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  1. TopTop #31
    Ronaldo's Avatar
    Ronaldo
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Please read about your source (naturalnews,com) in Wikipedia:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NaturalNews

    It made me more than a little skeptical of anything that Mike Adam's asserts.

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Shandi: View Post
    Some other points to consider:

    The media continues to ignore the most likely cause of the recent measles outbreak, viral shedding, which occurs after a child is vaccinated:
    https://www.naturalnews.com/048519_vaccines_measles...
    Another fact the media ignores is that CDC reports reveal no deaths from measles in 10 years but more than 100 deaths from the vaccinations:
    https://www.naturalnews.com/048518_measles_vaccines...
    The American Cancer Society is also completely ignoring science. They're telling us food choices play little or no role in reducing and preventing the disease:
    https://www.naturalnews.com/048515_American_Cancer...
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  3. TopTop #32
    Shandi's Avatar
    Shandi
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    This is the first paragraph about Mike Adams and Natural News: Do any Wacco members believe any of these claims?

    NaturalNews (formerly Newstarget) is a website founded and operated by Mike Adams.[2] It is based in Cedar Creek, Texas.[3]
    It is dedicated to the sale of various dietary supplements, promotion of alternative medicine, (often controversial) nutrition claims,[4] and various conspiracy theories,[5] such as "chemtrails",[6] the purported dangers of fluoride in drinking water[7] (as well as those of monosodium glutamate[8] and aspartame), and purported health problems caused by "toxic" ingredients in vaccines,[4] including the now-discredited link to autism.[9]

    Characterized as a "conspiracy-minded alternative medicine website", NaturalNews has approximately 7 million unique visitors per month.[10]

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Ronaldo: View Post
    Please read about your source (naturalnews,com) in Wikipedia:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NaturalNews

    It made me more than a little skeptical of anything that Mike Adam's asserts.
    Last edited by Barry; 02-07-2015 at 02:51 PM.
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  5. TopTop #33
    Valley Oak's Avatar
    Valley Oak
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    .
    The Young Turks Network, 2.5.2015

    You Won’t Believe Where Anti-Vaxxers Get Their Information



    “As the vaccination wars continue to escalate, a new study suggests that trusted doctors and experts may be no match for the loud and often inaccurate wisdom of Internet commenters.

    In a first-of-its kind experiment, researchers at Washington State University have shown that people tend to be persuaded less by credible pro- and anti-vaccination information published online than by individual users who hang around in comments threads on the topic kicking up dust.

    The findings, which will appear in an upcoming Journal of Advertising, underscore the powerful influence of information disseminated by word of mouth. Moreover, they offer a striking insight into the ability of the anti-vaccination movement to flourish despite mounting outrage and overwhelming scientific evidence that supports vaccination.”

    Read More Here: https://www.vocativ.com/culture/society/vaccination-debate/

    John Iadarola (https://www.twitter.com/jiadarola), Dave Rubin (https://www.twitter.com/rubinreport) and Hannah Cranston (https://twitter.com/hannahcranston_) of The Young Turks discuss.
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  7. TopTop #34
    rossmen
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    the interesting thing about wakefield is not that he was discredited. he was a small part of questioning mercury in early childhood vaccination. it took years of parent pushback to get the mercury out. the cdc et al was scared shitless that autism rates would drop with reformulated vaccines. this would have led to huge public health liability lawsuits.

    since the rates didn't drop, though they did stabilize, industrialized medicine had been crowing told you so and touting wakefield as the whipping boy for antivaccers. thank the parents that early childhood vaccines are safer! we are enculturated to think its an us vs them world. but perhaps a subject as complicated as human health takes all to sort through the options offered by medical science.
    Last edited by Barry; 02-07-2015 at 02:55 PM.
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  8. TopTop #35
    rossmen
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    comparing public debates about climate, vaccination, and also fluoridation is silly. the use of science can be both beneficial and a mistake. in evaluating scientific claims it is very important to follow the money, because money influences science.

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by podfish: View Post
    so this does kind of come down to who you find more believable as a source: the big-pharma shills at the American Cancer Society, relying on the CDC and major university researchers, or the reporters at Natural News and their representation of the same studies. "Completely ignoring science" is actually applied to the wrong target; the NN reporter completely misunderstands science. Even in their own article, they acknowledge that the sin of the ACS is that they think the "evidence regarding these factors [is] 'unclear.' " That's indicative to me that they don't have studies that are strong enough to substantiate that claim as fact.

