, so it's a hard trap to avoid!



Progressive Definition | Definition of Progressive at Dictionary.com


pro·gres·sive
(prə-grěs'ĭv)
adj.

1. Moving forward; advancing.
2. Proceeding in steps; continuing steadily by increments: progressive change.
3. Promoting or favoring progress toward better conditions or new policies, ideas, or methods: a progressive politician; progressive business leadership.
4. Progressive Of or relating to a Progressive Party: the Progressive platform of 1924.
5. Of or relating to progressive education: a progressive school.
6. Increasing in rate as the taxable amount increases: a progressive income tax.
7. Pathology Tending to become more severe or wider in scope: progressive paralysis.
8. Grammar Designating a verb form that expresses an action or condition in progress.

n.

1. A person who actively favors or strives for progress toward better conditions, as in society or government.
2. Progressive A member or supporter of a Progressive Party.
3. Grammar A progressive verb form.

pro·gres'sive·ly adv., pro·gres'sive·ness n.


I've never been a big fan of the word since it was deployed in the early eighties to paper over the negative connotations of: Leftist, Radical, Activist, Socialist, etc..

Also as a student of political philosophy, I've never cared for the teleological assumption behind the term; that change is necessarily good, that the goal for advocates of social and economic justice is to leave the past behind and create something new and unprecedented in order to improve our lot, that somehow within the very process of history is an ever-improving logical tendency. Too simplistic for me since obviously not all change is for the better and I see no evidence for a historical imperative that inherently improves things.

But it is the popular term of art. One of its advantages (and depending on perspective, disadvantages) is that it papers over the distinction between liberal and radical, so it is a unifying, albeit obscurantist, term.

And any harkening back to the Progressive Era, when substantial improvements were made in American (U.S.) society, can't be all bad and it works for the historian in me!

As for people expressing values that they do not adhere to when inconvenient (your bumperstickers in the WF parking lot example), uh... how long have you been around?

Cheers,

"Mad" Miles

[tomcat]

Anything to report Glen?