    I think it's funny that critics of 'big science' take opposite views on this depending on the issue. Those who don't believe in climate change think the scientific community leaps to unsubstantiated conclusions, while the anti-vaxers article thinks they're unwilling to reach conclusions on what they're claiming (and to me, credibly) is too weak evidence to support such conclusions.
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  10. TopTop #36
    sharingwisdom's Avatar
    sharingwisdom
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    To hold Snopes as a good source for unbiased medical information is quite interesting. I'm glad I question just like you do. Even the Mikkelsons admit that Snopes is only as reliable as the sources it cites, and they invite readers to look for the truth themselves. Their sources include mainly the CDC's info; and what was said on Snopes, in the statement by the CDC ,wasn’t true of Dr. Hooker’s intention or him retracting it. The removal of CDC statements happen quit often when the results show things the corporate entities don't want us to know.

    This Rubella study below had also been removed...
    https://childhealthsafety.wordpress....C2%A0vaccines/
    “… rubella (congenital rubella syndrome) is one of the few proven causes of autism.Walter A. Orenstein, M.D. US as Assistant Surgeon General,Director National Immunization Program in a letter to the UK’s Chief Medical Officer 15 February 2002...rubellavirus is one of the few known causes of autism.” US Center for Disease Control.
    “FAQs (frequentlyasked questions) about MMR Vaccine & Autism” [ED 8/Apr/12: This is the web archive of the CDC page – you will need to search in or scrolldown the page to see the text. As papers cited on the original page by the CDC as evidence for no link with the vaccine have been steadily discredited, it seems the CDC has decided to remove the page and it seems someone has been deleting the archived versions of the page from the web archive too].rubella can cause autismThe Pediatrician’sRole in the Diagnosis and Management of Autistic Spectrum Disorder in Children – PEDIATRICS Vol. 107 No. 5 May 2001

    And the CDC removed this page where it had been said that 98 million Americans received the polio vaccine that was contaminated with SV40 simian monkey virus in the 50's and 60's. https://www.whydontyoutrythis.com/20...cer-virus.html

    The Courts have already said that vaccines cause autism which also supports Wakefield claims (if you want to bring him up again, Podfish… only discredited by the intention false reporting of Brian Deer, corporate-hired journalist, who also lied about families with vaccine injured children).
    https://healthimpactnews.com/2013/ne...-autism-again/
    https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/83-cases-of-autism-associated-with-childhood-vaccine-injury-compensated-in-federal-vaccine-court-121570673.html

    Here's an independent study from Department of Pediatric Rehabilitation Medical University of Białystok, Poland https://www.rescuepost.com/files/pro...accination.pdf

    And when you got your study from PubMed, I found these...A positive association found between autism prevalence and childhood vaccination uptake across the U.S. population.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21623535
    Abnormal measles-mumps-rubella antibodies and CNS autoimmunity in children with autism. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12145534

    And here's 22 studies that show vaccines cause autism which connects to the additives and adjuncts https://www.pakalertpress.com/2013/0...-cause-autism/

    NOTE: Studies with unvaccinated control groups have never been done with humans, but have with animals. And the CDC refuses to do a study on the health outcomes between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations. I wonder why. This is an amazing collection of studies (particularly if you have pets) in what health issues arise from the vaccine tests that even Merck has stated. https://www.dogsadversereactions.com...ineDamage.html

    When you make your comments, in placing those who are doing research that disagree with yours into your defined box/es, I find the tactics you use to stop dissent similar as to what censored media uses on whistleblowers and anyone who would dare question authority. Authority dictates is way different than true conscious leaders in their fields. Defining and categorizing those who won't give up their personal power to your Authority Gods, by calling it Inepticism, just limits the conversation that can occur at a mature emotional level...which is maybe your goal...to limit dissent. It would have been fine showing the studies you researched, but when you added your other post, it became more than obvious that your openness was not aligned there at all...because when one wants to prove a point rather than educate, that attitude, with someone calling it 'righteousness' in another post, becomes the predominant energy rather than true available exchange of information. I call these dissenters, these whistleblowers, courageous...150 scientists and doctors who are risking their careers to stand up to those govermental 'authorities' about vaccines.https://www.greatergoodmovie.org/new...bout-vaccines/

    And when people stop putting others, who care about humanities welfare and freedoms, into political parties, we might have a flow of information that is independent of limitation or censorship of the real facts. That is what the Occupy movement was about…open up the differences and find a common ground. This is how dialogues in world peace can flourish. Just because a person is in a particular political party doesn't make me want to throw out the baby-with-the bathwater when it comes to information that supports those who risk their livelihood to bring forth truth.

    I wonder Scott, or podfish or Edward or Dottie, if you have children. I wonder if you have seen vaccine-injured children or children who have died from vaccine injury. . https://vaccineimpact.com/2015/young...r-mmr-vaccine/ My grandson gets febrile seizures that occurred after vaccinations. My friends' son is autistic from vaccine injury. My other friend’s grandchild became autistic after vaccines. My acupuncturist has many patients who bring in their autistic children due to vaccine injury. And I wonder if you have heard the stories of what the parents have gone through with their doctors to prove their children are vaccine injured which many can’t, but they know, they were there. I wonder if you have seen how the child protection agency is now accusing parents of abusing their new babies due to vaccine injuries (because they have swollen, encephalitic heads and bloated bodies), and is 'kidnapping' children from loving families that make choices different than the 'authorities'...like homeschooling or breastfeeding. Did you know that your 'authorities' are telling lactating mothers they should stop nursing to boost their child's vaccine immunity? Nature's medicine minimized to support corporate interests. Wow! https://vaxtruth.org/2012/01/the-cdc...ness-not-true/ How many other false concepts are going to be accepted due to those gullible to corporate interests?

    Dr. Boyd Haley, Professor and former chair, Dept of Chemistry, University of Kentucky, says that, “A single vaccine given to a 6 lb. newborn is equivalent to giving a 180 lb. adult 30 vaccinations on the same day.” Are you or the rest that think these vaccinations are so safe, willing to take 30 vaccinations in one day soon? And he puts himself and his career on the line by being a very vocal whistleblower which then had the FDA going after him because he knows how to chelate the toxins out of the body. Typical, just so typical! Another doctor and scientist acquaintance had this happen to them as well.

    Children today receive as many as 49 doses of 14 vaccines before they reach age six, which is roughly 12 times higher than the number of vaccines administered to children back in 1940. With more than 220 new vaccines in the developmental pipeline for children and adults...and no end in sight...the question you must ask yourself is 'ARE YOU CERTAIN you will be 100% comfortable with vaccines that are added to the mandated list in the future?'

    I truly doubt that any critical thinker would ever sign off on the sight-unseen vaccine schedule of the future. And yet that's what you're doing when you and your group condemn the people who are speaking about this...with all of our rights to refuse what we have researched to be harmful. YOU have the right to refuse, should you ever choose to use it, because the very "anti-vaccine" people you mock have been standing up to the 'authorities', researching, being courageous. Once we enter the slippery slope of removing an individual's right to refuse medical procedures that carry a risk of injury or death, once we remove an individual's right to speak for him/herself and his/her children, we open ourselves up to an insidious new era, where other drugs and other procedures can be mandated.

    For those who are really interested, we can start to change this trend by reversing the law that grants vaccine manufacturers total immunity from vaccine injury lawsuits. https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/pet...-kind/HW1B3YKz Because as it stands, you can't sue a vaccine manufacturer if your child is injured or killed by a vaccine, [though Merck, Bayer, Ely Lily etc can be sued for other drug violations] even in cases where they could've made a safer vaccine and chose not to (which I know a once-head CEO of a vaccine company who was thrown off his own board for refusing to add the corporation-demanded adjuncts and additives) or when they failed to recall a contaminated lot# in a timely manner. Think about that. You can't sue the manufacturer. That immunity from liability, that total lack of accountability raises the status of the vaccine corporations to that "Godly" level that some of you are against.

    As having vaccine-injuries myself from childhood, which I'm in the midst of detoxing by alternative methods for the last few years, I'm complete on this topic with all of you. Whatever other words you need to write, unless you want to take all those vaccines in one day, I'm sure your 'rally' group will enjoy your comments.

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Scott McKeown: View Post
    The entire thing with Dr. Hooker and Dr. Thompson is fraudulent as detailed here in Snopes.com: https://www.snopes.com/medical/disea...stleblower.asp
    ....
    Last edited by Barry; 02-07-2015 at 03:04 PM.
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  12. TopTop #37
    Shandi's Avatar
    Shandi
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Thank you for sharing your own heartbreaking experiences, in addition to the in depth research you've provided. I did come across a list of vaccine related lawsuits, and will try to post some of them. The information is extensive, and most people won't take the time to read it.

    More and more, corporations are being protected for the physical, mental, and emotional harm they cause, with profit as the bottom line. Buying people off is common, and especially in the area of BigPharma, where there's plenty to share with supporters.


    Quote Posted in reply to the post by sharingwisdom: View Post
    To hold Snopes as a good source for unbiased medical information is quite interesting. ...
    Last edited by Barry; 02-07-2015 at 03:06 PM.
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  13. TopTop #38
    Barry's Avatar
    Barry
    Founder & Moderator

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Here's a great video of Bill Maher discussing vaccinations. I particularly appreciated Marianne Williamson's remarks:

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  15. TopTop #39
    Sasha Monique's Avatar
    Sasha Monique
    Supporting Member

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Thanks for posting.

    I wish someone would have asked, "Who does the studies that proves vaccines are safe?" or probed about how corporate interest could sway those studies. I was disappointed that they were all so confident of the safety of the measles vaccine without addressing the concerns being raised right now, like the ones that Sharing Wisdom mentioned in detail. And, it is my understanding that GMOs are in vaccines.


    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Barry: View Post
    Here's a great video of Bill Maher discussing vaccinations. I particularly appreciated Marianne Williamson's remarks...
    Last edited by Barry; 02-08-2015 at 02:40 PM.
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  17. TopTop #40
    dave1021's Avatar
    dave1021
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    I believe the formal word for what "Natural News" is spouting is "bullshit".

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Shandi: View Post
    This is the first paragraph about Mike Adams and Natural News: Do any Wacco members believe any of these claims?....
    Last edited by Barry; 02-08-2015 at 02:27 PM.
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  19. TopTop #41
    Shandi's Avatar
    Shandi
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Dave, does this mean you believe that these things are beneficial? Flouride, aspartame, monsodium glutamate, etc. and these things are harmful? dietary supplements, alternative medicine ....and that conspiracy theories, chemtrails are BS?

    Just wondering if you think it's all BS or just some of it. Your opinion is as valid as anyone's.


    It is dedicated to the sale of various dietary supplements, promotion of alternative medicine, (often controversial) nutrition claims,[4] and various conspiracy theories,[5] such as "chemtrails",[6] the purported dangers of fluoride in drinking water[7] (as well as those of monosodium glutamate[8] and aspartame), and purported health problems caused by "toxic" ingredients in vaccines,[4] including the now-discredited link to autism.[9]

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by dave1021: View Post
    I believe the formal word for what "Natural News" is spouting is "bullshit".
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  20. TopTop #42
    dave1021's Avatar
    dave1021
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    If it comes from "Natural News," I'll look for other sources. Just like I do with ads from "Whole Foods".

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Shandi: View Post

    Just wondering if you think [Natural News is] all BS or just some of it. Your opinion is as valid as anyone's.
    ...
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  22. TopTop #43

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    (I have restored my greatly moderator interfered with post which reduced this list to 1 not of my choice, and mischaracterized the aggregate point I was making.)

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by sharingwisdom: View Post
    ...
    sharingwisdom wrote:
    ...This Rubella study below had also been removed...
    ..rubellavirus is one of the few known causes of autism. US Center for Disease Control,,,.
    ..98 million Americans received the polio vaccine that was contaminated with SV40 simian monkey virus...
    ...The Courts have already said that vaccines cause autism which also supports Wakefield claims...
    ...Brian Deer, corporate-hired journalist, who also lied about families with vaccine injured children...
    ..here's 22 studies that show vaccines cause autism which connects to the additives and adjuncts,,,
    ..NOTE: Studies with unvaccinated control groups have never been done with humans...
    ..CDC refuses to do a study on the health outcomes between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations...
    ..150 scientists and doctors who are risking their careers to stand up to those govermental 'authorities'....
    ...A single vaccine given to a 6 lb. newborn is equivalent to giving a 180 lb. adult 30 on the same day.
    ..you can't sue a vaccine manufacturer if your child is injured or killed by a vaccine, [Merck, Bayer, Ely Lily...

    ...
    I have the greatest respect for your standing for what you know regardless of any ridicule SharingWisdom. But the indignant slammed door responses as if it's a threat rather than an offer of help really heavies my heart. The big picture your posts paint overflowing with crucial questions, examples and sources that add up to one of the biggest health warnings this lifetime is instead being attacked without any real understanding like it's too dangerous to look. What bigger example of ineptitude? And we haven't even dared bring up the other agendas and ramifications including level of bio-technological advancement factor doubtlessly underlying at the deeper levels.

    The biggest hypocrisy to me is this gigantic fear being propagated. What do the people who vaccinate have to fear if they are so protected?

    How about we move on and discuss instead how to eliminate the toxins and curtail the damage done from childhood vaccines before we could take control. Do you have any info on 1950/60/70's specific toxins and especially effects that appear later in life? What are the prominent effects? What do you do to cleanse, especially the pineal? I've read many suggestions, not really sure what is effective and feel a need to be as proactive as I can now.

    The biggest thanks.
    Last edited by Alex; 02-09-2015 at 10:46 AM.
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  24. TopTop #44
    Valley Oak's Avatar
    Valley Oak
     

    I’m Autistic And It’s A Lot Better Than Measles

    I’m Autistic, And Believe Me, It’s A Lot Better Than Measles

    Vaccines don’t cause autism. But even if they did, is being like me really a fate worse than death?

    The autistic brain is not particularly good at understanding irony, and yet most people I’ve met on the autism spectrum have, over time, developed a pretty strong grasp of the concept. Many of us have even managed to teach ourselves how to wield it. I’ve begun to suspect that this is due to our constant hands-on experience.

    Having an autism spectrum disorder in an ableist world means that you’re constantly exposed to cruel irony. Most frequently, this comes in the form of neurotypical (i.e. non-autistic) people who tell you, incorrectly, that you can’t or don’t feel empathy like them, and then stubbornly refuse to care about your feelings when they claim that you’re lost, that you’re a burden, and that your life is a constant source of misery for you and everyone who loves you. There’s also my current favorite: parents who are willing to put the lives of countless human beings at risk because they’re so afraid that the mercury fairy will gives their kids a tragic case of autism if they vaccinate. Gotta protect the kids from not being able to feel empathy — who cares whether other children live or die?

    No matter what other lofty ideas of toxins and vaccine-related injury anti-vaxxers try to float around in their defense, that’s really what all of this is about: we’re facing a massive public health crisis because a disturbing number of people believe that autism is worse than illness or death. My neurology is the boogeyman behind a completely preventable plague in the making.

    Please click here to read remaining article
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  26. TopTop #45
    Scott McKeown's Avatar
    Scott McKeown
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by sharingwisdom: View Post
    To hold Snopes as a good source for unbiased medical information is quite interesting.

    The Courts have already said that vaccines cause autism which also supports Wakefield claims (if you want to bring him up again, Podfish… only discredited by the intention false reporting of Brian Deer, corporate-hired journalist, who also lied about families with vaccine injured children).
    Once again, I am not responding to the overall issue of vaccination. I too can respect the skepticism to give a large battery of vaccine shots to one-year-olds. What I am responding to is the contention that science has proven a link between vaccination and autism and that there has been no science discrediting the link between vaccination and autism. Much of this post was about vaccination in general and I will just respond to the autism-vaccination link.

    Where to begin...

    First of all, most serious investigative reporters publish their stories in major news outlets, which by their very definition are "corporate". Even non-profits (such as Mother Jones, etc.) are technically "corporations". Dismissing all professional journalists who publish in publications owned by companies fundamentally leaves only amateurs as sources to be trusted.

    I invite everyone to read some of Brian Deer's reporting (3rd in a series) here on his own blog:

    https://briandeer.com/mmr/lancet-summary.htm

    And yes, he is a professional journalist. Here is from Brian Deer's Wikipedia page:

    One of Deer's early investigations caused uproar in the drug industry when in 1986 he revealed that research into the safety of the contraceptive pill was fabricated at Deakin University, Australia, by scientist Professor Michael Briggs, employed by the German company Schering AG.[3] In 1994, his investigation of The Wellcome Trust led to the withdrawal in the UK of a blockbuster antibiotic, Septrin, Bactrim, and the sale of the trust's pharmaceutical subsidiary Wellcome Foundation.[4] In 2005, the withdrawal of the painkiller Vioxx was followed by an investigation by Deer into the people responsible for the drug's introduction.[5] In 2008, a celebrity psychiatrist, Raj Persaud, was suspended from practising medicine and resigned his academic position after being found guilty of plagiarism following a Deer investigation.[6][7] Deer's documentary "The drug trial that went wrong",[8] nominated for a Royal Television Society journalism award, investigated the experimental monoclonal antibody TGN1412.

    Regarding "studies", just because something is written and labeled as a "study" does not give it equal weight to all other studies. And just because some institution, such as a university, may post a study somewhere on one of their websites doesn't mean the institution is endorsing the conclusion. This is an understanding that often seems severely lacking on Wacco. Going through the list of "studies" linking vaccination to autism posted here I could find nothing substantial.

    Here is a review of the entire list related to vaccination and autism. First of all, many of the "studies" were not about vaccination at all but about environmental mercury which is methylmurcery and an entirely different thing than ethylmurcury that was used in vaccines.

    The first link supposedly proves government compensation for autism caused by vaccination, and the quote given on the site (said by someone from the US Health Services and Resources Administration) was this:

    "We have compensated cases in which children exhibited an encephalopathy, or general brain disease. Encephalopathy may be accompanied by a medical progression of an array of symptoms including autistic behavior, autism, or seizures.

    Scary, huh? However, I actually followed the link to the source and here is the actual full unedited quote:

    "The government has never compensated, nor has it ever been ordered to compensate, any case based on a determination that autism was actually caused by vaccines. We have compensated cases in which children exhibited an encephalopathy, or general brain disease. Encephalopathy may be accompanied by a medical progression of an array of symptoms including autistic behavior, autism, or seizures.

    Some children who have been compensated for vaccine injuries may have shown signs of autism before the decision to compensate, or may ultimately end up with autism or autistic symptoms, but we do not track cases on this basis.
    "

    A bit different than the scare-mongering.

    With the second link I couldn't find anything supporting a linkage between autism and vaccination, but rather quite a lot saying the opposite.

    The third link seems broken. But the title of the link does not include anything about vaccination so I can't tell if it has anything to do with vaccination or not.

    Fourth link has nothing to do with autism.

    The fifth link to "Health Impact News" supposedly proves "the courts have already said that vaccines cause autism" but give no source links that aren't broken to back that claim up.

    The sixth link supposedly proves the same thing but it's all about the exact quote from HSRA posted above. Totally deceiving.

    The seventh link is the Polish review report that deals mostly with non-autism related risks and is all about thiomerosal that was discontinued in vaccines in the late 90's and is not even part of the infomous Wakefield fraud. The study cited regarding autism in the report was by Mark Geier.

    Here is from Mark Geier's Wikipedia entry:

    Mark R. Geier (born 1948, Washington, D.C.) is a self-employed American physician and controversial professional witness who has testified in more than 90 cases regarding allegations of injury or illness caused by vaccines.[2][3] Since 2011, Geier's medical license has been suspended or revoked in every state in which he was licensed, over concerns about his autism treatments, and his misrepresentation of his credentials to the Maryland Board of Health (he falsely claimed to be a board-certified geneticist and epidemiologist).[4]
    Geier and his son, David Geier, are frequently cited by proponents of the claim that vaccines cause autism. Geier's credibility as an expert witness has been questioned in 10 court cases.[5] In 2003, a judge ruled that Geier presented himself as an expert witness in "areas for which he has no training, expertise and experience."[2] In other cases in which Geier has testified, judges have labeled his testimony "intellectually dishonest," "not reliable" and "wholly unqualified."[2] Another judge wrote that Geier "may be clever, but he is not credible."[6]

    It gets worse on his page.

    The eight link is a "study" by DeLong. All I can say is here are a few of the many critiques about DeLong. Read them for yourself:
    Link nine is a report by VK Singh. Here is from Singh's Wikipedia page:

    Singh's findings on autism have been criticized by other scientists as flawed, unreproducible, or dubious. Mary Ramsay of the Health Protection Agency wrote that the evidence for the "specific" MMR-type antibody Singh claims to have detected was "not credible."[10] Paul Offit wrote in Autism's False Prophets that "...a closer look at Singh's science revealed two critical flaws: children with autism didn't have evidence of nerve cell damage, and, according to measles experts, the test that Singh had used to detect measles antibodies didn't actually detect them."[11] A 2006 review of literature on vaccines and autism found that Singh's results "have been called into question due to issues of cross-contamination, as well as the use of unsubstantiated and un-validated biochemical techniques", citing a report by the World Health Organization,[12] and a number of other studies have failed to find a difference in immune response to the measles virus between autistic and neurotypical children.[13][14][15][16] Peter Lachmann, the president of the Academy of Medical Sciences, United Kingdom, stated: "Singh's work in these papers is not particularly reproducible or good... There are many diseases which show raised antibodies to measles, for example chronic active hepatitis or multiple sclerosis, yet there is nothing to associate these with MMR. There is no persuasive evidence that autism is caused by autoimmunity."[17]

    Lasty, link 10 is supposedly a list of 22 studies that show vaccines cause autism. I looked at each one of these. Many are about either vaccination and other issue, or autism linked with high levels of environmental mercury not related to vaccination. Of the "studies" linking autism to vaccination in this "list", Here are some rebuttals to listed "study" # 1:

    Study # 2 concludes:

    "Clearly, we cannot draw definite conclusions regarding the link be-ween Al adjuvants and autism based on an ecological study such asthe present one and hence the validity of our results remains to be confirmed."

    And here is one critique of the study:

    https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2...d-by-the-decr/
    In particular, note:the authors are plotting ASD incidence in each year (1991-2008) against total aluminium content for the pediatric schedule *in that year*. Not (as you might expect) the aluminium exposure for the ASD cases themselves, according to the pediatric schedules of 6 to 21 years previously, but no, that same year.In effect they are looking for a correlation between the number of people who developed ASD decades earlier, and the number of vaccinations given to other children, in the current year. This is an interesting model of causality!

    Study # 3. DeLong again.

    I could go on with this list of junk science. I know this may be "cheating" by invoking a blog myself, but If interested in getting critiques on all of these so-called "studies" here is a good site: https://angryautie.wordpress.com/201...e-autism-myth/

    My original question remains:

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Scott McKeown: View Post
    Can you cite one respected institution, Government agency or NGO, university, medical institution, or hospital, or any professional journal from any country that supports a link between vaccination and autism? Or for that matter, any gold-standard, peer reviewed study?
    Scott
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  28. TopTop #46
    Aldo El Hefe
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by dave1021: View Post
    If it comes from "Natural News," I'll look for other sources. Just like I do with ads from "Whole Foods".
    Hi Dave, I have to agree with you partially about Natural News, there is a lot of pure BS there lately, but I don't think that it is all BS.

    NN does have some very informative and good articles about food and nutrition, and some of the commenters are knowledgeable and helpful too.

    I liked NN much better a few years ago but I think that their slant has changed for the worse, especially about technical subjects. Most of the authors at NN know absolutely nothing about anything technical, they just parrot other amateur science fiction articles, amateur video producers and the "microwave activists" that think that all radio is microwave. It's kind of funny to read their copying of other propaganda/science fiction articles that were written over 6 years ago, they act like this is breaking news hoping that people will have forgotten all the BS that has long since been debunked many years ago.

    Their slant on the ACA is hilarious, they have a Libertarian view that all healthcare corporations are god-like, and they claim that these corporations are now run by the government. They don't understand that all Obamacare is, is private-for-profit healthcare insurance. Even people in California now who earn under $16,116 per year are eligible for Medi-Cal under the new Obamacare guidelines. And guess what, all people who apply for Medi-Cal are now automatically enrolled with a private insurance company called "Partnership HealthPlan of California Inc. The goal of the ACA was to get everyone enrolled in some sort of private healthcare insurance plan, to make sure that there would never be any form of government run medical care delivery system except the VA.

    I still look at NN, and I do read some of their articles about vaccines. Some seem to make sense, and I do believe most of what they write on the subject. I am an "anti-vaxer" and I have never had a flue shot. When my doctor asks if I want a flu shot, I simply say "no thank you", I don't need that, and nor do I need any blood tests or colonoscopies either. Then I add that I have never had the flu, or been to an emergency room in my life.

    A story that cracked me up was that of the man in Tiburon who said that he doesn't want his child vaccinated for various reasons due to some other allopathic medical treatments that doctors have his son on. So he wants the Reed School District to forbid all children like his who are unvaccinated to attend the school that his unvaccinated child goes too, but he wants an exemption for his kid ! To me, that seems kind of selfish on his part, vaccinations should be a choice that parents and even kids should be able to decide on. Vaccines or any other kind of injections , medical tests or procedures are very intimate and personal, and should never be mandated.
    Last edited by Barry; 02-09-2015 at 01:17 PM.
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  30. TopTop #47
    AllorrahBe
    Guest

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Well, I AM no expert on anything much, but I have now listened to many of the doctors and others who have really done the research and risked the retaliation we know many thought leaders have suffered for going against the mainstream. I am now convinced the real story is coming out now and these vaccines will soon be a thing of the past. I AM thanking God that I did not get many of the shots myself, but suspect an autoimmune component in my own health as a result of the early childhood vaccines. I remember lining up to get the polio sugar cube and being grateful they had it because my older brother was actually hospitalized and made to be in an iron lung for some time. Of course, for me, tonsillitis followed, pneumonia, chicken pox (apparently, because I had Shingles last year), mumps, measles, swollen glands, all sorts of illness. I decided long ago not to get shots and not to take medicines for these illnesses; we did not have Nyquil and Dayquil and all the stuff on the shelves today. We lived far from medical attention and rarely saw a doctor. My brother did recover from alleged polio and seemed relatively healthy up through his teen years, while I was not so fortunate. The one time I weakened and allowed a doctor to give me a penicillin shot, I had a terrifying reaction much worse than the problem which caused me to get the shot. So, no more shots for me! I did have to take some antiviral and steroid meds for the Shingles last year, but I believe prayer stopped it from spreading because it came and went in five days and there was no itching or pain.

    For people who have not had adverse reactions to drugs and these horrors have not invaded their personal lives, I say: Good for you! But for those who have had similar experiences to mine and those described by these many doctors and experts, I say: I AM personally grieved to realize the fraud and deception we have all experienced and I pray for ways we can put an end to this scandal once and for all.
    Rev. BE
    Last edited by Barry; 02-09-2015 at 12:20 PM.
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  32. TopTop #48
    AllorrahBe
    Guest

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    I suspect you did not bother to click those links and listen to what those people discovered when they did the research... I clicked those links and listened and it broke my heart to realize they are not conspiracy theorists; they are serious researchers, scientists, doctors, and others who have the time, wherewithall and courage to press on in the sincere attempt to discover the truth about vaccinations and all the related matters. And we've really just been writing about the MMR vaccinations, but so much fraud and deception has been revealed that I find it almost impossible to comprehend how anybody today still thinks vaccinations are a good thing!
    Rev. BE

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Scott McKeown: View Post
    ... What I was objecting to was the claim by the blogger that vaccination is linked to autism which so far isn't supported by any solid evidence or science (as no linkage has been supported by solid science) and was long ago discredited by virtually every credible institution and professional working in the field throughout the world.

    Scott
    Last edited by Barry; 02-09-2015 at 12:22 PM.
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  34. TopTop #49
    podfish's Avatar
    podfish
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by AllorrahBe: View Post
    I suspect you did not bother to click those links and listen to what those people discovered when they did the research... I clicked those links and listened and it broke my heart to realize they are not conspiracy theorists; they are serious researchers, scientists, doctors, and others
    Scott clicked a lot more links than I have patience for, and I applaud him for that.

    Some of the links I did click were heavy on what seems to have appealed to you: personal testimonials and anecdotes, or mini-documentary style editorials. This kind of thing is compelling and, because they aren't obvious waccos in either sense of the word, because they're 'serious' people, does raise questions. But that's not where the trail ends. Often the people being interviewed aren't in control of the way their interviews are edited or the context they appear in. I know how that works, I've been in that position myself. Most of the sites hosting this information are full of content that is advocacy, not data. Which is fine if you're looking for context, but not fine if you're trying to evaluate data so you can make a rational conclusion. Scott's post analyzed a lot of those links and made specific comments about the credibility of the evidence there.

    Just to give one example: our 'whistleblower' CDC doctor has issued this (maybe under duress at gunpoint, I can't tell):
    Quote "I want to be absolutely clear that I believe vaccines have saved and continue to save countless lives. I would never suggest that any parent avoid vaccinating children of any race. Vaccines prevent serious diseases, and the risks associated with their administration are vastly outweighed by their individual and societal benefits." And about his treatment by the CDC, Dr. Thompson went on to declare: "My colleagues and supervisors at the CDC have been entirely professional since this matter became public. In fact, I received a performance-based award after this story came out. I have experienced no pressure or retaliation and certainly was not escorted from the building, as some have stated."
    but i'll append my mandatory disclaimer - none of the above is expected to change anyone's mind, because it's pretty apparent we've all seen more than we care to about "evidence" that seems to convince those on the opposite side of this debate.
    Last edited by podfish; 02-09-2015 at 11:09 AM. Reason: we (hopefully) have only one mind each (at best)
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  36. TopTop #50
    theindependenteye's Avatar
    theindependenteye
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by AllorrahBe: View Post
    ... My brother did recover from alleged polio and seemed relatively healthy up through his teen years, while I was not so fortunate. ...
    "alleged polio" ?????????????????????????????????????????
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  38. TopTop #51
    Ronaldo's Avatar
    Ronaldo
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Hypothetically speaking since smallpox has been eradicated, would the same folks who oppose vaccinations also oppose the vaccination of their children and themselves were this virulent disease still extant?
    After all measles does kill, remember Charles Hamilton died from it only two weeks after he married Scarlett O'Hara!
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  40. TopTop #52

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Ronaldo: View Post
    Hypothetically speaking since smallpox has been eradicated, would the same folks who oppose vaccinations also oppose the vaccination of their children and themselves were this virulent disease still extant?
    After all measles does kill, remember Charles Hamilton died from it only two weeks after he married Scarlett O'Hara!
    What more than repeating something you've heard and believed all your life do you really know about smallpox... and it's primary decline around the world in relationship to other factors besides vaccine? Same for polio. There was no hysteria surrounding the past statistics that are still findable. I'll give you hint, use the word myth in your search.

    Another point about measles that I remember being true in my childhood is that pre-MMR vaccine the medical establishment had long viewed it as bad if you didn't get this relatively mild, short lived world-common ailment in childhood as excellent for your lifetime natural immunity.

    If you're really willing to look, I suggest you focus on independent studies concerning the many immediate issues and lifelong ramifications surrounding the factors of injecting any of these live, dead and toxic vaccine ingredients directly into the amazingly strong and sterile bloodstream you were born with.
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  42. TopTop #53
    podfish's Avatar
    podfish
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)

    Quote Posted in reply to the post by Alex: View Post
    ... the amazingly strong and sterile bloodstream you were born with.
    ?? can't resist commenting on how Sterling Haydenish that sounds...
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  43. TopTop #54
    podfish's Avatar
    podfish
     

    Re: The Onion totally nails it again (Vaccinations)


    and one more perspective on how people's ideas develop on the web
    https://arstechnica.com/science/2015...-real-experts/
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